.40 Caliber Flintlock

[jim4065]

For some obscure reason, I've always wanted one of these. Now that I've scratched the itch - I'm wondering what it's really best at? Have a .32 squirrel gun and a .45 "small" deer rifle, but thought the .40 may be just a good "all-around" woods walking rifle. In Arkansas it's the minimum caliber for muzzle loading deer season, and is also the maximum caliber for squirrels and rabbits. Bought some .395 RB's from Jeff "masscaster" which I hope will fit the bore. Does 50 grains of 3F sound like a good starter load?

[Nobade]

Wow, that's some kind of drop in that buttstock! I bet it's an interesting fit. As for the loads, if it were me I'd drop down to maybe 30gr. FFFg for small game and work up. That ball isn't going to leave much of a squirrel left when it hits. 50gr. probably would be a good deer load though. Just gotta try it and see what shoots the best in your rifle. Have fun!

[Geraldo]

That is a really nice looking rifle.

My 32" .40 GM barrel likes Jeff's .395 RB, .015-.018 patch, and 50gr 3F.

[mooman76]

I'd start at 30 like Nobade said and work up in 5gr increments to the max load. It's the only way to know what your gun will do. I've had a hankerin for a 36 but have so many now I have to justify it to myself. Good luck and hope your new gun shoot great!

[Hanshi]

I got a .40 flint last year and am still working with it. 60 grains 3f & .390 ball with .018 ticking patch lubed with Hoppes #9 Plus seems to be very accurate in my gun and would probably do great for deer at woods ranges. 40 grains shoots well, too, and might be my choice for small game - we head shoot anyway don't we? While I'll still test a bit more, these loads show great promise. In all honesty I think the .40 shoots quite well with most any reasonable load. It appears very omnivorous.

My dedicated small game rifle is a .36 and my dedicated deer rifle is a .45. They are about ideal for these jobs. The .40, IMO, is a GREAT all around rifle when used within it's limitations. It's more versatile than either the .36 or .45 and is one of the best choices for general woods trekking and "everything" rifle work. For targets it's maybe the best. Cheaper to feed than larger calibers, to boot. Power wise, it's comparable to the .41 & .44 magnum revolvers and I've killed lots of deer with both as well as the .357 mag. Don't go around trying to shoot deer at 100 & (plus) yards, aim small and it should do fine. Let us know how things go.

[beemer]

I have had a .40 cal cap lock for about 30 years, it was the first ML that I built. The stock is too heavy, you know all the mistakes the first one has. On the other hand it shoots good, I used a 38 Special case full of 3F for squirrels, that is about 22-23-grs. I shot 1 squirrel with a 40 gr load, I'll not do that again because it turned it into a rag. I killed 1 deer with it several years ago, it was a doe that went about 80-90 lbs. One shot through the lungs at 60 yds. with 55 grs. of 3F and a .395 RB took care of that.

I just finished building a .32 FL , this is my first FL and now I wonder why I waited so long. It is the most natural thing in the world, I fell right into working with the thing. I am thinking about building a .40 next, in fact I don't think I can help it.

Very nice rifle, can you give more info?

beemer

[1874Sharps]

Jim4065,

Very nice indeed! I am curious, about how much does this rifle weigh and about where is the balance point?

[jim4065]

Don't have it in my hot little hands yet. Just "won" the auction today. I'll put more information up when I can check it out completely. In the meantime - here are the rest of the pictures..........:smile:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=138675778

[750k2]

I ran 40 3f in my Baxter Bean and was happy - sold it to a guy in Canada so now
I use my 54 Beck and 50 3f for small stuff and 90 2f for eats.
I really love the 40 though[smilie=b:

[HWooldridge]

The .40 was traditionally a very popular size in ML rifles. I've been lucky enough to handle several original "plains rifles" out of a private collection, which came west to Texas with the settlers and all but one was nominally a .40 caliber (one was approximately .42). In a time when lead was at a premium, the .40 was considered good for most anything smaller than buff and grizz.

