Favorite Molds for 45 Auto Rim

[azrednek]

I know this topic has appeared numerous times, so if you can bear with me I'd like to open it up again.

For serious paper punching I've had excellent results with an old Ideal 452491. It drops a gas checked boolit weighing apx 225. I've ran it with loads of Bullseye weighing 3.5 to 5.5. I get the best shot to shot accuracy with a charge of 4.0. A load of 4.5 shoots exactly with the same accuracy and same place on the target. Being an extreme cheapskate and knowing that target could care less about a few more FPS I've been loading it with 4.0. The load is pleasant to shoot and I can shoot it for hours without the fatigue of heavier loads.

The 452491 with a load of 4.0 Bullseye doesn't "need" a gas check to prevent leading but the gas check definitely improves the shot to shot accuracy. The gas checked load really performs in two 1937 dated Brazilian surplus 1917 revolvers. Surprisingly it does well in one revolver with a couple of pits in the barrel.

For Javalina hunting I've used a gas checked Saeco 62945, also my favorite in my Ruger 45 Colt. The gas checked Saeco boolit is a near twin of the plain based Lyman 452424. I don't have a Crony but I've run this slug with some hefty loads in my S&W 25-2. I have yet to successfully get a Javy with the heavy loads but a few years ago I literally rolled a Yote with it at apx 50 yards. The hard cast boolit barely mushroomed but did deform slightly going through the Yote's shoulder and stopped under the skin of the opposite side of the entry wound.

My other favorites for 45 AR are the Saeco 62453, a 220gr full button nosed wadcutter. The full wadcutter design makes real nice clean holes on paper and allows my aging eyes to see the target holes at a good distance without using binoculars.

The Lyman 45266 supposed to be a bevel base but a gas check fits the bevel base near perfectly. My original Ideal 45266 mould an Ebay purchase is pitted but shoots great with a gas check. I bought another, a later Lyman marked 45266 but the gas checks don't fit as well as the earlier version. The shot to shot accuracy is great, there is an improvement over the plain based castings but gas checking the later Lyman mould is slow and tedious to seat the check straight.

For casual plinking the Lee 200 gr RNF is real hard to beat. I cast with the Lee not worrying much about alloy and I shoot them tumble lubed without any sizing. I've spent the time sizing and hard lubing the Lee RNF and it doesn't shoot any better. It shoots fine as cast with surprisingly few fliers on paper.

The Lyman gas checked 452484 a near copy of the plain based 452374. Both molds are made to drop a casting similar in size and appearance as the 230 gr GI hardball. The only advantage with the gas checked version in my experience has been in pitted bores where it does shoot better than the plain based. In a good barrel the gas checked version does not shoot any better, more accurately or lead the barrel less than the plain based.

In summary, just about every cast boolit I've used in 45AR weighing 200 grs and up has shot well as long as I keep the load mild to medium. I haven't had much luck with lighter weight.

One 45 mould I got a deal on at a yard sale, think I paid 5 bux for it is the Lyman 452630. Haven't cast with it yet. Does anybody have any experience with it they might care to share?

[Dframe]

My favorite of all time is an old H&G #78. It drops a bullet that enters the case, lube and all at almost a perfect 215 grains.

[beagle]

I had good luck with RCBS 45-230-CM. The round, flat nose loads pretty easy and it weighs around 225 grains and that wide, flat round nose hits hard.

I've also shot a lot of 452423s in old M1917s and they shot pretty well but didn't shoot that well in my M25. That was in the old days./beagle

[Dale53]

I have two 625's that I shoot regularly (a 625-6 with 5" barrel and a 625-8 JM Special with a 4" barrel). Both have Simmons Red Dot sights.

I will shoot approximately 5000 rounds of Auto Rim or .45 ACP in these revolvers this year. My favorite bullet is the MiHec H&G #68 (flatbase) 200 gr SWC. My load has been 4.0 grs of Bullseye or equivalent (equivalent being an amount of P5066 or 231 to give the same velocity as 4.0 grs of Bullseye).

4.5 grs of P5066 gives me a chronographed velocity of 719 fps with a SD of 6 using Federal 150 LP primers. It shoots WELL under an inch at 25 yards and just under or at 2.0" at fifty yards.

My close second choice of bullet is the H&G #130 200 gr flat base with the same powder choice. I haven't chronographed that one but would expect a bit higher velocity as it is deeper seating.

Either of these loads will do great work for target shooting including the "long line" and with pleasant recoil. They also are terrific for edible small game (grouse or rabbits).

My "combat" load has been the #68 with 7.5 grs of Unique (this is at the limit for a 1911 and will give close to a 1000 fps).

I am eager to try my new NOE 454424 (252 grs) bullet from my new mould but haven't been able to do so yet due to time contraints. Swede Nelson praises this highly after using it in his .45 ACP 625. I am really looking forward to this. Of course, I will mainly use this one in my .45 Colts and .454 Casulls.

