Lyman 429421 vs 429244

[Wally]

These are 250 grain .44 Caliber SWC/Keith style bullets--the 244 has a GC base. I have both but seldom used the 244 as the GC are too costly IMHO. However that may change, if I can get ahold of a Freechex tool to make my own. Before I felt it best to ask others if I really need a GC at all. I shoot a Model 29, a Ruger Superblackhawk, and a model 92 all in the .44 Mag caliber------also a Marlin .444.

[lurch]

I found it easier to push the 429244 hard than I did the 429421. I can push them both to full throttle now in my Redhawk, but the 421 is a little more finicky about size (fit) and powder type and charge. The 421 uses a lot more lube that the 244 does too (at least the square bottom lube groove that I have does), but that shouldn't really be a concern in a pistol length barrel. With the 421 and FWFL, I can shoot the 421's at full tilt now, even to the point of having molten lube almost dripping from the muzzle, without issue. Do you NEED the gas checked 244 over the 421? In my opinion no, but it's easier to get it to perform at full potential.

I don't load 44 for rifle so can't comment there.

[Wally]

Lurch,

I was planing on using 10~11 grains of Unique and wondered if I'd get more accuracy with the GC bullet. That should get me 1,100+ FPS/maybe near 1,200 FPS, which is plenty for me. Both revolvers lead up a bit when I go over 1,000 FPS anyway---I do size the bullets to be a bit larger than the cylinder chambers.

[Bret4207]

Try sizing another thou' larger than you are currently if your mold drops fat enough. If you're getting leading with both PB and GC I'd bet you have a size issue. Many find sizing to as large as the cylinder will accept a loaded cartridge works.

[lurch]

Wally,

I originally had a lot of trouble with the mid range loads as well with the 421 just as you describe. Size was the issue. Light loads around 800'ish worked good, then I figured out how to make the 1400fps Earth shakers work. But the 100'sh were the last for me to figure out. Like was said above: Make 'em FAT... I use a fast(er) powder too. For whatever reason, I haven't gotten Unique to work as well as I'd like - yet. I do better with Green Dot for that range as well as the light loads.

[Larry Gibson]

If you want too push to magnum velocities with softer alloys that will readily expand you'll want the 244. If you want best accuracy out of the M92 with magnum loads then you'll want the 244. Those would be specialized loads for serious hunting application. Ergo the cost of 1,000 GCs is nil since decent practice loads can be used with the 421. Of course the 421 upwards of 1300 fps out of the handgun or 1400-1500 fps out of the M92 ain't nothing to sneeze at. I have both bullets and use both as mentioned. But the real deal is; for those special occasions when I want the best accuracy with the best terminal performance at the highest safe velocity I pull out the 429244 mould and don't even consider the cost of the GCs as a thousand of them go a long way.

Larry Gibson

[Lloyd Smale]

the 244 has been a more accurate bullet for me then the 421 even at lower velocitys.

[Wally]

Lloyd Smale

I sort of figured that it woudl be...have you tried it without a gas check?

[Wally]

Larry Gibson

What you say makes a lot of good sense. I may pop for a Frechex tool and make cheap gas checks so that I coudl use the 244 bullet mold more often.

[anachronism]

You can send to 429244 mould out & have the gascheck step removed. Either Buckshot or Erik at Hollowpoint Molds could do this for you.

[Wally]

Yes, I had heard that--as I have the 429241, I sse no reason to do so...

[Larry Gibson]

Larry Gibson

What you say makes a lot of good sense. I may pop for a Frechex tool and make cheap gas checks so that I coudl use the 244 bullet mold more often.

That would be a very good idea, especially if you shoot a lot of the GC'd bullets. I'm having very good results with my home made GCs although I buy sheet brass shim stock of .012" and use it. I have not had very good luck getting most can metal or aluninum flashing to crimp on the GC shanks as they are too thin. They do work as well as the older lyman non-crimping GCs though, especially the ones made out of aluminum flashing. I'm only making 22, 30, 31 and 8mm so far. Hoping to get into 35s and 44s. I don't shoot that many 6.5, 7mm, 375 or 45s to get that excited about the cost of GCs. Mostly I shoot 30, 31 and 8mms.

Larry Gibson

[Dew]

Larry,
What is the cost for .012 brass shim stock and where do you find it?

Thanks,
Dew

[Wally]

Larry,

I have teh .22 caliber Freechex II tool and it works just fine using 0.01" aluminum flashing--I tried thinner aluminum stock and it works ok, but the aluminum flashing is better IMHO.

The first time that I used the toll I made a perfectly formed .22 caliber gas check This made me think, why not get one to make the .44 caliber checks and use the 429244 bullet mold that I have not used in years. I also have an old Lyman 429640 (275 grain falt nose) that also takes a gas check--that should be a fantastic bullet in my .44 Mag carbine & my .444 Marlin.

I have been told that the Freechex tool works very nicely with an arbor press---I have used a C-clamp that simulates one and it works beautifully---

[Larry Gibson]

Wally

If you have a drill press then a large bolt with a flat head in the lieu of a drill bit makes for a nice arbor press. I also use a Craftsman drill press intended for a hand drill with my Lee loaders and .22LR Accurizer. Might have to try it with the GC making tool....now you got me thinking:-)

Larry Gibson

[Wally]

I don't have a drill press. I could probably figure out how to use my old Herters press to punch out & form the Gc's...as it is a "C" type of press...or on can use the Lee hand press # 90685

[Larry Gibson]

Wally

You've got me thinking entirely too much!

