Question for the Vietnam vets

[44minimum]

Did you guys try any of that nuoc mam (maybe I spelled that right) fish sauce that they put on a lot of their food? I have read about it in countless books and I was wondering if it is about like soy sauce you get in these Chinese Restaurants?

[Hurricane]

Not anything like soy sauce. Any oriental grocery store will have at least a dozen brands of fish sauce. Those who like it love it. I use it only a few drops at a time and not very often. Get a small bottle and give it a try on a a few things. The taste is hard to describe, think of fermented fish.

[markinalpine]

Not anything like soy sauce. Any oriental grocery store will have at least a dozen brands of fish sauce. Those who like it love it. I use it only a few drops at a time and not very often. Get a small bottle and give it a try on a a few things. The taste is hard to describe, think of fermented fish.

It is also combined with soy sauce, garlic, vinegar, and I don't know what all else to make Worcestershire Sauce.

A little goes a loooooong way.

Mark [smilie=s:

[Beekeeper]

I watched it made one time while I was in Nam.
The post saying fermented fish is right.
You take small fish (anchovy or sardine type) and layer them in a tub with sea salt in between.
When the tub gets full you put a lid on it and place a lot of weight on top.
A folcrum pole with a weight hanging from the end was often used.
The tub is in the sun , the fish ferments(rots) and the liquid that comes out a hole in the bottom of the tub is Nuc Mam .
It is bottled and sold as a fish sauce.

It is an aquired taste and if you do not aquire it it is horrible.


Jim

[chuebner]

Ah yes, the smell of nuoc mam and two stroke exhaust. Two fragrances you never forget.

charlie
RVN 67-69

[StarMetal]

Ah yes, the smell of nuoc mam and two stroke exhaust. Two fragrances you never forget.

charlie
RVN 67-69

Burning the latrine waste in drums isn't so rosey smelling either.

Joe

[Guesser]

It makes a great tossed green salad dressing. Use it like you would a vinigrette(sp?) type dressing. MMMMMMMMMMMMGOOOOOOD!!!!!!!!!

[462]

Nope, never tasted it. As StarMetal said, burning maggot infested latrine drums was never welcome duty, nor did it ever become an acquired aroma.

Remember the locals sucking the inards from rice beetles?

[Poygan]

The first time I smelled it was when our Vietnamese maids were eating and I literally thought the latrine had overflowed. I have heard that there are various degrees of quality and that the higher grade is better (better is obviously subjective).

[wallenba]

It's fermented fish, usually anchovy. They use it on almost anything.

[Beekeeper]

WOW,
It's hard to believe we still remember the smells of the latrine burning and nuc mam and in that order.
Had a pilot tell me one time of a trooper taking some special Nuc Mam back to a special young lady and the bottle broke. They had to land and fumigate the plane before continueing on to Saigon.


Jim

[timkelley]

In my opinion the burning latrine smelled much, much better.

[MT Gianni]

The Thai version we use is terrible smelling and great tasting. We use it in a shrimp/tomato/rice noodle and egg saute. Our Thai exchange student used to cook it and it is great.

[Beekeeper]

It is funny in a way what you remember about Viet Nam after so many years.
We talk about remembering the smell of burning Latrines and the smell of Nuc Mam.
I remember them but the smell I remember the most in Nam was "Lavender".
It was the smell of the Northwest Orient Airlines Flight attendants perfume when I flew out of Nam for the last time.

I could of hugged her just so I could get it more deeply into my lungs but "Fraternizing was not allowed" we were very strictly told.

I remember San Francisco International Airport and the hippies and anti war protesters spitting on us and throwing s$$t at us when we arrived.
I remember the cops laughing and just waiting for us to do something so they could arrest us all.I have often wondered what would have happened if someone had let off a half clip from their M16 (we all had them)

I remember the way my family was treated by the neighbors and the way my kids were treated at school "Your old mans a baby killer" was a nice one compared to some.

I remember the dead returning and even the funeral homes refuzing to accept the body for burial. I remember there not being anyone there help fold the flag and present it to the family.
I see the published accounts of the dead returning from Iraq and the streets and roads lined with people. Of Heros returning!!!

I remember and I will never forget and I will never forgive!



Jim

[Echo]

In Thailand we had num pla prik-ky-nu - num pla = fish sauce; prik-ky-nu literally rat turd peppers, 'cause they were that size. A little went a looooong way.

[oldhickory]

So many things, so different, so horrible, so young. 3/5 69-70

[Rick N Bama]

Ah yes, the smell of nuoc mam and two stroke exhaust. Two fragrances you never forget.

charlie
RVN 67-69

That & poop burning:)

Rick

[pdawg_shooter]

It is funny in a way what you remember about Viet Nam after so many years.
We talk about remembering the smell of burning Latrines and the smell of Nuc Mam.
I remember them but the smell I remember the most in Nam was "Lavender".
It was the smell of the Northwest Orient Airlines Flight attendants perfume when I flew out of Nam for the last time.

I could of hugged her just so I could get it more deeply into my lungs but "Fraternizing was not allowed" we were very strictly told.

I remember San Francisco International Airport and the hippies and anti war protesters spitting on us and throwing s$$t at us when we arrived.
I remember the cops laughing and just waiting for us to do something so they could arrest us all.I have often wondered what would have happened if someone had let off a half clip from their M16 (we all had them)

I remember the way my family was treated by the neighbors and the way my kids were treated at school "Your old mans a baby killer" was a nice one compared to some.

I remember the dead returning and even the funeral homes refuzing to accept the body for burial. I remember there not being anyone there help fold the flag and present it to the family.
I see the published accounts of the dead returning from Iraq and the streets and roads lined with people. Of Heros returning!!!

I remember and I will never forget and I will never forgive!



Jim

Jim, my memories are much the same as yours. Maybe that's why I am bitter and cling to my guns and Bibles.

[atr]

Not anything like soy sauce.........The taste is hard to describe, think of fermented fish.

yea,,,and the burning latrines, the cockroaches, the rats, the buddies lost to "short rounds" and the blood .....
I am with BEEKEEPER....I haven't forgotten and I will never forgive

[10-x]

Big +1 for Beekeeper..........
Yes even after all these years the first smell of RVN I'll always remember is burning crappers.......kinda like the smell of burning flesh, one never forgets it.

