Linux

[Beekeeper]

I can build them , and repair them ,and operate them (sometimes) but am a complete dummy when it comes to new software.

Have been considering putting linux on an older computer, partially as a learning experience, and partially because I'm sick of windows and all of its problems.
I am told linux doesn't have the problems windows has .
The only thing I'm unsure of is all the bad publisity linux has gotten concerning drivers for diferent hardware adn the learning curve to use it.

Does anyone have any knowledge about linux that will help me decide, IE: which one ,what version , cost ,availability.

Would appreciate any ones help.
Know it has nothing to do with Cast boolits but thought there would be enough knowledge here that someone would have the answers.



Thanks,

Jim

[Bill*]

I'm sure someone will speak up shortly to help. I, for one, still think linux is a character from the "Peanuts" comic strip :veryconfu

[Ricochet]

Can't help you there, but the Mac OS X I use at home is a shell running on top of BSD Unix. If you like digging down into the Unix commands and utilities, you can do that to your heart's content through the Terminal.

[c3d4b2]

I think you can load linux on a computer and still have the microsoft operating system.

You might try this link

http://linux.about.com/

[c3d4b2]

I think I found a link for the windows ap

http://linux.about.com/b/2008/04/29/wubi-install-ubuntu-linux-like-a-windows-application.htm

[jhrosier]

...
Does anyone have any knowledge about linux that will help me decide, IE: which one ,what version , cost ,availability.
...

Jim,
There are several versions of Linux available as a "live cd".

If your computer can be configured to boot from the CD instead of the hard drive (most can), you can try the Linux without permanently installing it. If it works to your satisfaction, then you can install by clicking an icon on the desktop.
If you don't like it, throw away the cd and reboot to Windows.

There are many but not all versions of Linux avalable as a live cd.

Mepis worked well for me on several PCs and found all of my hardware and networks without any help from me.
Mepis, as most other versions of Linux is available as a free download.
Don't even think of downloading the nearly 700MB iso with dial-up, it will take days. If you don't have broadband connection, most versions of Linux can be purchased for short money already burned to a cd.
You will need a program that can burn an ISO image to a cd to create a bootable cd.

If you can't get what you need, PM me and I will try to help.


Jack

[jhrosier]

I think I found a link for the windows ap

Read the user review, he trashed his windows installation.

Dual booting scares the snot out of me.
When it doesn't work, you loose everything.

Jack

[RayinNH]

The various Linux magazines on the rack at your favorite store usually include a CD for Linux...Ray

[454PB]

I've been playing around with Ubuntu. It's a pretty slick OS, but takes some time to learn. Be careful if you install it dual boot.......I screwed up while re-partitioning for that purpose and wiped my entire hard drive.

In a way, it was a good learning experience, I had never set up a bare hard drive before....at least I learned how to do that and it only took about 6 hours.

http://www.ubuntu.com/

[halfslow]

After 10 years managing a windows server shop and getting into the administration a bit, I retired.
Now I am loading Ubuntu onto a second computer so I can come up to speed before wiping my Vista machine.

These sites ought to help:
http://freeengineer.org/learnUNIXin10minutes.html
http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-roadmap.html

Since all current linux distributions use a gui interface, admin is fairly easy.
I think Ubuntu is about the easiest to start with. It auto-configures itself upon install, and is very easy to keep patched and updated.

If you want to try one of the live cd's, go ahead. Knoppix has a very good one and is user friendly.

But quite frankly, either load it on a machine and spend some time learning it's quirks, or stay with microsoft. The live cd's are quite a bit slower than a clean install, and it does take some effort to make the transition from years of experience with the windows way to a real operating system.

[badgeredd]

I can build them , and repair them ,and operate them (sometimes) but am a complete dummy when it comes to new software.

Have been considering putting linux on an older computer, partially as a learning experience, and partially because I'm sick of windows and all of its problems.
I am told linux doesn't have the problems windows has .
The only thing I'm unsure of is all the bad publisity linux has gotten concerning drivers for diferent hardware adn the learning curve to use it.

