Cleaners - Warning

[Gar]

My shooting partner emailed this article to me and I thought I'd pass it along.

I don't use brake or carburetor cleaners to clean molds but I thought some of you might. The article is a good reminder to read the warning labels.

Phosgene gas (http://www.brewracingframes.com/id75.htm)

[Mike0904]

Thanks Gar, as I tig and use brake cleaner I will heed this info.

[Ohio Rusty]

I'm not sure what it is I clean moulds with ...maybe Carbon Tet .... I always smoke my moulds with a lit wooden match. That helps to carbon the mould to help the boolit drop, but it also burns off any residue from the cleaner I use.
I don't smike moulds with a candle as that can leave a coating of wax inside the mould causing funny things to happen I've noticed ..........
Ohio Rusty

[Hickory]

I have always used dish soap and a tooth brush to clean my moulds. Then dry them with a hair drier.
Worked for me for a long time.

[kbstenberg]

That should be a mandatory read for all!!!

[STP22]

Ivory bar soap and an old toothbrush in hot water for me. Been doing it this way for quite some time with complete satisfaction.

[MT Gianni]

Great to know. Are you the Gar previously owner of GAR? I have some enrichment metal cakes and I have lost the alloy description.

[13Echo]

I agree with soap, water, and a toothbrush. Very safe, very effective, very inexpensive. I don't think the hazards of carb or brake cleaner are trivial and it costs a lot more than an old toothbrush. I have a hot plate with a small cover that I use to heat the mould to casting temperature that safely dries it out before pouring lead.

Jerry Liles

[nicholst55]

I used to (key words) use brake cleaner pretty much with abandon! Not any more! That is some dangerous stuff, and I will not mess with it any more.

[jhrosier]

I have been using brake cleaner on my moulds.
I checked the can before I used it today and it is clearly marked "non chlorinated".
I still take it out of doors and try to stay upwind of the fumes & spray.

Jack

[Southern Son]

If I have put the mould away for a while, I will usually have coated the mould in in Lanolin Grease, which is tough to get off, so I soak it in degreaser and wash that off with water a few times before the old tooth brush and soap trick.

[Gar]

Great to know. Are you the Gar previously owner of GAR? I have some enrichment metal cakes and I have lost the alloy description.

Nope, just bessed with a great name ;)

[AZ-Stew]

Before anyone panics, keep in mind that the phosgene gas is only produced when the liquid brake cleaner fluid is heated above a certain temperature. Using brake cleaner to clean a cold mould, then allowing the brake cleaner to evaporate before casting WILL NOT PRODUCE PHOSGENE GAS!

Brake cleaner is the best thing I've found to clean the inside of an AR upper receiver and the various bolt and carrier parts. Blasts the carbon powder fouling right out! Cleans the gas tube, too.

Regards,

Stew

[dsmjon]

Also an important note about brake cleaners in general:

- If marked "non chlorinated", the solvents are usually highly flammable and/or combustible.

- If marked "non flammable", the solvents are of chlorine base.

Either way, the stuff is bad news. It WILL adsorb THROUGH YOUR SKIN, and both are carcinogenic. Pick your poison, use your noggin, and use the **** outside ;)

[Glen]

Stew -- thanks for pointing that out.

Let me add my 2 cents worth here -- I am a chemist by profession and I deal with all kinds of solvents (and a wide variety of other chemical hazards) as a part of my daily profession -- the only way to generate phosgene is to put these chlorinated solvents on very hot metal in the presence of air. If you clean a mould with a chlorinated solvent and then let it sit and dry before you heat it up, you are not going to generate any phosgene. If you clean your mould with non-chlorinated solvent and heat it up right away, it will smoke, or burn off, just like the oil that you use to lube the alignment pins or hinge joint of the handles. Either way, IF YOU ARE CASTING WITH SUITABLE VENTILATION then any trace vapors that come off of your mould from cleaning solvents will not be an issue. If you are casting WITHOUT suitable ventilation, then the lead, arsenic and other heavy metal vapors are going to cause more significant problems than anything coming from your cleaning solvents.

As for these things being absorbed through your skin, that warning pertains only if you get them on your skin. Cleaning a mould without getting stuff on your hands is not hard to do (i.e. toothbrush and paper towel).

Let's think about this stuff clearly and put the paranoia to rest....

[AZ-Stew]

Glen,

The problem is that most people don't have enough "practical" chemistry (or any other science, for that matter) education. Thanks, U.S. Public schools. The lack of practical understanding was beginning to show in the posts and I thought it prudent to clear things up a bit.

I might have added that when spraying brake cleaner one should wear safety goggles to keep splatters out of the eyes. That stuff can go anywhere when spraying the inside of an AR receiver, especially around the chamber entrance and bolt locking lugs.

Regards,

Stew

[troy_mclure]

i use brakleen to clean lots of stuff, both chlorinated, and non chlorinated stuff.

its a great tool when used properly, and does kinda sting a bit in the eyes! lol

[Bret4207]

Glen,

The problem is that most people don't have enough "practical" chemistry (or any other science, for that matter) education. Thanks, U.S. Public schools. The lack of practical understanding was beginning to show in the posts and I thought it prudent to clear things up a bit.

I might have added that when spraying brake cleaner one should wear safety goggles to keep splatters out of the eyes. That stuff can go anywhere when spraying the inside of an AR receiver, especially around the chamber entrance and bolt locking lugs.

Regards,

Stew

Heck of a lot of truth there. That's why there are so many outfits running around making millions protecting us from ourselves. Used with due caution MEK, Carbon Tet, Mercury, asbestos, etc can al be helpmates to mankind instead of his destroyer.

[IcerUSA]

Good thing we usually don't have to weld on our molds often . :)

But welding of any kind has safty things that should be done everytime you weld .

Keith

[deltaenterprizes]

Great to know. Are you the Gar previously owner of GAR? I have some enrichment metal cakes and I have lost the alloy description.

GAR was in New Jersey, he is in Arizona, but he could have moved!

[MT Gianni]

I spoke with GARfolo several times and knew he retired. I assumed that he could have gone south.