As for nuoc mam........always avoided it over there, had to leave the hootch a few times when Mamm-San used it on lunch.........but fast froward to 2 years ago. Had wood floors put in part of the house..........installer was a second generation Vietnamese who brought lunch from a restaurant one of his cousins owned? Yes he had nuoc mam.......but with NO funky smell. Asked him about it, he said the "new" is filtered to remove the smell? Next step was to try some on a traditionl Vietnamese lunch.........have to say it was pretty good.

[Rocky Raab]

The first line of my first Vietnam novel is "It was as if the world had farted in his face."

That pretty much describes Vietnam.

There were and are varying degrees of nuoc-mam. The best cannot even be exported from 'Nam, by law. But you can get many kinds here, even in the average grocery store. The very best restaurant-grade stuff comes from specialty Asian food stores.

The bottle of Thai Kitchen Premium in my frig is almost empty, and even my wife is starting to add it to things. I'll be buying more real soon.

I was bitter for years about the way we were treated. Writing two books just about got it out of my system. Almost. I celebrate every time I hear one of those 70s celebrity protesters dies - and I'll throw a real wing-ding when that Fonda witch kicks it.

[Recluse]

I celebrate every time I hear one of those 70s celebrity protesters dies - and I'll throw a real wing-ding when that Fonda witch kicks it.

Damn straight.

When Fonda finally quits polluting the oxygen we breath, I propose two things:

1. A national re-issue of the Jane Fonda urinal stickers that used to be seen in every latrine and head.

2. A fundraiser to have her sorry, traiterous, communist-loving ass buried under an AAA gun in Hanoi.

I'll throw in for the first $100.

:coffee:

[cabezaverde]

It is funny in a way what you remember about Viet Nam after so many years.
We talk about remembering the smell of burning Latrines and the smell of Nuc Mam.
I remember them but the smell I remember the most in Nam was "Lavender".
It was the smell of the Northwest Orient Airlines Flight attendants perfume when I flew out of Nam for the last time.

I could of hugged her just so I could get it more deeply into my lungs but "Fraternizing was not allowed" we were very strictly told.

I remember San Francisco International Airport and the hippies and anti war protesters spitting on us and throwing s$$t at us when we arrived.
I remember the cops laughing and just waiting for us to do something so they could arrest us all.I have often wondered what would have happened if someone had let off a half clip from their M16 (we all had them)

I remember the way my family was treated by the neighbors and the way my kids were treated at school "Your old mans a baby killer" was a nice one compared to some.

I remember the dead returning and even the funeral homes refuzing to accept the body for burial. I remember there not being anyone there help fold the flag and present it to the family.
I see the published accounts of the dead returning from Iraq and the streets and roads lined with people. Of Heros returning!!!

I remember and I will never forget and I will never forgive!



Jim


I was just a touch too young to go - but believe I would have.

What a disgusting legacy that generation leaves. Being against a war is one thing, but those folks should have been executed.

[1Shirt]

Rocky hit it right! Been all over the orient, but Nam stunk the worst!
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[wallenba]

Big +1 for Beekeeper..........
Yes even after all these years the first smell of RVN I'll always remember is burning crappers.......kinda like the smell of burning flesh, one never forgets it.

As for nuoc mam........always avoided it over there, had to leave the hootch a few times when Mamm-San used it on lunch.........but fast froward to 2 years ago. Had wood floors put in part of the house..........installer was a second generation Vietnamese who brought lunch from a restaurant one of his cousins owned? Yes he had nuoc mam.......but with NO funky smell. Asked him about it, he said the "new" is filtered to remove the smell? Next step was to try some on a traditionl Vietnamese lunch.........have to say it was pretty good.

I understand that Lea & Perrins Worcestershire sauce is fermented anchovy too, and it does'nt smell bad....how dey do dat?

[chuebner]

I remember and I will never forget and I will never forgive!

Jim

I'll never forget but I have been attempting to forgive those students who were educated in liberal, leftist institutions much like today. They were pawns of their professors and the leftist media. What I can't forgive are those who fled the country to avoid service and were given amnesty several years later. That was the ultimate slap in the face to every Vietnam vet. Government sanctioned desertion, burns my A$$ to this day.

charlie

[Rocky Raab]

Worcestershire may have some fish sauce in it, but not much. Nuoc-mam is 100% fish sauce.

Brother 1shirt, you'd love my books. So would most of you - especially if you weren't there and wonder what it was like.

[montana_charlie]

I saw a nuoc mam 'factory' in Saigon, once.
After culling all of the 'trash' out of whatever got trapped in fishermen's nets, the fishes too small (or not good enough) to sell outright were spread on old pieces of corrugated tin...in the shade, with one end raised.
As the fishes rotted, the 'juice' would run down the corrugations to be caught in a long 'pan'.

That is all I know of that 'factory's' process...and all I wanted to know.

I brought home a small assortment of six bits of 'memorabilia' from Viet Nam.
A teak jewelery box for my wife, a knife, a pistol, a small envelope of Polaroids, and a bottle of "numbah one thousand, no smell bad, you-boo-coo-like-too-much-for-sure" nuoc mam.

#1 The box is full of jewelry, a few pieces of which have some value.
#2 The knife is in my pickup, and used every day to cut hay strings when feeding cows.
#3 The pistol is my only semi-auto, so it is the 'bedside gun'.
#4 The Polaroids get looked at (perhaps) as often as once every couple of years.
And #5 the nuoc mam?
Well, it has sat unopened in the rear corner of a kitchen cabinet...just as though it's available for instant use (like the knife and pistol)...in every kitchen we have owned since 1972.
If you hold the cap very close to your nose, you can barely detect a trace of rotted fish smell...or at least it was there last time I checked - about ten years ago.

I don't take a whiff very often because the memories are already so clear and yesterday-like they don't need help from that particular primary sense. The sense of smell is so intrinsically personal and 'immediate' it makes me start feeling jumpy...all over again. It's even more intense than the 'jumpiness' caused by the Air Force's Hueys that fly over the house every now and then.

