.38 special lrn load

[zt77]

I always read the old service load for the .38 special was a 158 gr lead round nose.
I also read that 2.7 grains of bullseye is a good duplicate of this load.
I also read 3.5 grains of bullseye is too.....and so is 5.0 grains unique....
Upon looking at my reloading manuals it seems something is wrong!!
My speer manual says 5 grains unique is starting for .357 magnum! :?
Then other manuals as well as many people say a good .38 +p load is 5.4 grains unique....then some say that isn't even +p yet.

so is lyman the ONLY book to look at for cast or what?

if someone could enlighten me on what is a good duplicate of the 158 lrn service load I would appreciate it. Unique is preferred.
ditto for a +p 150 gr rcbs 358-150 swc load...thanks

[pmeisel]

My old notes have me at 4.7 grains of Unique with 158 grains of lead, and up to 5 grains with Jword 158s. I developed these 20 years ago. The Lyman 49 says 4.5 of Unique is max with lead but 5.0 grains is OK with Jword.

I recommend you follow the manual loads and back off half a grain to start until you know the loads are OK in your gun.

I wouldn't say Lyman is the only book for cast but it certainly seems to be the one with the most loads, especially if you have more than one edition. I would also check out Alliant's data on line.

[gon2shoot]

Lawyers have gotten involved since the early manuals were printed, and the powders "may" have changed some.

Try 4.6gr of Unique for your 158gr, and go from there.

(I still load from the old manuals) [smilie=1:

[fecmech]

The Lyman cast bullet handbook lists 4.2 of Bullseye and 5.1 0f Unique as max standard pressure loads for the 158 RN at 16200 psi cup. Both are very accurate out of my revolvers and leverguns. The 4.2 BE load is the most accurate load bar none out of my K-38 and the Unique load is the most accurate out of my 94 Winnie. Both loads run almost identical in velocity being right at 900 fps out of the 6" bbl and 1100 fps out of my 2 rifles. You won't go wrong with either one!

Ps. I believe these would be pretty much duplicates of the original service load.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

Hornady printed 1988
Bullseye 2.6 - 3.6gr 650 - 800fps

Unique 3.4 - 4.8gr 650 - 900fps

--------------------------------------------------

Speer printed 1988
Bullseye 3.8gr 801fps, 4.2gr 888fps

Unique 4.3gr 853fps, 4.7gr 913fps

The above are high numbers in bold are listed as "Max" loads

Interestingly the difference from one manual to the other, the Hornady was using a S&W 15 w/4" barrel, and Speer was a Ruger Security Six w/6" barrel.

Each book was using their own lead boolits.

[Ricochet]

Bullseye is what the Winchester-Western factory (at least) generally loaded all their "standard" pistol cartridges with. (According to George Frost in Ammunition Making.) The old published velocity of 855 FPS for the 158 grain lead round nose was taken in a solid pressure gun barrel 6" long. Velocities went down when they started putting in a vent to simulate the cylinder-barrel gap.

[Larry Gibson]

Don't really care who printed what with regards to velocity. If you want to equal a factory load .38 load in your revolver then you must use a powder/bullet combination that equals the factory load velocity at a safe pressure in your revolver. As an example; Factory Speer, Rem and Win 158 lead SWC/RN loads run 815-825 fps out of my 4" M15 S&W. With a cast 150 gr 358477 over 4 gr of Bullseye the velocity is 830 fps. That is my .38 Special "standard factory duplication" load.

Larry Gibson

[Rex]

I have always believed that the 158 grain LRN bullet and 3.5 grain Bullseye duplicated the old factory round.
Rex

[Larry Gibson]

I have always believed that the 158 grain LRN bullet and 3.5 grain Bullseye duplicated the old factory round.
Rex

Rex

That's what we all believed until chronographs became available.

Larry Gibson

[JIMinPHX]

I always though that HP-38 was supposed to be the "standard" powder for .38 specials. It's pretty close to being the same as W-231 & works well in most mild pistol cartridges.

[1Shirt]

:Powders change over time, and so do ideas, and thoughts. That is why I like this forum. Many changes of ideas and thoughts over a period of time. Some good, some outdated, some funny as well.
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[MakeMineA10mm]

Bullseye is what the Winchester-Western factory (at least) generally loaded all their "standard" pistol cartridges with. (According to George Frost in Ammunition Making.) The old published velocity of 855 FPS for the 158 grain lead round nose was taken in a solid pressure gun barrel 6" long. Velocities went down when they started putting in a vent to simulate the cylinder-barrel gap.

That's good info, and I'd only add that Winchester switched over to their own ball powders for their loaded ammunition in the 70s, or so.

My standard 38 Spl. load is 4.4grs of W231, which is .2 to .3 grs above what most manuals list as equivalent to the factory (non-+P) load. I find it duplicates the "book" velocity of the factory ammo, although usually the factory ammo doesn't match it's book velocity either... I've found my 4.4gr load to be safe in all 38s I've shot it in, including the early 70s-vintage aluminum-framed Colt Cobra I used to have.

[TAWILDCATT]

what gun is it to be used in??old guns might shake loose. bullseye was probably the powder as it was basicly the only one when the 38 was brought out.
factory velocity seldom matches reality as they use special set up.most times the factory printed velocity is more than when shot in normal guns.

[zt77]

They are to be used in a model 64 .38 and a model 66 .357. I'm not worried about harming these guns, I've fired many a +p+ through the 64.
I do want a set load though, that is standard and duplicates factory pressures in case I get an older .38 such a police positive or 1905 hand ejector.

[powderburnerr]

woah I need to redo my 38 load I been using a
'mid range load for 25 years thats a whole lot heavier than any printed here ,,, ya notice I havent [posted any data .. My ,manuals are are 30 yrs old ,,,,,,Dean

[Bulletlube]

If you check the Hodgdon online load data you will find that HP38 and WW231 have the same loads. To be safe always use up to date data because some powders have changed over time.