Does anyone have any knowledge about linux that will help me decide, IE: which one ,what version , cost ,availability.

Would appreciate any ones help.
Know it has nothing to do with Cast boolits but thought there would be enough knowledge here that someone would have the answers.



Thanks,

Jim

Jim,

I am using Linux at this moment. I have it installed on a Windows XP computer in a dual boot system. I am using Ubuntu and have been for 3 years. As stated above if you have access to a high speed connection an ISO can be downloaded for free. It can be run as a live CD or a dual boot system or a single install. Hardware can be an issue but the more popular printers, networking cards, and video cards are totally compatible. You can check it out at http://www.unbuntu.com . Also they will send you a cd for a minimal postage charge. Hope this helps you out and feel free to PM me if I can be of further help. Also there is some compatible hardware listings that would help you. The one thing about Linux is that the latest and greatest hardware will not usually be supported for a few months.

Edd

P.S. I would suggest that if you want a dual boot system, you install Linux on a second harddrive away from your Windows installation.

[StarMetal]

Don't expect as much compatible software for Linux. Microsoft is the big Daddy and comes foremost in stuff being made for.

I've had two different versions of windows as a dual boot system and it's quite easy. It configures itself when installed and when you boot you will get a black screen giving you the choice of which system you want to boot and if you don't select it has a timer and choosed the default one.

Joe

[nicholst55]

Jim,

I am using Linux at this moment. I have it installed on a Windows XP computer in a dual boot system. I am using Ubuntu and have been for 3 years. As stated above if you have access to a high speed connection an ISO can be downloaded for free. It can be run as a live CD or a dual boot system or a single install. Hardware can be an issue but the more popular printers, networking cards, and video cards are totally compatible. You can check it out at http://www.unbuntu.com . Also they will send you a cd for a minimal postage charge. Hope this helps you out and feel free to PM me if I can be of further help. Also there is some compatible hardware listings that would help you. The one thing about Linux is that the latest and greatest hardware will not usually be supported for a few months.

Edd

P.S. I would suggest that if you want a dual boot system, you install Linux on a second harddrive away from your Windows installation.

+1. You can also create a small partition in your current hard drive and load Linux/Ubuntu to it. I'm at the point where I prefer Ubuntu over Windows anything. IMHO Microsoft is merely a self-perpetuating money sucker. Launch a new OS (Vista), let the world determine that it sucks, then "save" the world with Windows 7. No thanks.

[Lunk]

I have no used any version of Linux since college but I have read allot of good things about Ubuntu. There are allot of programmers working to make it a simple interface for web apps, email, word processing and the like. If you want to try a version I think that one would be the best one to start with.

[lurch]

+1 on Ubuntu & Knoppix...

And just to muddy the waters further, Ubuntu even comes in two flavors: Gnome (plain Ubuntu) and KDE (Kubuntu) based UI's. There's not much to choose between them as I see it from the user perspective - just a look & feel sort of thing. There may be some hidden technical advantage to one over the other but I haven't seen it.

As far as the software issue is concerned, Unless you are a gamer or need to use specialty programs such as some CAD tools there is no issue. 99% of computer usage is web, email, document editing and spreadsheets. Software for Linux has that covered pretty well. Openoffice will read & save Micro$oft format files - not perfectly 100% of the time, but well enough that there should be no showstopper issues.

[wiljen]

Linux is different than the driver model of the windows world. Installing new hardware usually means recomping the kernel to account for it. This is the headache that people used to a "just install the driver" world don't care for. If I were new to linux, I would start with one of the live distributions like knoppix that boots from CD and leaves no footprint. You can use it to learn while still working with your current os when you get stuck. Once you are comfortable with it, load Ubuntu or one of the other consumer oriented distros and go from there. I would at no cost suggest , Debian, Slack, or FreeBSD for beginners or consumers. Ubuntu is probably the most friendly followed by Redhat's Fedora Core.