The bottle will remain sealed forever unless, by some fantastic stroke of luck, I have an opportunity to pour it into the open casket of Jane Fonda, John Kerry, or one of the other famous traitors of the Viet Nam era.

CM

[Lead Fred]

I have an Asian ole lady. I could not read the lingo back then, still cant read it today.

She has piles of stuff in the cubbard, I have no idea what any of it is.

All I know is when I go into a viet market, my stomach still tightens into knots

[Boz330]

I'll never forget but I have been attempting to forgive those students who were educated in liberal, leftist institutions much like today. They were pawns of their professors and the leftist media. What I can't forgive are those who fled the country to avoid service and were given amnesty several years later. That was the ultimate slap in the face to every Vietnam vet. Government sanctioned desertion, burns my A$$ to this day.

charlie

Roger that Charlie. The one that struck me the most back then was Cassius Clay. He didn't leave the country but refused to serve because he didn't believe in violence, excuse me, but boxing is hardly akin to standing around singing cumbaya.
I didn't want to serve but looked at it as my duty and did my time and got out. I'm not sure how they missed me for Nam but I didn't come down on orders till I was down to 93 days. Too short to go at that point.

Bob

[Rocky Raab]

Charlie, your description does not match any nuoc-mam method I ever heard of. Not to say it didn't happen that way by somebody, but the way the nuoc-mam plants made it was as described above: huge clay pots with fish and salt layered inside and allowed to "cure" (you can call it fermenting or rotting, as you see fit) for months. Then it is poured out and filtered before being bottled.

The first stuff through the filters is the clearest and mildest. It gets the highest prices. The last stuff through is darker, cloudier and much stronger.

Nuoc-mam can be made from anchovies, shrimp and more. The finest stuff (never exported) is made from squid.

[Rando]

Welcome home, all of you.

[DLCTEX]

I thank you all for your service, you have my utmost respect.

[Rocky Raab]

We earned it, Dale. I say that not out of bravado, but because no other Americans in history ever fought a war and were hated for it at home. Believe me, war is ugly, but that home scene made it ten times uglier.

[redneckdan]

I'd like to personally say thank you to all the veterans here on this board. I relize at one time in history some people of my age group were less than appreciative when you came back from overseas. Even today a certain portion of academia does its darnedest to continue their legacy of persecution of service men and women, please understand that neither now nor then were these *******s voicing the opinion of the majority. From the deepest part of my heart I thank you.


Mr. Raab, I will be ordering your books as soon as possible, I look forward to learning about your experiences in vietnam. Jen says she can always tell when I am reading 'war stories' she says its the only time I will laugh and cry within the same page.


I encourage all veterans to write their story down. People want to know about you and what you went through. Its not just history, its our American story. I cannot tell you how many times I kick myself for not sitting down with my grandfathers and talking with them to record their story, now I will never have that chance. And its not just the war stories that people want to hear about, I wish I could ask my Opa about life in nazi germany. I do remember him talking about how he refused to become part of the hitler-judeng and because of this his family was persecuted, how he and his brother had to beg on the streets for food. Later on I relized why my mom never took us kids trick or treating on halloween, my mom never when trick or treating when she was young because it brought up painful memories for Opa of what he had to do just to survive. At the time I never stopped to think about how things that happened in the 1930s affect my family to this day, now it makes sense. The internet is a wonderful thing, you don't have to write an autobiography anymore to publish your story. Its as easy as setting up a blog and writing about what you feel like, when you feel like doing it.


On topic- Nuoc-mam is some interesting stuff, best way I can describe it is that it's kind of like salty-garlicy, salty-fish sweat. :shock: Did I mention its salty?

[PatMarlin]

This me and my motodop on the Mekong 10 years ago. Things changed a little since you guys were there.

http://westcoastminisplitter.com/1Mekong.jpg

[10-x]

Well....not exactly nuoc mam.....remember the Baloots?(sp?)
IE; fertile duck or chicken eggs that were left.....shall we say....to fermint.:veryconfu
I recall a "contact team" trip to repair some M-151's and some generators. About 8 of us mechanics were in the back of a Duece-n-a-half with our tool boxes going down the road. Our Motor Sgt. was in the front with a *** who was driving. The driver saw one of the road side stands that sold all kinds of eats. Sarge said we could pull over so we did, most of us got the sugar cane, pinapple or small bannas.........the driver picked out some "Hard Boiled Eggs". Seems the Sarge wanted to have some fun so he motioned for us to be quite. We pushed our tool boxes up to the front of the bed and braced ourselves on the troop seats. Sure enough the *** driver cracked the shell off the 1st "egg" and took a bite.......Well he bit around the neck of whatever kind of bird and the taste must have hit about the same time as he barfed all over the dash, steering wheel and windshield. Sarge already had the door open and was on the running board.........laughing so hard he about fell off. Truck was 2nd gear so it just kind of lugged and went off the road. *** driver was several shades of green by now but did keep the truck from going into the bush(about 100+yards). All of us were expecting a sudden stop but it turned out ok. After rinsing barf off the dash we completed our mission and returned to Long Binh.
A few days later happened to be in the mess hall breakfast line, think it was a Saturday? anyway the grill man would ask how you wanted your eggs as soon as you entered the building......happened to be behind the ***....he saw the eggs and had to leave in a hurry[:shock:/
IIRC we had a saying,"In Vietnam the winds does'nt blow, it sucks".........

[Beekeeper]

No Pat,
Nothing has changed in Nam even today.
It may look diferent but nothing has changed.
"democratic in the daylight, cut your throat for a @20 after dark."
And it never will in a country where the cheapest thing there is is human life.

Jim

[beagle]

Who wants to go back and see that place??? I got enough of that place in the two years I was there. Yeah, I know, should have left it after one. Nuc-mam wasn't so bad with rice and baked minnows after about half dozen beer cans of rice wine sucked through a straw. Tasted pretty good at the time. Sober...that's another story. Stuff smelled like crap.

It's one of those cases where I wouldn't want to do it again but wouldn't take anything for the experiences I had and most of the people I met and served with over there.