I shoot 70 gr of 3F under a patched RB in my .45 with great accuracy and would assume 40-50 gr would be good in a .40.

[JeffinNZ]

I burn Swiss 3Fg exclusively in my .40's.

Caplock: RB, 25gr for 1400fps, 50m shooting, 40gr for 1800fps for 100m.
Flintlock: RB, 30gr for 50m and 45gr for 100m.

[northmn]

I shot a squirrel with my 40 with about 30 grains of GOEX 3f and did not blow him up too bad. It does give about 1400 fps with that charge. 60 grains gave me about 1950 fps. As to how versatile? Depends on where you live I guess. They are great target guns and work as well as anything on small game. Midwestern deer can get a little large for that light of a caliber. Some of the Southern areas have smaller deer where it would be fine. I gathered when turkeys could be shot with rifles, this range of calibers were quite popular.

Northmn

[Potsy]

I just bought a .40 caliber kit.
42" swamped Green Mountain Barrel, MG Flint Lock, maple stock with a Lancaster profile and curl from one end to the other.
I am really chomping at the bit to get this rifle finished but I'm going to take my time and hopefully get it done right by late next spring.
I wanted a .32 but Tip Curtis REALLY recommended the .40 as it is deer legal in TN, and, according to him; easier to make shoot well while not being much harder on squirrel meat.

[Boz330]

I shot a squirrel with my 40 with about 30 grains of GOEX 3f and did not blow him up too bad. It does give about 1400 fps with that charge. 60 grains gave me about 1950 fps. As to how versatile? Depends on where you live I guess. They are great target guns and work as well as anything on small game. Midwestern deer can get a little large for that light of a caliber. Some of the Southern areas have smaller deer where it would be fine. I gathered when turkeys could be shot with rifles, this range of calibers were quite popular.

Northmn

I have a 40 in an Ohio Squirrel rifle. It likes 40gr of 3F for 1700+fps. It will shoot a ragged group at a 100yd over bags, but I shot 1 deer at 90yds and sure won't do it again. Much closer head shots would probably be ok but I have larger rifles that I use for deer and they do a much better job. In a survival situation, hell yes, but if there is an option you can't go wrong with more gun. Why take a chance on wounding and/or losing the animal if it isn't necessary.

Bob

[Ohio Rusty]

I also shoot a flintlock .40. It is a custom made gun, poorboy style. Browned barrel and browned iron furniture. It is very accurate. The load I shoot is a .395 round ball with 65 grains of 3F and a 10 thou's patch lubed with bears oil.
It is a fun caliber to shoot, and will take a deer if the shot is well placed and at a proper distance.
Ohio Rusty ><>

[JeffinNZ]

POTSY: I had the pleasure of meeting Tip Curtis when I visited the US in 2005. Lovely guy. I was sadden to hear his wife passed on a couple of years back. They were both really welcoming of this Kiwi boy.

I dropped this smelly old goat at an honest 100 yards with my .40cal flinter. I think that day I pushed the round ball over 50gr Swiss 3Fg for 1900fps or close to that. He leapt off the rock he was on into the scrub and didn't go any further. Good boiler room hit.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v505/JeffinNZ/Shooting%20stuff/IHgoat2.jpg

I would use my .40's on small deer but what think twice about the larger varieties.

[jim4065]

That's impressive Jeff. I know how tough goats can be because I've had to cull a couple of old Nannies for my Mom when she raised goats. One goat which stood 3 ft at the shoulder I shot from 5 ft away with a 12 gauge loaded with "00" buckshot. The first shot in the heart /lungs rocked her back about a half inch, but she barely moved with the second shot. I had all these crazy ideas about 12 gauge "knock-down" power, so I only took the loaded double barrel - no back up ammo. Luckily, she dropped before I ran to the house and back - but I sure didn't impress my mother with my ability to do a "mercy killing". Incidentally, none of the buckshot exited from the other side. (And these were factory loads.) :oops:

[JeffinNZ]

I only took the shot as 1) I had a good, steady rest and 2) my mate was backing me up with my SKS loaded with XTP hollow points.