[kywoodwrkr]

I had(have) a Dell 1100 whose disk failed.
I bought a new disk and decided to try a Linux system.
I installed Red Hat and made it a dual system.
When I cold boot the system it will ask me which system I want, and after a few seconds if I don't select XP, it will bring up Linux.
I run Master Cam and other applications under the MS XP when I bring it up.
I'm not a big follower of Linux. Or MS for that matter.:roll:
I like real computers and real operating systems.[smilie=1:
Sorry for the slant , but I'm very bigoted when it comes to computers. From 45 years of working with them maybe.8-)
FWIW

[felix]

Don't be shy about name droppings, KYWW! It's hard to beat the logical thinking of men like (Blue)Gene Amdahl. ... felix

[grages]

I am duel booted at work with XP and Ubuntu. But one of the Linux derriviatives I have played with is gOS which is built on ubuntu + some other front end gui stuff. It has a nice feel very much like a Mac OSX system. It is available as a live CD

The nice part about a live CD is that if it will boot then you know the hardware should work for an actual install. It comes preinstalled with open office, firefox and lots of google widgets.
linky (http://www.thinkgos.com/gos/index.html)

[SciFiJim]

Beekeeper - I learned DOS when it was learn or don't have a job. Learned Win95 the same way. I have been upgrading OSes as I upgraded computers. I have dual booted Ubuntu and WinXP and wound up switching back to XP exclusively. I already had all MS Office software purchased and didn't want to give it up. I have tried OpenOffice and came back to Office 2003.

My son and I were also beta testers for Win7. He stayed with Win7 and I returned to XP (he has newer hardware). I will eventually upgrade to the latest WinOS when I upgrade computers again.

Linux is reported to be an excellent OS, but I have already climbed the learning curve for Windows. If I was trying to revive an older computer I would put Linux on it and force myself to learn it. Your goal of learning is a good one. Its always good to learn new things.

[C A Plater]

Does anyone have any knowledge about linux that will help me decide, IE: which one ,what version , cost ,availability.


I have done dozens of installations and maintain several Linux servers and lab workstations. My home systems are all Linux (Fedora 11, Xubuntu, and Puppy Linux) except for one semi-retired Windows XP machine that I last used at tax time so I can honestly claim expert status on the subject.

First let me answer the cost and availability question. All version are available free for the download but if your connection is not up to getting a CD's worth of data or better, most can be had for a nominal fee. There are dozens of different versions call distributions or distro and a convenient site for comparing is at distrowatch (http://distrowatch.com/).

One of the strengths of Linux is choice. It also makes it very hard for the newbie to figure out which path to take. Generally I've found these three version below the easiest to start out with.


Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntu.com/) - The most popular disto right now and with most mainstream computers thing will just work.
Mepis (https://www.mepis.org/) - Derived from Ubuntu with a different window manager (KDE instead of Gnome) and tweaked to make the transition from windows easier.
Puppy Linux (http://www.puppylinux.com/) - The smallest and fastest version. It is well suited to old hardware and limited memory with a surprising amount of software included. It has a very active user forum for support and is a great platform for the experimenting.

All of these come as live CD's that you can boot up and play around before deciding to install. Once you choose to install you can download more applications from repositories of compatible software to add capabilities to your system.

If you have more questions you can PM me and I'll do what I can to answer them.

[felix]

Linux/Unix, created by Dennis Ritchie at Bell Labs, is meant for creating data paths, called pipes, between peripherals, originally telephones. This is a true "star" network of peripherals such that one peripheral is just as important as another and therefore can initiate data flow to another to allow the likes of a telephone conversation. No operating system back then would permit this because of the lack of a network "boss". Master-slave networks, i.e., hierarchy networks, have the advantage of keeping traffic under control and therefore network errors (intentional or not) to a minimum. At best, Linux/Unix can only approach an error free environment when operating in a hierarchical application, like what we have using a PC, but never get there. ... felix

[Digger]

Or like me the more common generic computer user, got tired of windows and all the daily process at boot up. Got curious and and now am a avid linux user, PClinuxOS , Love the simplicity of it . The thing with linux is you have a choice . Digger

[Trapshooter]

+1 on PCLinuxOS - Good support for a wide variety of hardware, and STABLE - nothing is flakey, and there doesn't seem to be as many releases of new improved versions.