I'll never forgive the Armerican people for the way they treated the GIs that served over there. Sure glad they're more supportive of the troops since then./beagle

[Recluse]

I encourage all veterans to write their story down. People want to know about you and what you went through. Its not just history, its our American story.

Dan,

Your gratitude is very much appreciated, please know that.

But for some, writing stories down would do little more than tear a never-quite-healed scab off a deep, painful wound. Put simply, war isn't just hell. That's the romanticism of some officer's line made famous by Hollywood.

In reality, war just flat (expletive deleted) sucks. Period. There is not one goddamn romantic thing about it--and anyone who says differently does so because they ain't never been there.

It's taken me, personally, over 30 years to just now begin talking to non-vets about some of the stuff we did in the military--and that's the fluff and PG-13 stuff. Not sure I'll ever be able to--or want to--talk about the R-rated and X-rated stuff.

Writing it down is out of the question for me. Half the time I try and forget I ever put on a uniform. When I see what our nation and Congress and elected leaders are doing to the Constitution and those who believe in it and defend it, I try my absolute damndest to forget that I ever put on a uniform and put myself in harm's way.

:coffee:

[PatMarlin]

You may be surprised. Lot of Vets go back. Gotta realize over 50% of the population does not even think or care to know about the war. They all want to make a living and welcome Americans.

When I was there and flew into Saigon, one of my partners siad the airport was just as it was when you guys left. 2 guards boarded the plain with AK's in hand checking our Passports. Took them, then hurded us to a Gov commie motel for the night while they checked us out.

Still didn't have the tourist thing all together... :mrgreen:

As for the general population, I was met with open arms where ever we went. Cambodia too.

If I fought in the war (of which I was to young) I don't know if I would want to go back, but lots of guys do and were there.

Aren't the sorry SOB's that treated you guys so badly, pretty much running the show in our Gov today ..:roll:

[montana_charlie]

I encourage all veterans to write their story down.A few years back, I was deeply involved in a forum put together to share information on satelite internet systems...but, there was an Off Topic section.

Several of us started telling War Stories, and you can look through the thread here.
http://www.copperhead.cc/forums/showthread.php?t=6306

It's a long one...

CM

[redneckdan]

Dan,

Your gratitude is very much appreciated, please know that.

But for some, writing stories down would do little more than tear a never-quite-healed scab off a deep, painful wound. Put simply, war isn't just hell. That's the romanticism of some officer's line made famous by Hollywood.

In reality, war just flat (expletive deleted) sucks. Period. There is not one goddamn romantic thing about it--and anyone who says differently does so because they ain't never been there.

It's taken me, personally, over 30 years to just now begin talking to non-vets about some of the stuff we did in the military--and that's the fluff and PG-13 stuff. Not sure I'll ever be able to--or want to--talk about the R-rated and X-rated stuff.

Writing it down is out of the question for me. Half the time I try and forget I ever put on a uniform. When I see what our nation and Congress and elected leaders are doing to the Constitution and those who believe in it and defend it, I try my absolute damndest to forget that I ever put on a uniform and put myself in harm's way.

:coffee:


You are absolutely right. Some people seem to do best if they talk about what happened, shrinks usually call them 'auditory processors' I think. Others do better just to put it out of their mind. I'm currently helping one of my patrol buddies (NSP) transcribe some stuff about his time in Iraq. He wants to give the whole story to his son some day, (son is about 4 years old right now). He tried writing it himself but couldn't do it, it's easier for him to talk about it and then someone else types it up. And you are right, there is no way as some one who has never served that I can ever fully comprehend what he went through. I just don't want veterans to think that nobody wants to hear what they have to say.

[PatMarlin]

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/image001.jpg

[PatMarlin]

I've got a huge photo album of all over the country, and when I came back I showed an old music buddy of mine that I had known for some 25 years. He broked down while flipping through the album and said he was a chopper medic.

Only his closest family knew he served in the war as he never told anyone.

[Rocky Raab]

Recluse, you might be surprised.

I didn't want to write about it, either. But my wife entered me in a novel-writing contest and said to try. The crux of the contest is that you had to write a complete novel in 30 days - no easy task. But like the baloot-eating driver described above, it shot out of me in a torrent. I wrote that first book in 15 days flat. Honest. It not only was a winner, but is now used as a HISTORY textbook at Appalachian State U. Amazing for something that is supposed to be fiction.

By the time I finished the second - and MUCH longer - book, my wife says I was a changed man. The dreams are pretty much gone, I don't get as testy as I sometimes did, and I'm much more laid back, she says. I think she's right.

Right now, I'm writing the whole story of that year and will have it printed for my grandkids to read someday - likely after I'm gone. It feels good.

[PatMarlin]

My buddy had these Vampire teeth, and he would put them in from time to time for shock value. Funny stuff.

Here is shot I took of some kids in Cambodia as we were waiting for aircraft.
Some of the kids figured it out, but it scared the heck out of the little girl covering her mouth.

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/teeth.jpg

[Guesser]

I have become friends with some Vietnamese "boat people" who managed to make it to the U.S. I wish we all had the feeling and patriotism for this country that they exhibit on a daily basis, at PTA, political, 4th of July, religious and every other gathering of any kind.
And I always have loved the foods of S.E. Asia--- Viet Nam, Thailand, P.I., Indonesia, Malay, and India.

[PatMarlin]

This shot caught my eye and was interesting as It was located in an extremely remote, dirt poor province village in NE Cambodia. The house was all teak with a tile roof (very rare), with the little girl inside dressed like a princess- looking boored and wondering what the heck we were doing.

http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/littlegirl.jpg

Still even at that time (97), there were Kmere Rouge hold outs from the 70's and they had just came in and robbed this village for food and supplies the day before.
http://www.westcoastminisplitter.com/N. Cambodianprovince.jpg

[leftiye]

"the million dollar experience you wouldn't give a penny to do it again" "F@#$ it. It don't mean nuthin. Drive on." I still remember what happened when the jet's engines were shut down at Tan San Knut when I came in country (temp went up about 40 degrees - at about seven am.). And the smell when the doors opened.

