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View Full Version : a visit from the tinsel fairy



part_timer
10-22-2009, 09:53 AM
Last night I was smelting some WW and took my normal safety steps.
1. Warm ww and pot at same time.
2. use ingot mold as a cover for the pot so it warms at the same time

All was going great. I put some sawdust on top to flux with and put the ladle in to stir it. OOOOPS!!!!!!!! I had forgot to warm my ladle.

Lead flew about 4' from the pot. Luckly I had a FR long sleeve shirt on as well as welding gloves, safety glasses and leather work boots. I only had one small burn where a small piece of lead fell down inside the cuff on my glove and landed on the back of my hand.

I never would have thought that the ladle would have had that kind of moisture on it but it did.

Thanks to all of you who have posted about this before. I didn't used to take all the precautions that I did last night. It wold have been a lot worse if not for this site.
Tom

Ben
10-22-2009, 09:58 AM
I put room temp ladles in molten lead all the time without that happening to me. There's more to this story than a ladle that was a room temp ? ? ? ?

Had the ladle been outside with dew on it ?

Ben

docone31
10-22-2009, 09:59 AM
It is amazing how comprehensive the Tinsel Fairy can be!
Cunning, baffling, and sometimes quite painful!
I have had ingots "talk" while I am recharging my pot. Solid ingots. I put them in, and they shake for a few moments. They make a whooshing sound while shaking.
I am pretty sure, that is ambiend moisture on the outside of the ingot.
I have gotten to the habit, now, of putting everything on top of the melt for a few before I immerse anything! I have had a wheel weight with some crud on it, get hot, get immersed, then explode! I am guessing when I think it was the crud, makeing a gas state in the lead, then pushing outward. No Tinsel Fairy, but noise.
Glad it went well. Lead can be hot.

44man
10-22-2009, 10:05 AM
A cast iron ladle will absorb moisture if it is real damp out.
Then watch some flux as it absorbs moisture fast.
I have a spoon I use to make my alloy with the metal mans flux. I can't put it back into the pot unless I heat it or wash the flux off.
But look at something else here too. Sawdust can be damp and left on the surface it will be OK. Push it under the surface and here comes the tinsel fairy! :groner:

1Shirt
10-22-2009, 10:10 AM
Part timer! Glad it was not worse. We get complacent with age and experiance. I have been casting for the best part of 50 years, and as of a month and a half ago I have a whale of a burn on my foot because I wore loafers while casting instead of boots. I moved an ingot mold befor it was solidified, and spilled it on top of the foot. A really stupid move! (A good reason for having a pail of water in the area, as I put my foot in, and the MD's said that probably saved me from having to have a skin graf.) Have been getting away with that for many years, but it caught up with me. Reminders like our experiances on this forum may help others to learn not to make the same dumb mistakes that we have made.
Old Pa. Dutch sayin: "Ve get to soon old, and to late smart".
1Shirt!:coffee:

dragonrider
10-22-2009, 11:55 AM
I would suggest that the moisture was mostly in your sawdust as it is never completely dry, always let it char completely before mixing.

Humbo
10-22-2009, 02:11 PM
Same thing happened to me once, left the ladle outside overnight, and there was an explosion when putting it into the melt too quickly in my next casting session.
Anyone saw the Time warp episode on Discovery about that lunatic putting his hand into molten lead? He dipped it in water first, and then put it into what looked like a full Lee 20 lbs pot with 700 degrees hot lead. I was just waiting for the explosion when he explained why he had to dip his hand into water before putting it into the melt. There was no explosion, just a little bit of sizzling.

part_timer
10-22-2009, 02:15 PM
My ladle was in the garage but on the concrete floor instead of in the pot like I normally keep it. [smilie=b: There probably was some moisture on the bottom or maybe some under the crud in it. Hard to tell. I let the sawdust char completly before I tried to stir it up. Dont' think big boom, just enough popping to get things out of the pot and airborn.

bedwards
10-22-2009, 02:52 PM
My Marvelux REALLY absorbs moisture. I have to watch using it.

be

Ricochet
10-22-2009, 03:08 PM
I've had a rusty ladle do some bubbling and popping, but no Tinsel Fairy action.

looseprojectile
10-22-2009, 03:14 PM
in my old age I do everything slowly around a pot of melted lead. I have never had a major eruption of lead though I can see that if any moisture were to be introduced into a pot it could be disastrous. I have experienced the walking and talking from the ingots when lowered into a pot of molten lead and take that to mean that I need to preheat the ingots a little more. Just sticking the stirring stick in the molten lead takes some restraint and care as it will pop and crackle and hiss some. Kind of equates to driving a car. Some people seem to have their heads into where they are going to be, as opposed to where they are. Thanks for the heads up and be careful out there.

Life is good

nonferrous
10-22-2009, 04:14 PM
I worked in a foundry in Minnesota for a number of years. More than once I saw them taking some poor guy to the ER with burns from pigging Bronze or Aluminum into a cold ingot mold.
And these guys are pros.

JeffinNZ
10-22-2009, 05:20 PM
The Tinsel Fairy visits me every night and the evidence is now showing in my hair!!

HORNET
10-22-2009, 07:28 PM
Bet you found out that you can move a LOT faster than you thought....[smilie=w: BTDT

fecmech
10-24-2009, 01:22 PM
If you flux with Marvelux you need to preheat the ladle all the time or it will get you. That stuff really draws moisture!

454PB
10-24-2009, 03:08 PM
I'm a Marvelux fan, and have used it for about 25 years. Using it actually makes you less likely for a pot eruption, you HAVE to preheat your stirrer/dipper.

Bent Ramrod
10-24-2009, 09:47 PM
A cast-iron ladle can look dry and still have considerable moisture in it. I got the clever idea once to dunk the ladle into the quench water at the end of a casting session. Lots of hissing and steam, and to my delight most of the oxides had boiled off the inside and the thin layer of lead that stuck to some areas was now loose enough to peel off. I set the ladle out to dry at ambient temperature, which around here can get into the hundreds easily.

A week later I fired up the pot, melted the lead and dunked the ladle into the metal. There was quite an eruption, most of which, fortunately missed me. But the ladle looked bone-dry. I guess the cast iron is porous enough to retain considerable moisture inside the casting. I still dunk the ladle occasionally to loosen the gunk on the surface, but always let it heat up with the lead the next casting session. It does hiss a lot while it is heating, too.

part_timer
10-24-2009, 10:13 PM
Hornet
My son said I move pretty fast for an old fat man!!!!!!