I ran with the live CD for a while, then committed to a hard disk install. For a machine to do web browsing, email, and "office stuff" I don't see any advantage to Windows. You can buy quite a few molds (maybe even a rifle or two) for the cost of a newer bigger faster PC to run the next newer version of windows every couple years.

Trapshooter

[AlaskaMike]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned yet that the Castboolits site runs on Linux!

I have several Linux boxes at home as well as a FreeBSD server. I've used Linux for quite a number of years, and in fact my day job is administering about 50 unix servers, of which about 15 are Linux. I used to be very involved with Linux, especially Linux on DEC Alpha hardware. Then I got interested in reloading and bullet casting. :-)

The driver issue really isn't a problem these days--it certainly was back when most hardware vendors felt that Linux was only used by hobbyists and computer science majors. These days it's pretty odd to find hardware incompatibilities, and most of the time Linux detects new hardware far better than Windows does. Part of the reason for this is that most Linux distros include a fully modular kernel, and so you don't have to muck around with recompiling like you used to have to do.

One thing I've done when experimenting is to just buy a new hard drive, disconnect the old one and put it in an anti-static bag on a shelf, and hook up the new one to do the install on. Everything on the old hard drive is perfectly safe and secure, and to roll back to it all you have to do is plug it back in.

Mike

[MtGun44]

We used the version of linux that has the little lizard as the logo, I think it was SuSE ?.
Personally, I thought the OS was OK since I have used Unix for decades on supercomputers
so am comfortable with the DOS like command prompt environment. The thing that really,
really ruined it was all the ancillary apps that came with it like the file manager, video and
picture display apps and all the little stuff that you just get with Windows. They worked
badly, unreliably and since the were "free" there was really nobody to complain to about
the problems. I envisioned some dope smoking Swede in his basement at 2 am deciding
the he wasn't really into fixing that particular problem today -- 'maybe next week if I'm
in the mood." It eventually became such a PITA that we switched back to Win XP 64 bit
on our 8 CPU high end PCs at work.

Even already knowing how to navigate at the OS level was not much help. If we wanted
to live in a modern GUI driven environment we had to use all the little ancilliary apps and
they seemed to be pretty crappy to me all the way around. We also had some issues
getting different external hardware to function properly, apparently driver issues,
and I didn't deal with them personally so am not sure other than sometime stuff just
didn't work. The "MS Word" and "XL" repalcements were just lame enough to be irritating,
not totally ***, but certainly not the same as Word or XL. I suppose some may think that
is good, personally I know Word and XL very well and when things work a tad differently
or just do not have a particular capability it is very disconcerting.

I will stay away from Linux personally, but you may like it or maybe other versions may have
better 'helper apps'. Generally, Windows works well for me. I work in Unix, too and much
prefer Windows for the ease of working with files and a lot of small GUI things that individually
seem like no big deal but in the aggregate amount to a lot less hassle and a lot more
productivity.

Bill

[Digger]

Your right about that approach AlaskaMike , I put together my tower with a open bay so I can swap hard drives with their own individual enclosed module into the open receiver bay and lock them in for use, using different versions of Linux or dual boot windows/linux ,, I have to admit that windows still has the edge for bells and whistles for watching movies or tv so thats when it goes back in , but only then. Absolutely love the visuals with 3d in my PClinuxOS compiz/fusion set up, throwing the cube around with 2,3,4 different desktops at the same time is impressive these days......digger

[chevyiron420]

Well, to put mu 2 cents in, im still running windows 98 and internet explorer 6. Alot of places are dropping support for IE 6 and i cant upgrade to a newer browser with windows 98. We bought XP and mistakenly installed it on the wifes computor first before we knew it could be used only once. I aint giving greedy bill any more money, so i dont know what to do. Any advise?

[454PB]

There are ways around that "install once" problem.......

Ubuntu would work fine on your old Win98 machine, and it includes a recent version of Firefox browser.