[PatMarlin]

You guys have my heart felt appreaciation and respect for the hell you went through, so I could sit at home watch TV and go to grade school.
I mean no offence an not trying to brag because I went there. It just is what it is.

[captaint]

I just read every post in this thread. Our entire base smelled like that stuff around noon every day. Those were different days, weren't they guys??
I was in the hospital Memorial Day last year and got talking to one of the nurses. She says "Oh, you were in the military? Well thank you, she says. And I think I had a funny look on my face. The next day before I left, I told her - you know, in forty years you are the only person that ever said thank you. Then she had that funny look on her face..... Mike

[462]

I started writing about my four-years, so the grandkids would understand my reasons for enlisting and volunteering to go to Viet Nam. I didn't get past basic training before I came to the realization that, regardless of my desire to do the project, God didn't give me the talent to be much in the way of a wordsmith. I need to get it done, though. Might make a Winter's project...

Where I live, whether they were boat people or had sponsors, once they got here they quickly became responsible citizens of their communities. Many started businesses, while others were absorbed into the local fishing industry. Their kids performed well in school. Unlike other immigrants, they gladly learned the language and became assimilated. Nor did they make use of social welfare programs.

We all lost part of our youth, but we matured in ways that we wouldn't have, otherwise. I have no desire to return for a visit, but given the same set of circumstances, I'd gladly make the same decisions. I often think of those days. I've no regrets.

I understand and deeply appreciate the feelings of those who would rather not bring up old memories. I didn't walk in their shoes. They have my deepest empathy and eternal gratitude.

[Cowboy5780]

I'd like to extend my personal thanks to all the Veterans, not just the Vietnam Vets of the United States that gave there all for my freedom!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Finster101]

I joined in 79 out of high school and ended up with the 2d ACR. There were still quite a few Nam vets in at that time. They for the most part were not busting your balls about boots not being polished, haircuts, or any of the chicken sh-t stuff. If you were good at your job acted like you had a little sense and proved to be a stand up guy they took care of you, even if it meant pissing of a few "butter bars". Some of older NCO's would tell stories some times, mostly just talking about what had gone down. Usually when something happened that would trigger the memory. You guys have my utmost respect and it was an honor serving with those that I knew.

[Rocky Raab]

That was a most excellent first post, Finster. Crisp salute - from an oak leaf.

[Pathfinder1cav]

Yep, the coming home was the toughest..

In early '77 with a mini-14 in hand at 40 yds. I had the opportunity to nail Hanoi Jane.. did not do it.. tough decision, but we are better than her.

Gen. (Lt. Col.) Moore has been back a couple of times & met with the commanders that opposed us in the Ia Drang & embraced them as brothers in arms.. I can understand that, but personally have no desire to go back.

We were mostly young guys just serving their country as we thought we should, but I saw many acts of courage & was fortunate to have known & still keep a bit of contact with some great fellow Troopers.

Sorry to have lost Gen. Kinnard & Ed Freeman (MOH) in the last year..

[Lunk]

I would personally like to thank all Vets for there service. I was born some years after the war but my father was a pilot over there. He doesn't talk about it much. He's got a couple funny stories of the lighter side of things. But for being in country for 2 tours a hand full of stories can't even scratch the surface of what must have been going on over there. The one thing he does have are hundreds of pictures he took while over there. I've never been to SE Asia but I have to say it LOOKS like some beautiful countryside over there. It's just a shame that so many people had to experience it in such a profoundly bad way. :sad:

At any rate I would like to again thank all servicemen.

Thank you.

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

so, only two of you guys are willing to admit to drawing " Burning Detail" huh? I was in Chu Lai, and later Da Nang in Ranger Companies, and we always ponied up a buck each month and paid the dinks to do it. They burned every day, and yes, the smell is one not every forgotten.

Rich
G/Co 75th Inf (abn)

[leftiye]

Yuh ain't supposed to stand in the smoke! Fer criss's sake! I done it too, it weren't that bad - if you didn't stand in the smoke. Talk about pollution!

[StarMetal]

How many of you got straddled with retrieving dead bodies? My cousin had to do it and said they had some kind liquid they poured on cotton then shove those up your nose to combat the smell.

He has some very interesting stories about that detail. Definitely not for the weak of stomach.

Joe

[EOD3]

Not anything like soy sauce. Any oriental grocery store will have at least a dozen brands of fish sauce. Those who like it love it. I use it only a few drops at a time and not very often. Get a small bottle and give it a try on a a few things. The taste is hard to describe, think of fermented fish.

I think the word you're looking for is "rotten" :rolleyes:

[alamogunr]

I need to add my thanks to all who served, both in Viet Nam and other places. I was of age at that time but accepted a deferment that my employer applied for. We made equipment for the Defense Dept and I was the only engineer in that division of the company. I sometimes wonder how it would have been if I had said "To Hell With It" and gone. If I survived, I would probably have been a better man because of it. Thanks again.
John
W.TN

[Ricochet]

In medical settings, a little oil of wintergreen on a face mask is used to help deal with really bad odors.

[Rando]

so, only two of you guys are willing to admit to drawing " Burning Detail" huh?

I had burning detail also, but in different circumstances. I did it in the desert. Not sure why they insisted on doing it right at breakfast time...

[462]

Not sure why they insisted on doing it right at breakfast time...

Maybe to mask the aroma of breakfast?

[twotrees]

A Duty assignment in Keflivik Iceland, after SEA was a Treat of another flavor.

They made trapping oil out of the fish head and guts after they processed the good parts. They too fermented the mix for who knows how long, then boiled it in huge vats,

The Navy Chow halls there were good food (better than Air Farce mess) and after a good meal, you would walk outside and a gray haze hung in the air.

A great After dinner swig of that would put you off food for at least a day.

"Awwwww the smell of rotten fish in the Morning. It smells like ...... Barf !!!"

To paraphrase.

[carpetman]

twotrees--You are the only person I ever heard rate Navy food over Air Force. Heard Navy guys mention it was a treat on Sunday that you could get your eggs cooked to order. The Air Force pretty much does it every day. BTW I have eaten both and I rate the Air Force food better.