Dale53

[Dutchman]

I've been shooting and handloading .45 AutoRim for the Brazilian 1937 since 1988.

I've shot all manner of cast bullets and a couple factory swaged like the Hornady 250 gr SWC. The absolute most accurate is the HG68. I prefer 230-250 grains for the "imagined" impact energy but they're not nearly as accurate as the 200 gr SWC. 6 to 6.5 grs Unique with the 200 gr SWC.

I haven't tried yet the Lee 255 gr RF but I'm currently casting it in a d/c. It drops a perfect .452" from 50:50 ww-lino. I like the profile of this one. Load will be 5.5 grs Unique.

http://images51.fotki.com/v750/photos/2/28344/157842/SW1937b-vi.jpg



Dutch

[Shiloh]

LEE 230 gr. TLTC Drops at 238 gr. Drops right in if using moon clips and .45 ACP brass.
LEE 200 gr TLSWC Shoots well but difficult to load using moon clips.

When using auto rim brass, no big problems. The TC boolit is still a bit faster to load.

Shiloh

[Bret4207]

So far the GB 45BD (original run) is the hands down winner. Since I put the Wondersight on the '17 Smiff I've found it groups rather well. Amazing what being able to see the sights does for your shooting.

[Dutchman]

All shot one right after the other.

Notice 3 different handguns:
1- Smith & Wesson Brazilian Modelo 1937 .45
2- Colt Gov't Model C-prefix mfg 1933 from Argentina
3- Colt New Service mfg 1916 originally .455 Ely now .45 Colt
You'll understand why I sold the New Service.

25 yds from a rest.

http://images41.fotki.com/v1305/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr01-vi.jpg

http://images51.fotki.com/v730/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr02-vi.jpg

http://images51.fotki.com/v748/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr03-vi.jpg

http://images112.fotki.com/v1534/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr04-vi.jpg

http://images112.fotki.com/v1531/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr05-vi.jpg

[Dutchman]

The Hornady 255 gr swaged were .454" diameter.

There's one bullet that stands head and shoulders above the rest.

http://images39.fotki.com/v1350/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr06-vi.jpg

http://images17.fotki.com/v319/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr07-vi.jpg

http://images41.fotki.com/v1245/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr08-vi.jpg

http://images53.fotki.com/v1579/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr11-vi.jpg

http://images5.fotki.com/v66/photos/2/28344/1676633/rrr12-vi.jpg

http://images6.fotki.com/v78/photos/2/28344/157842/m15a-vi.jpg

[Freischütz]

I'm a fan of 452423. In my 22-4 6.0 - 6.5 gr of Unique delivers excellent accuracy, no leading, and adequate power.

[R.C. Hatter]

:Fire:I've had satisfactory results with the Lyman #454424 and #454190 in my 1917Colt revolver. I use 5.7-6.0 grs. Unique with a standard CCI primer. Those boolits shoot much better than #452374, and the old Remington factory load, which, as Elmer Keith said, "wouldn't hold the shallow groove rifling worth a whoop." He was right, as he usually was.

[35remington]

I must say I'm very, very, very surprised a coyote can stop a hard, heavy 250ish grain SWC out of the Auto Rim. If this was replicated about 10,000 times I'd bet the bullet would go clean through every time.

All it takes for accuracy to go south in my Auto Rim/ACP revolvers IF the bullet is rather heavy is a soft alloy. The bullet skids so badly it has double or nearly triplewide rifling marks with nearly the whole surface of the bullet being scored by the rifling. Accuracy sucks and leading is horrible with such a bullet.

Cast hard or quenched with a good soft lube is the way to go to get good accuracy and keep leading under control with the heavies in my 625-3.

Now, the light bullets like Lee's discontinued 190 grain button nose SWC shoot just fine out of ACWW's due to their lower inertia, and the recovered bullets show more normal rifling marks with just a little widening at the front of the first band. Since this bullet shoots well with minimal fiddling, it's my practice and target bullet.

But for carrying around and shooting whatever, I go with a heavier SWC or RF like the 452423, or Lee's 252 SWC or 255 RF. At up to 1000 fps with all. I cannot see what a jacketed hollowpoint can do that these bullets can't do better.

[Bass Ackward]

Favorite molds? Have you ever found one that didn't work .... well? Or do you mean serious work?

If you are talking about groups the same size when you finish shooting as when you started regardless of round count, then that would be my 260 LBT LFNGC.

If you have people insist on putting a sheet of paper behind the target and then moving the paper after every shot, just to prove that six shots really WERE fired in that hole, then that is my 260 LBT LFNGC.

If you want a 100 yard bullet that can actually be seated out and crimped so that case capacity is identical to a Scoffield, then that is my 260 LBT LFNGC.