Larry Gibson

[Wally]

If one can do so and it all works out, it is entirely worth it IMHO

[MT Gianni]

I h ad my 244 HP'd by Buckshot. Because of the check, I can shoot faster alloys than without. I notice little accuracy difference between the 421 and 244.

[stubert]

I have been shooting the 429421 in a SBH and an SRH. full power loads over 296 powder. I have good accuracy and no leading. they are sized to .430 I bought a 429244 mold at a gun show last year but have not tried it yet.

[Wally]

I did purchase a Freechex tool in the .44 Caliber...I have cast some Lyman 429244 bullets and will try it out with aluminum gas checks. The tool works well; I am glad that I got one.

The tool is quite ingenious and makes very nice gas checks. To think most pay 4~5¢ each for them when you can make them for almost nothing. I also have a Lyman .44 Caliber 275 RNF-GC bullet mold that I will also be using now...should work very well in the .44 Carbine & with my .444 Marlin. It drops bulets at .432" which is a bit larger than does the 429244. I cannot wait to see which is more accurate.

[David Wile]

Hey folks,

A little more than a year or so ago, I purchased four of Charlie Darnall's original Freechex tool sets: .30, .357, .44, and .45. I found all four of these sets made perfectly fine gas checks from aluminum soda cans, and have been using them since then. Recently, I found that Charley is now selling a new gas check tool marketed as Freechex II, if I am correct. I watched them being used on several internet sites, and I was fascinated watching them being used with an arbor press.

I really had no need to buy the new version since my original tool sets worked just fine with free aluminum cans. The new version is designed to use aluminum or copper flashing; not real expensive, but not free either. Finally I had to have one of the new models, and I got a Freechex II in .357. I started using it while sitting at the table, and I have finally realized that I really do not need an arbor press to use it. I simply use a small nylon mallet you can purchase at Harbor Freight, and it makes beautiful checks.

Like the original poster, I use the same .44 caliber gas checked mould, and I find my soda can gas checks work the same as my Hornady or Lyman copper checks. For my 45-70, I also use two gas check moulds, and both the soda can checks and the aluminum flashing checks work the same as the Hornady or Lyman copper checks. I have not tried using copper with the new Freechex II since the aluminum flashing works just fine.

Like I said earlier, I was perfectly happy with the first style gas check tool sets I bought from Charlie. I can sit in my recliner chair watching TV and make gas checks all evening. When I saw Charlie's new version gas check maker, however, I was all excited watching a couple of folks making them with an arbor press. When I finally caved in and got a new Freechex II in .45 caliber, I did not have an arbor press on hand at the time and just started doing it with a mallet. Next thing I know, I am sitting in my recliner chair punching out .45 caliber gas checks easier than you can believe. I have now given up on the idea of getting an arbor press. I am perfectly satisfied to sit in my chair and make gas checks while relaxing in front of the TV. And, yes, I still make gas checks with my original tool sets - other than the .45 caliber; I use the Freechex II for the .45s.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile

[tackstrp]

I have the 429421 four cavity mold. I wonder why I don't see more written about the Lee tumble lube 240 grain 44 caliber mold. Is the Lee tumble lube mold not a good shooter? I ask because I think i would like the ligher weight of a Lee mold.

[Lloyd Smale]

if you dont mind gas checks the rcbs 240swcgc is one of the best 44 bullets a guy can make.

[Lloyd Smale]

nope. I about gave up on shooting gas checked bullets without the gas checks. Never got much for accuracy doing it and unless a guy is shooting 500 rounds a day gas checks are a pretty small part of the cost of loading.
Lloyd Smale

I sort of figured that it woudl be...have you tried it without a gas check?

[Wally]

I have the 429421 four cavity mold. I wonder why I don't see more written about the Lee tumble lube 240 grain 44 caliber mold. Is the Lee tumble lube mold not a good shooter? I ask because I think i would like the ligher weight of a Lee mold.

I have had great performance using this bullet in my .44 Special & Magnum loads using a charge of 5.0 Bullseye for the Special & 8.0 of HP-38 in the Magnum... I normally do no size them.

There is no doubt that the lighter Lee molds are easier to use than the heavier Lyman or RCBS molds. I like all three brands, but using the Lee mold is "sweet". I have found it best to wear a good, thick cotton glove and to grip the mold blocks to pinch them togethe,r after dropping the cast bulelts from it. Also, as I like to run my melt temperatues on the hot side, I will dip the open sprue plate into water to cool it after so many casts (as soon as bullet metal begins to smear)--you do so with the bullets still in the mold--dipping the opened sprue plate for a quick dunk--it will not warp it. Also, loosen the sprue plate so that it falls open on its own weight---they come from the factory too tight.

[walker77]

Do you guys use magnum primers with Unique or do you use just large pistol?

[Wally]

Standard Large Pistol

[walker77]

Thats what ive been using, i just wanted to make sure that was right