[Rick N Bama]

twotrees--You are the only person I ever heard rate Navy food over Air Force. Heard Navy guys mention it was a treat on Sunday that you could get your eggs cooked to order. The Air Force pretty much does it every day. BTW I have eaten both and I rate the Air Force food better.

I never complained about the AF chow, they did a great job as far as I'm concerned. But then again, I'm one that actually liked the SOS:?

Rick

[MT Gianni]

A Duty assignment in Keflivik Iceland, after SEA was a Treat of another flavor.

They made trapping oil out of the fish head and guts after they processed the good parts. They too fermented the mix for who knows how long, then boiled it in huge vats,

The Navy Chow halls there were good food (better than Air Farce mess) and after a good meal, you would walk outside and a gray haze hung in the air.

A great After dinner swig of that would put you off food for at least a day.

"Awwwww the smell of rotten fish in the Morning. It smells like ...... Barf !!!"

To paraphrase.

CIty kids I used to do the same to run a water trap line.

[Rando]

I never complained about the AF chow, they did a great job as far as I'm concerned. But then again, I'm one that actually liked the SOS:?

Rick

SOS... Haven't heard that in a while! :lol:

I'll raise you one. I liked the omelet MRE!

[Rocky Raab]

I have two rules.

If it's slower than I am, it's lunch.

There are two kinds of food: the kinds I like and the kinds I haven't tasted yet.

Have been pleased to enjoy all three branches of chow. AF was my mainstay of course, and it beat Army chow by a good bit. I had Navy chow only as a special guest, so ranking it might not be fair - but it was very, very good.

In 'Nam, I was so far out that our AF chow hall got the bulk of its food locally, not supplied. So we ate lots of Central Highlands fare. We had monkey noodle soup a lot (truly excellent stuff), water buffalo, dog, jungle rat, fish heads and rice and more. All good, too. The local vegetables were fertilized with human poop, and had a great risk of parasites, but as long as we avoided uncooked stuff, we were fairly safe. I caught nothing, but some guys did.

When we could go downtown, the local French-built hotel was superb. It could have been Michelin listed, I'd bet. But it was only a block from the market - and unless you've smelled a Vietnamese open-air market, you cannot imagine the stench. The drive to that hotel would put you off food - and the drive from it would cause you to lose your food!

Let me summarize it by saying I gained weight in 'Nam.

[SciFiJim]

Rocky Raab, you would make a great cajun (where I grew up). It's been said that they would cook a bulldozer if they could figure out how to peel it. :redneck:

[Rocky Raab]

When I was stationed in Mississippi, I was called an "Imitation Cajun" several times. I felt honored by the sobriquet.

[StarMetal]

twotrees--You are the only person I ever heard rate Navy food over Air Force. Heard Navy guys mention it was a treat on Sunday that you could get your eggs cooked to order. The Air Force pretty much does it every day. BTW I have eaten both and I rate the Air Force food better.

Ray, that's not true, I've told you that. Truthfully I really couldn't rate them as I never ate Air Force chow. When I was in we got eggs to order everyday. Tell me if the Air Force served lobster and charcoal grilled steaks to order?

Joe

[EOD3]

SOS... Haven't heard that in a while! :lol:

I'll raise you one. I liked the omelet MRE!

Kids!!! Can't remember the source but the line was "Meal Ready to Eat, 2 lies for the price of one." Give me a box of rats any day. John Wayne crackers with PB&J, fruitcake (with peach juice), and a four pack of smokes. Tabasco sauce, DON'T leave home without it. :D Just about everything a growing boy needs. [smilie=w:

[462]

I was an Air Force weapons mechanic. That year in Viet Nam, the one time I had a steak was when the shop scrounger traded some of our "tube steaks" to his counter-part in the 101st Air Bourne. Their chow hall never got any! Which proves to me that the Army ate better.

Don't like eggs, so it was SOS for breakfast. A local breakfast/lunch restaurant serves a healthy plate of it, though they use ground beef.

[Rocky Raab]

Just curious, StarMetal - where do they have the charcoal grill on a ship? I've eaten aboard a surface ship, a Trident boat and an attack sub. Never saw a charcoal grill.

Also ate aboard a Brit sub, but they had booze. Made their food a whole lot nicer!

Nor do I think the Navy serves lobster and steak at every meal. None of them do, of course. But I could get steak and eggs twice a week even in the enlisted chow hall at most AF bases, and steak quite often in the evening. Grilled to order, BTW. One could get anything one wanted in the Officer's Club, but had to pay for it.

But this isn't an argument or an attempt to start one. ALL of the services have pretty good chow, considering the circumstances. I think we could say they provide the best they can at the time. There are times when that isn't much, or very good, but it IS the best they can do right then and right there. Even if it's only "Two Lies in One." (Great line, that!)

[montana_charlie]

But then again, I'm one that actually liked the SOS:?

Me, too!
And, that cornbread dressing on Thanksgiving was so good I scrounged up the official recipe and gave it to my wife.

Too bad it makes enough for (like) 150 people...
CM

[carpetman]

Starmetal--Yea Joe you told me you were on a small ship and getting eggs to order was pretty much daily. What I saw and what I've heard others say makes me think your situation was the exception. I have eaten on one Navy base and on one ship and there was a big pan of eggs and they were sloshed on your plate as you went through. I have heard several Navy folks that described it as a Sunday treat. I have Army neighbor that just returned from Iraq and nephew in same catagory--they both told me about getting steak and lobster weekly. I did eat at one hospital chow hall that had steak weekly, but I have never seen lobster at an Air Force chow hall (oh new name aerospace dining facility---thats a chow hall). The troops now live in dormitories---they were barracks in my day, but they are different; more individual type living.

[montana_charlie]

In 'Nam, I was so far out that our AF chow hall got the bulk of its food locally, not supplied.
Likewise, sorta...
I was on top of Nui Ba Den, over on the Cambodian border. Chopper to get in...and to get out.

The chow hall at Ton Son Nhut provided milk, eggs, and bread...flown up every two weeks, when troops rotated between the mountain and their home units.

Our main fare was intended to be C-rations, but our senior NCO had contacts with various Army mess halls in the region. He would scrounge all manner of stuff...including the occasional case of steaks...and buy a variety of packaged groceries from one of the exchanges.