[northmn]

How much do the goats weigh? I really have to admit that I do not recommend the 40 for larger game because they seem a bit small to me, but have never shot any deer with it as I have other larger calibers. I still feel that the 40 would be best for "larger small game" such as your big European hares, North Dakota jack rabbits or coyotes. I kind of think around 100 pounds would be a reasonable limit.

Northmn

[Potsy]

JeffinNZ,
Tip is a great guy, at least in what little I've been around him. I was raised about 20 miles from his shop and live about 80 away now. Would have never known he was there were it not for some friends of mine.

As far as shooting stuff with a .40, I plan on whacking a deer with mine, but to me it is definitely a "broadside behind the shoulder caliber". Someday, if I ever get this kit finished, I'd like to build a big caliber English Sporter for a little more thump.

[JeffinNZ]

How much do the goats weigh? I really have to admit that I do not recommend the 40 for larger game because they seem a bit small to me, but have never shot any deer with it as I have other larger calibers. I still feel that the 40 would be best for "larger small game" such as your big European hares, North Dakota jack rabbits or coyotes. I kind of think around 100 pounds would be a reasonable limit.

Northmn

Didn't weigh mine. He STUNK so bad I got close enough to lop off the horns and then ran!

[Hanshi]

Here in Va. .40 is not legal during muzzleloading season; .45 is the minimum :violin:. But the way the regs are written the .40 IS legal during the regular season[smilie=w:!

I use to hunt squirrels regularly with a .38 special revolver using wadcutters at about 770fps and a .45 Colt with 250 grain bullets at 1100fps. Neither did much damage, just made a hole in & out. Even shot one with a .58 prb once with the same results. In my mind the .40 at 1400fps is not unreasonable.

[KCSO]

The 40 is my favorite caliber for off hand target shooting and I have killed deer with one also. Mostly it depends on you if you are a hunter or a killer, if you are cool enough to wait for the right shot and put it in the right place at the right range a 40 will do it all. Otherwise use a bigger gun for deer size game. They are SUPER for calling fox and coyote. I shot 35 grains for rabbit and squirrel and 25 yard target and went to 45 for 100 yard targets.

[jim4065]

You know, I can see that 2 of the bolts (at least) look shiny and tin plated. How do I remove the plating without messing up the bolt? I can use cold blue (or get some brown) but I don't want to screw things up - if you'll pardon the pun.

[northmn]

Generally I can wire brush off the plating with a power tool unit. They are relatively cheap so they can be replaced easily. If metric a simple retapping can work.

Northmn

[jim4065]

Jim4065,

Very nice indeed! I am curious, about how much does this rifle weigh and about where is the balance point?

Finally got here. The rifle weighs 7# 11 oz. The balance point is under the lower ramrod thimble. There were no scratches on the metal (including frizzen) or dents in the wood. I have to believe that it hung on a wall for a very long time. Mounted a flint from the Lyman GPR and got a good spark (and now there are scratches on the frizzen). The bore looks unfired, but the ramrod jag tip fell off when I shoved the first patch down the bore. Got the tip back but the patch is still down there. Usually I just use a wire brush to get back a lost patch but that's not working now. Ordered a new hickory ramrod, a 40 cal worm, and a ball screw from TOW. Looks like the .395 balls may be too tight - so got some .389 RB's coming from TOW as a "back-up".

The front sight is a hooded globe and the rear sight is a strange (but adjustable) peep on the back of the barrel. There's a dovetail for a conventional rear sight, filled with a "filler" plate. The lock looks like new components on an old plate - probably all pretty new. The back side of the lockplate has a distinct crown over a 3. Took a couple of pictures.............

