Question to Lee precision about lubing and answer

[tackstrp]

At 10:26 AM 10/2/2009, you wrote:
> I read on the Boolits fourm that cast bullets other than tumble lube, do just as well when sized and coated with Lee Tumble lube stuff.
>
> Is that true?
>
4:46 Pm from Pat at info leeprecision . com
It is true - I have used tumble lube on bullets with all types of lube grooves with good results. Just don't try to fill the grooves with lube as you would with more traditional bullet lubricants. This will be too much, and will result in a sticky mess in your bullet seating die. Just a light even coat is necessary for most applications.

From Me ... my comments on the above.
So if I understand the answer correctly, the Lee method of lubing is not to fill the grooves on a bullet but to lubicate the parts that will be in contact with the barrel. Consequentally those that lightly lube with just about anything to size a bullets then do the Lee Alox , swirl, swill,and dry are ahead and not using to much Lee Alox. That being the case should be able to pust any bullet thru the proper sizeing die. Certian limitations for High speed bullets of course.

Interesting.
This one line in the follow instructions I found the most informative. "Lee recommends bullets be relubed after sizing to be sure the sized portion is coated with Alox. "
This for me, at least brings together all of the things I have been reading.

Here are the instrucions per LEE precision

Technical Information

Directions for Use:



Lubricating Bullets:

Place bullets in provided red plastic container and drop in the included Lee Liquid Alox onto the bullets.
Gently shake the bullets in an orbital motion to coat the bullets. If they do not coat completely, add a little more lube.
Spread the bullets onto waxed paper and let dry overnight.
Load at least one bullet into a case and check to be sure it easily chambers in the gun. If it fits tightly, you must resize the bullet before loading.
Sizing Bullets:

Screw the sizing die into any standard reloading press. Exact depth is not important.
Install the bullet punch into the ram. This fits all rams that use standard shellholders.
Place the red plastic container with the lubed bullets inside on top of the sizing die.
Place bullet on the punch and push the bullet through the die.
When 3/4 of the bullets have been loaded, lift the red plastic container off the die. Invert the holder before opening.
For rifle and hot pistol loads, it is best to relube the bullets to ensure the sized portion is recoated.
NOTES:
Lee recommends bullets be relubed after sizing to be sure the sized portion is coated with Alox.
All lead bullets must be lubricated, but it is not absolutely necessary to size all case bullets. Bullets must be sized if they are so large that they expand the case too much to freely enter the gun's chamber. Sizing sometimes helps accuracy by making the bullet uniform in diameter. This ensures uniform start pressure and better accuracy. Gas checks can be installed with this tool. Simply place the gas check on the base of the bullet before sizing.

[Buckshot]

............I found long ago (this is my personal experience and thoughts) that using the LA full strength and then re-coating after sizing was too much. I experimented and found that by thinning the LA 50/50 with paint thinner and then coating the boolits, it did just a good a job. I will add that these were not shot at magnum velocities and pressures. If after sizing you feel a 2nd coat will be a benefit, the thinned LA doesn't present the gooey buildup the flull strength stuff does.

http://www.fototime.com/C395D3A150A9504/standard.jpg

Using the thinned LA a regular lube grooved slug looks like these. They're loaded and shot just like this in my 38 S&W, 38 Special, and 38 Special pressure loads in the 357 magnum.

For quite some time as a matter of course I TL all my bore riding rifle boolit designs. This is done after I cast them. Or if I don't have the time or space then, when I do I'll TL them and put them back into their container. I use those Glad type plastic food containers, as below:

http://www.fototime.com/A30C5C8DCA91B7F/standard.jpg

I'm sure you know that if you store TL'd slugs they do need to be in some type of dust proof container. I TL bore riders as it sure eases engraving when chambering a round, and I can think of no reason the otherwise bare bore riding nose should not get some lube also. Of course you wouldn't want to carry them loose in a pocket if in the field.

..................Buckshot

[geargnasher]

Buckshot: +1 on using LLA on the bore-riders! I started doing that for my Swedish Mausers awhile back and works great. However, I think I've improved somewhat over plain LLA, I now use LLA/JPW/mineral spirits in 4:4:1 ratio and dip just the protruding boolit of the loaded rounds (grooves full of Felix Lube) and let them drip-dry hanging on a wire with clothespins holding the rims. The resulting coating isn't sticky, and dries totally in less than a day, and seems to have eliminated a bit of the throat leading I was getting in one gun.

Gear

[Shiloh]

Thinned alox seems to dry to a harder coating. It could be that there isn't as much so the gumminess is less noticable. It works superbly when thinned. ALox on regular lube boolits works fine at 50/50 or slightly thicker.

I also lube the noses as recommended to me by Buckshot several years ago. My nose lube is alox cut to less than 50/50. Probably about 40% alox 60% mineral spirits. Any thinner and it sort of runs off the boolits.

Shiloh

[Newtire]

Alot of people use "Midway Mica" to make the boolit slick and keep grit from sitcking to it.

Soebody covered this once before in a thread like this and I concur with their findings:

Once you get the bore coated with a film of lube from shooting, there is not really any need to lube the nose. I think the shock of starting the boolit is enough to blow the lube out of the grooves into the bore anyway and lubing the outsides after sizing just makes more of a mess and is one extra step that may not be necessary-even though that's Lee's reason that LLA is "better than anything" (not that I don't like it-I use it occasionally and it works great).

I shoot a Marlin 62 with a 24" bbl in .256 mag with a little Felix Lube in the groove of the 257420 Lyman boolit and never experience leading ever ever. It comes out at 2200 fps and I have gone thru 200 or more without cleaning with no leading.

Just what I found.