He managed to put on two hot meals every day. Breakfast (courtesy of the Air Force) and some kind of pretty good vittles in the afternoon.

I helped out in the kitchen occasionally, and one day we decided to use up a bunch of boxed 'mexican stuff' that had been around for awhile.
We called it 'tamale pie'...but it might have made a suitable substitute for foo-gas.

CM

[44minimum]

Wow. All I wanted to know was what fish sauce tasted like. Maybe we should start a thread called Vietnam war stories or just war stories and you veterans could post an interesting or funny story whenever you think about it or felt like it? I always find them interesting whether they are true or, shall we say, slightly embellished.

[Beekeeper]

You guys have never eaten Navy chow ,I can tell.
None of you mentioned green eggs and ham.
You must have been in the airdale navy.
Real sailors often never ate breakfast as the smell of the eggs was rather overpowering.
Not as bad as nuc mam but almost the same as cooking baloots.


Jim

[Rocky Raab]

44, it is NEVER hard to start a genuine conversation about anything military - wars in particular.

Remember though, that while fairy tales always begin with "Once upon a time," war stories always begin with "This is no chit..." Either one is a hint that whatever follows is make believe, LOL!

[Rocky Raab]

Beekeeper, out in the boonies, the eggs had no smell. No taste, either. They were powdered eggs.

We got powdered eggs, powdered milk and often powdered coffee. None of it worth ingesting.

This is absolutely true: ask ANY soldier, sailor or airman returning from a war zone what he'd like first and missed most, and the answer isn't sex - it's a glass of ice-cold real milk. Honest.

[Recluse]

This is absolutely true: ask ANY soldier, sailor or airman returning from a war zone what he'd like first and missed most, and the answer isn't sex - it's a glass of ice-cold real milk. Honest.

Not me. First thing I wanted was a COLD beer. Not room temperature beer. Not lukewarm beer. Not beer "chilled" in a stream. Not beer "cooled" by a fire extinguisher.

I wanted a COLD beer. A beer so COLD it gave me a headache AND a sore throat at the same time.

I have never liked milk--of any temperature.

:coffee:

[acemedic13]

The first thing I do on a jump is sleep on the ride, the first thing I do before patrol is pci/pcc's,The first thing I drink after a tour is an ice cold beer, then the next morning a TALL COLD GLASS OF MILK! Without fail. Then onto REAL CHEESE and REAL EGGS!! Thanks to all you guys who fought a thankless war for a thankless country. Were working off your backs and hard fought battles.

[Beekeeper]

Rocky Rab,
Then you should have taken the time and ridden a destroyer or 2 once in a while
Eggs were at least 20 years old and left a green fog on the chow line when cooked.
Everything was instant as there wasn't any storage room on one of the old destroyers (2100 Class). It was go fast shoot first and last and eat crap. But wouldn't trade the experience for any bird farm afloat.

[Boz330]

But this isn't an argument or an attempt to start one. ALL of the services have pretty good chow, considering the circumstances. I think we could say they provide the best they can at the time. There are times when that isn't much, or very good, but it IS the best they can do right then and right there. Even if it's only "Two Lies in One." (Great line, that!)

I think all the chow started out as good food, but trying to feed 200 guys in a hurry and the cooks maybe not giving a darn about how it was cooked changed all of that. Usually when we had steak, and it sure wasn't once a week, there wasn't enough to go around so they usually served it Saturday or Sunday night when a lot of the guys were gone. I knew some of the cooks pretty good and and I could get precooked chow to go and took it to a buddy's place off post and cooked it there. There were certain things that they always had to much of and I could trade for it.
As far as rations some of the C's I thought were pretty good, but the LRPS were the best in my opinion all the way across the board. I have had some of the MREs but I still like the LRPS better. They were great for hunting.

Bob

[Rocky Raab]

Beekeeper, we all did things that were truly horrible - but which we wouldn't take anything to have missed. The food must be included in that.

We got a truckload of steaks at Ban Me Thuot once - a day before the freezer broke down. For many days, we ate nothing BUT steak. But, every day they picked the stuff that was the most nearly spoiled and used that. You might like your steak well aged in a great restaurant, but ours was always quite a bit beyond "aged." After two weeks, they had to throw out most of it because we simply could not stomach another bite of it.

When I went on leave, on the very first night at my parents' house, they served me a huge steak. I literally had to run from the room with the heaves.

Along with that truckload of steak, the one thing we had WAY too much of was booze. We had a tiny but complete bar, complete with bartender, waitress, pool table and movie theater. The beer was always cold and all mixed drinks were 35 cents. (The place was a shack, the pool table felt was infused with CS gas, the only movie on site was "McClintock" and the waitress was as mean as a rattlesnake; so don't get too jealous!)

[Beekeeper]

Rocky Rab,
Were you Air Force or Navy.
Do you know what ransoming the pilot for ice cream is.
On search and rescue one time off the coast of Nam we rescued an Air Force pilot and asked the ransom of 10 gal of ice cream.
The Air Force refused to pay so we kept him.
He lived in a crew quarters and ate in the general mess.
Had him in a fire room tending a boiler and in an engine room and had him do work on the lower level where the temps routinely reached 100 degrees.
Had him 5 days before the admiral made us give him up.

About 2 weeks later when we went for the morning refuel he came back aboard via high line and personally delivered 15 gal of ice cream and 2 cases of steaks.
Washed the windshields, left a letter with the captain and returned to the oiler via high line.
Thanked the crew for saving his life and for the education he got as to what it took to get the job done.

When I went in country for duty I tried to look him up and found that he had been rotated due to injury.
Would like to have met him and talked about his time on the tin can.


Jim

[Rocky Raab]

Yup, I had heard of the ransom. I was AF.

I'd consider ten gallons of ice cream cheap for an AF pilot. The reason there is no such ransom the other way is that Navy guys had no value.


(Just kidding. Naval aviators are superb, and I marvel at their skills.)

[Larry Gibson]

Wow. All I wanted to know was what fish sauce tasted like. Maybe we should start a thread called Vietnam war stories or just war stories and you veterans could post an interesting or funny story whenever you think about it or felt like it? I always find them interesting whether they are true or, shall we say, slightly embellished.