(Sorry about the poor quality - holding the part with one hand while snapping a picture with the other doesn't work well.)

[Long Rifle]

For some obscure reason, I've always wanted one of these. Now that I've scratched the itch - I'm wondering what it's really best at? Have a .32 squirrel gun and a .45 "small" deer rifle, but thought the .40 may be just a good "all-around" woods walking rifle. In Arkansas it's the minimum caliber for muzzle loading deer season, and is also the maximum caliber for squirrels and rabbits. Bought some .395 RB's from Jeff "masscaster" which I hope will fit the bore. Does 50 grains of 3F sound like a good starter load?

I have been using a .32 flinter for squirrels for some 23 years and last year purchased a great .40 from Tennessee Valley Muzzleloading. It's a flintlock Tennessee style with a 42 inch barrel. Different rifles shoot better with different load combos and your best bet is to try them all. I have best accuracy with pillow ticking dry patches and .390 swaged round balls. I wet the patch with saliva and never put grease in my barrel unless I know it's going to be more than an hour between shots. For squirrels the spit-patch is fine. If you're on a deer stand you want to lube it since you might be there all day. As for the charge 25-30 grains of fffg in the bore is perfect for small game and 50-60 grains for deer. The .40 does no more damage than the .32 on squirrels unless you load it hot. Head shots are great but let's be realistic. With the period sights on a fine flinter you're doing great to hit the thing. I have taken squirrels out to 35 yards but if I hit the head it was luck. Most of my squirrels are bagged at about 20 to 25 yards and the 25 grain load works good for me. Good huntin.

[Hanshi]

After finally getting the chance to work with my .40 Lancaster a bit more, I've settled on 30 grains 3f for small game and 60 grains for deer & bigger varmints. The 30 grain load makes finger size one hole groups at 25 yards while the heavier load does that at 50. I intend to take it deer hunting this Saturday. The yearling bucks with their small 4 & 6 point racks seldom get much over 100 pounds or there about. I'll also be better armed for turkey than I would be with my .45.

The .40 holds up well at 100 yards though I can't claim I fire "groups" at that range. With my old eyes about the best I can do at 100 is make "patterns". If I can keep 3 out of 5 in the black I'm doing well. Really doesn't matter anyway as 100 yards is a bit far for a .40 on deer. :lol:

[Long Rifle]

Something that some of you probably already know but was news to me: I have recently been hunting squirrels with my .40 flintlock and here in Mississippi we have stands of water oaks that grow along creek and river basins. The trees do not shed their leaves until mid-March so there is a dense green canopy even in the late fall and winter. The squirrels were so close due to this overhead concealment, some taken at distances of only 30 feet, that I tried something I have always frowned upon,- super-light loading. Yes, underpowered shots are not as accurate as my pet load of 30 grains and the barrel can even slow the ball before exiting if there is not sufficient gas to propel it at a constantly accelerating rate down the bore but at these close ranges it worked perfectly! A tiny dose of FFFg (about 15 grains) was totally effective on the small sitting targets and the rifle made a very mild "ka-chuff" instead of its characteristic bark. I tried a "long" shot of about fifteen yards and still made meat. On the bench however, these light loads proved disappointing. At 25 yards the best group I could muster was three inches. At 15 yards it shrank to just under two inches. Not something you would want to try if you're picking them off out of the tops of trees that are already 25 yards away but it worked up close and I credit the extra mild report of the low-charged rifle for not scattering the game. I filled my self-imposed limit of 4 in about two hours and never moved.

[Hanshi]

Up here in the mountains & foothills the leaves have long dropped so shots can easily be 25 yards. I prefer to go with the 30 grain load which is accurate enough for head shots at that distance. My marksmanship is the weak length. I must say, though, I like the idea light as possible.:coffee:

I have a .36 that will see more use on tiny critters and either 20 or 30 works as long as head shot can be made. :drinks: