Lee 310 gr GC .430" mould....

[Bucks Owin]

I ordered this mould today and wondered if anyone else has used this bullet in .44 mag handgun loads....

Opinions? Advice? Recipes?

Dennis

[Johnch]

I used that bullet to harvest 2 deer last year ( 05 season ) .
I casted them out of 40-1
I pushed them reasonable fast and got good grouping .

I also use that bullet cast out of WW+1% tin for hogs and other heavy bullet needs , like ringing the gong at 400 yds from the 444 Marlin Encore barrel . :mrgreen:

Johnch

[Dale53]

I and Frank Siefer (the "F" in F&M Reloading) designed that bullet. I took the first head of big game with that bullet (nice 10 point corn fed whitetail - color it delicious!).

A number of the "hot shots" at my local club have shot groups with this bullet in .44 mag revolvers at 100 yards that are almost not to be believed. Suffice to say, one dandy extremely accurate and hard hitting bullet.

I have not shot it a longer distance than 100 yards so cannot comment on really long range accuracy.

Lee puts this high performance bullet is your hands for just a few dollars. Incidentally, I have no financial interest in Lee. Just admire some of their products a great deal.

Dale53

[Bucks Owin]

I and Frank Siefer (the "F" in F&M Reloading) designed that bullet. I took the first head of big game with that bullet (nice 10 point corn fed whitetail - color it delicious!).

A number of the "hot shots" at my local club have shot groups with this bullet in .44 mag revolvers at 100 yards that are almost not to be believed. Suffice to say, one dandy extremely accurate and hard hitting bullet.

I have not shot it a longer distance than 200 yards so cannot comment on really long range accuracy.

Lee puts this high performance bullet is your hands for just a few dollars. Incidentally, I have no financial interest in Lee. Just admire some of their products a great deal.

Dale53

That's terrific! I was intending to work up a good hunting load with it for elk or hogs but maybe it'd make a silhouette load too huh?

Thanks for the info!

Dennis

[Dale53]

I corrected my statement: It should have read, "I have not shot it a longer distance than 100 yards (not 200 yards)...

Sorry for the error.

Dale53

[drinks]

It casts nice and clean.
I load H110, 19gr gave 1470fps and 20gr gave 1550fps.
It is not very accurate in my Handirifle, it casts only .430 in ww's and my barrel is .431, really need to be .433 to properly engage the MG rifling, even the gc does not help a lot.

[Dale53]

drinks;
You might want to try "Beagleing" your mould for that oversize barrel. A couple of thousandths can make a serious difference.

Dale53

[JohnH]

drinks, I had the same problem with My 44 Handi, my barrel was .432, it wouldn't even stabilize it at all. I got keyholes even at 25 yards. My Marlin 94 however will put the only load I've tried with it into 2" at 50 yards. It shot very well out of a Ruger Blackhawk I had for a while. Good Boolit :)

[Ranch Dog]

Dale...

Thanks and I appreciate your work on the bullet design. It is the bullet that got me into casting and led to my TLC432-285-RF for the 444 Marlin which has led to other designs for other cartridges chambered in Marlin rifles.

For the TLC432 I simply added the Micro-Bands and increased the diameter .002". Of course, nothing is simple as you have to consider all the effects on the targeted cartridge such as OAL, case powder capacity with the bullet as cast, etc.

A met a fellow on the baitshopboyz.com forum that lived in San Antonio and hunted with the 444. He sent me a box of the C430s and that was it. Even though the bullet was a bit undersized it shot well out of my 444P if it wasn't pushed hard. Here is an image of my first target sighting in the bullet and rifle...

http://home.awesomenet.net/~ranch-dog/Firearms/Images/444P01.jpg

The image is a bit fuzzy but the first shot in the lower left was just to see if I hit paper and then I shot the 5-shot group which was very impressive. The last shot was adjusting the rifle for a 100-yard zero. Not bad for the first 7 boolits out of the rifle and it was at 100-yards! This was with 41.0-grains of RLD7 and I believe the velocity was about 1900 FPS. The boolit was cast with 1/1 WW/LT.

I shot a couple of critters with it... hogs and my friend continues to use it in his Winchester big bore. He has killed a trailer full of deer with it. It's a little more suitable in the Winchester 444s as they have a tighter bore. Cast with the linotype mixed alloy (which delivers a slightly larger diameter) it fits pretty good.