I tried it several times at different locals in country and across the border. Since it was almost always locally made the taste was always somewhat different in each local. I didn't really care for it but on some bland foods a few drops spiced (mostly salted) it up. I never really cared for Tabasco suace like many did either. Though I like spicey food I just never developed a taste for either. It is not something I would go out of my way to get and since I've not used it in 40+ years I guess that says where my sentiments on it are.

As to war stories, I could tell a few. Some are fun to embelish but the real war stories need no embelishment. The stories of comraderie and gallentry of our fighting Soldiers and Marines against a determined enemy under most often very austere conditions needs no embelishment.

Larry Gibson

[StarMetal]

Rocky Rab,
Were you Air Force or Navy.
Do you know what ransoming the pilot for ice cream is.
On search and rescue one time off the coast of Nam we rescued an Air Force pilot and asked the ransom of 10 gal of ice cream.
The Air Force refused to pay so we kept him.
He lived in a crew quarters and ate in the general mess.
Had him in a fire room tending a boiler and in an engine room and had him do work on the lower level where the temps routinely reached 100 degrees.
Had him 5 days before the admiral made us give him up.

About 2 weeks later when we went for the morning refuel he came back aboard via high line and personally delivered 15 gal of ice cream and 2 cases of steaks.
Washed the windshields, left a letter with the captain and returned to the oiler via high line.
Thanked the crew for saving his life and for the education he got as to what it took to get the job done.

When I went in country for duty I tried to look him up and found that he had been rotated due to injury.
Would like to have met him and talked about his time on the tin can.


Jim

Your engineering spaces must have been air conditioned. Try 148 degrees on the ship I was aboard.

Joe

[Beekeeper]

Small ship ,small engineering space, had scoops made to funnel air down the manhole so some relief.
Still no place to spend time if you didn't have to.

Jim

[Ricochet]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,553520,00.html

[PatMarlin]

Hmmm... that story sounds fishy to me Ricochet.

[MT Gianni]

Not unusual with a low oxygen situation. Make sure it's safe before going after a downed comrade in any tank is SOP.

[Rocky Raab]

Yup. Fermentation processes generate carbon dioxide, which is heavier than air. A tank with an opening only at the top would likely contain zero breathable air. Brewing vats of all sorts are notorious for suffocating unwary workers.

Back in 1986, in preparation for the first Space Shuttle launch at Kennedy Space Center, three workers entered the engine compartment of the orbiter Columbia. That compartment had been purged with nitrogen, and all three were knocked out immediately. Only the last guy in could be revived and the other two died.

[scrapcan]

I have opted to put this response here as this is where it began for me. It most likely should go int eh war stories thread but I will not put it there.

I have read this through many times in it's entirety and could not sit long enough to put my thanks in the reply space.

I am far to young to have any true connection to RVN. I do however have close conenction with 2 uncles who served along with you other marines, soldiers, airmen, and sailors. As a very young kid (4 yrs old) I got the chance to go with my uncles fishing. One is a marine the other is an airman. Both were in country with the rest of you. One came home with one other member of his company via medivac through california on the way to wyoming due to having to call in a strike on their position. The other was communication/ soldier readiness as he calls it (he got to help prepare and board our fallen to return home).

What I want to relay is like others my sincere thank you and appreciation for all of our marines, soldiers, airmen, sailors, and coasties.

To continue from above at 4 years of age and being no happier than any kid could be ( that was 1975) I was on cloud 9. Until a group of people spit on us while buying fishing tackle in a town here in Wyoming. My uncles handled it in utmost fashion. Both gave a salute to the other. There was more but I will never forget the pride they showed to each other at that moment. I will also never forget how they were treated "AT HOME".

I am 38 now and it has taken me 34 years to be able to tell anyone of that moment, but like others have mentioned somethings are as vivid as it just happened. It is not true war but it is the result of the same. I went to college in the same town as the incident and instantly recognized one of the individuals I never let them forget either, that person is the only one who knew other than my uncles.

I know this is of no account and I am not one who has been there. But Again what I want to relay is like others my sincere thank you and appreciation for all of our marines, soldiers, airmen, sailors, and coasties.

[OutHuntn84]

It's fermented fish, usually anchovy. They use it on almost anything.

So it's alot like tabasco sauce here in the south!

[Ricochet]

At my hospital they keep bottles of Texas Pete all around the cafeteria and anywhere there's food. A good dousing of that works on most anything.

[MT Gianni]

Manley, I am reminded of an incident that happened when I was 13 [1967] on the Wyoming-Utah border. We were fishing and some friends of a friends brother and pal were near and fresh from Nam. They had gone through some debreifing or quiet time AIR but it was less than 3 weeks from their war time. Antelope season opened and shots were fired near enough to hear and identify as gunfire. When we looked around these two guys were in the water up to their noses actively looking around and no one heard a splash. I have wondered about the process that could make one that aware and reactive yet never been sorry I missed out on it.

[Rocky Raab]

Trust me, it never goes away. It's been 38 years now, and I occasionally still react to some sounds with an adrenaline rush. My wife has learned the painful way to never ever touch me while I'm asleep, for example.

[montana_charlie]

I live out in the country, among the network of Minuteman missile sites maintained by personel at Malmstrom, AFB in Great Falls.
One of the silos (Launch Facility) is seven hundred yards north of my house.

While people usually visit the site in wheeled vehicles, there is regular, if infrequent, helicopter traffic to, or past, the location. The sound of the Huey is unmistakeable, and that's what they use.
I get that old 'jumpy' feeling every time one comes by...

CM

[Ivantherussian03]

Trust me, it never goes away. It's been 38 years now, and I occasionally still react to some sounds with an adrenaline rush. My wife has learned the painful way to never ever touch me while I'm asleep, for example.

I am not Vietnam Vet, but I served my country as a 12b.

I had a terrible instance pts, over 10 years after getting out. It was a terrible month of irrational thoughts and behaviors; it started when I watched Saving Private Ryan. It lasted about month, then just stopped. I dont watch those movies now.

Sounds get me going....everytime......