Otherwise, you can shoot anything you want really. I plink with the LEE 200RF but it gets pretty poor beyond 50 yards or so no matter what I do.

[Bret4207]

I must say I'm very, very, very surprised a coyote can stop a hard, heavy 250ish grain SWC out of the Auto Rim. If this was replicated about 10,000 times I'd bet the bullet would go clean through every time.

All it takes for accuracy to go south in my Auto Rim/ACP revolvers IF the bullet is rather heavy is a soft alloy. The bullet skids so badly it has double or nearly triplewide rifling marks with nearly the whole surface of the bullet being scored by the rifling. Accuracy sucks and leading is horrible with such a bullet.

Cast hard or quenched with a good soft lube is the way to go to get good accuracy and keep leading under control with the heavies in my 625-3.

Now, the light bullets like Lee's discontinued 190 grain button nose SWC shoot just fine out of ACWW's due to their lower inertia, and the recovered bullets show more normal rifling marks with just a little widening at the front of the first band. Since this bullet shoots well with minimal fiddling, it's my practice and target bullet.

But for carrying around and shooting whatever, I go with a heavier SWC or RF like the 452423, or Lee's 252 SWC or 255 RF. At up to 1000 fps with all. I cannot see what a jacketed hollowpoint can do that these bullets can't do better.

I've found that a nice fat boolit helps with the shallow groove/short land issue. It won't clear it up completely, but it helps. I have been lucky with my 17 S+W and the 45 BD, but then I haven't pushed velocity much yet.

[GLL]

I agree with Freishutz ! I like the 454423 as well ! :)

Jerry

http://www.fototime.com/F691E31B675E633/standard.jpg

[lead_her_fly]

http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r115/Sackettwannabe/Boolits/45bullets.jpg

This picture has some well known bullets in it. The two on the left are in 45ACP cases but are still shot out of my M625JM.

The furthest left is from the Lee 6 cavity mold that copies the H&G #68 mold. The next is from an actual H&G #68, I find I like it better and it chambers better than the Lee in my PT1911.

The bullet in the middle is from an H&G mold as well, #502. It casts a "Keith" type bullet at 240gr and is very accurate from that little 4" barrel. Not only that but, I have driven them upwards of 1100fps with my favorite powder, SR4756. My alloy drops them just a bit heavier than 240gr at 248gr.

The next two bullets come my way from our beloved Paul5388. A Lyman 250K and a 270gr Ohaus. I had a minimal amount of these bullets so I don't have much for results along those lines.

While not in a 45AR case, here is a fun number to shoot.
http://i142.photobucket.com/albums/r115/Sackettwannabe/Boolits/SST45ACP2.jpg
They are "scarfed" from some Thompson Center sabots that are available now. 250gr 45ACP data was used to shoot them.

I can't hunt deer with them here in Indiana with them but it might be fun to try for some that can!

[coat]

I like rcbs Molds My 201 swc With Wst and rcbs 230CM mold with Win 231. I also have a lee 200 rnfp but it will not shoot that well. All of cast bullets are cast HARD for my 625 S/W.I had a lot of bullet jump i had to go to a lee unsized die. Also stay away from R-P auto rim brass get Star auto rim

[BLTsandwedge]

If you can find one, Lyman's 452389 is a great option. It is a 185g semi-wadcutter with a button-round nose. I'd believe that Lyman discontinued the design due to it not being 100% reliable in auto feeding- but don't know for certain. However, the '389 doesn't use as much lead as the tried-and-true 452374 and I've not found better accuracy from the favorites- 452460, '630 and the like. An oldie but goodie.

Tom

[Bret4207]

I agree with Freishutz ! I like the 454423 as well ! :)

Jerry

http://www.fototime.com/F691E31B675E633/standard.jpg

I bought a 452423 based on Chargars classic article- "452423, I love you!". Unfortunately my copy drops a skinny .449!!! I haven't even warmed my GB copy up yet.

[hammerhead357]

For the 45 AR in my 625 I like my S502 from H & G that is more than likely at least 30 years old. I find that it works well in most of my 45 Colts also.
I have the GB of the Ohaus 270 boolit but haven't shot many of them yet. They do look good and I hope they will perform well. I just don't have the time to shoot them right now....Wes

[Keith DVM]

Veral Smith makes a 210 or 230 grain LFN for the 45 ACP which may not be well known. I have the 230 grain and it casts at 239 grains. I can seat this out a bit long to increase powder space and thus lower pressures. The longer seating also allows for the bullet to just started into the cylinder throat which helps accuracy. The longer seating will keep them from functioning in the 1911. The profile feeds easily into the cylinders. I have used these with 4.5 of Bullseye or 5.0 of 231. I also have the same profile as a 250 grain from Veral's mold sale. I have not worked much with this one yet as the 230 to 240 grains seem to work so well.

[Char-Gar]

452423