Good work!

[Ranch Dog]

I ordered this mould today and wondered if anyone else has used this bullet in .44 mag handgun loads....

Opinions? Advice? Recipes?

Dennis

Dennis, I believe Lee's Modern Reloading II has some suggested loads for the bullet chambered in 44 Mag. If no one offers them up, I will post them on Tuesday when I return home.

[Bucks Owin]

Dennis, I believe Lee's Modern Reloading II has some suggested loads for the bullet chambered in 44 Mag. If no one offers them up, I will post them on Tuesday when I return home.

Thanks amigo. I'll be using this boolit in a 10" Blackhawk BTW....

Dennis

[Junior1942]

Bucks, here's some info: http://www.castbullet.com/reload/lee310.htm

[TCLouis]

This bullet sized to 0.431" and gently placed in front of some my OLD (H 110 Speed) batch of WC 820 has given me the best groups out of my SRH at 50 yards. In fact better than some MOST 25 yard groups that I liked with other bullets. Also easily holds minute of clay pigeon at 100 yards.

I used 18.5 grains (NOT a loading recommendation) of my OLD SLOW lot for the best group, though more of this lot could be used, the group was not as good.

The bullet is fat enough that I have to load to the top crimp groove in the SRH and RH (lots of cylinder capacity not used) and this limits case capacity, but from the holes left in wet clay at 100 yards, I think the bullet is moving along quite smartly even out there.

[BruceB]

...and sized down to .424", this boolit also works well in my .404 Jeffery. It's danged near a wadcutter at that diameter, and cuts nice clean holes. Yesterday I shot a five-round 100-yard group of 1.6", muzzle velocity 1680 fps.

[Poygan]

I could not adjust the sights on my 29-2 (8&3/8 bbl) to get it to shoot to POA. At that time, it was my only .44 so I filed the mold sufficiently to eliminate the gas check. The boolits weigh around 265-270 grains now. Haven't used it much since then. With the 29-2, I was reluctant to push the loads over the recommended charges.

[454PB]

This is my favorite boolit in my .44 magnum handguns. One thing to watch for, it is sooooo long, it has to be pushed down in the sizing die as far as possible. If not, it may actually drag on the cylinder throats on tighter guns. I've recently been using my newly acquired Star sizer for these, and since the boolit passes completely through the die, it's not a problem.

My mould casts these at .431" to .432" depending on alloy......guess I lucked out.

By the way, Bucks, I checked my 10" Ruger flattop .44, and mine is serial #119XX

[Bucks Owin]

This is my favorite boolit in my .44 magnum handguns. One thing to watch for, it is sooooo long, it has to be pushed down in the sizing die as far as possible. If not, it may actually drag on the cylinder throats on tighter guns. I've recently been using my newly acquired Star sizer for these, and since the boolit passes completely through the die, it's not a problem.

My mould casts these at .431" to .432" depending on alloy......guess I lucked out.

By the way, Bucks, I checked my 10" Ruger flattop .44, and mine is serial #119XX

I'm sure glad to hear all the positive reports on this projectile! (My five dollar word for the day...heh heh)

454PB, my throats are big at .432 to .4325" so it oughta be about perfect. Wonder how your FT can have such a low number and be a 1961 while mine is 239XX and supposedly a 1960 model? Guess I'll call Ruger for a letter once I get a round tuit, sometimes the story is kinda interesting.
I'm gonna "tee off" with a 50/50 WW and lino mix and power 'em with SR-4759 or H-LilGun. (Which I've found to be an EXCELLENT heavy bullet powder in magnum cases BTW)

Junior, I remember reading your real interesting story quite awhile back while surfing the web one day. Glad to find it again and look forward to the succesful conclusion!

Thanks for all the great replies and data!

Dennis

[ambergrifleman]

I currently use that mould to make bullets for my Swiss Vetterli with very good results. with 21 grains of 2400 powder under it. :-D

[454PB]

Sorry, Bucks.....I got some numbers swapped. Mine is 191XX and made in 1959.

I cast this boolit from 75% WW and 25% lino with excellent results, and straight wheelweights works good too.

[Junior1942]

Junior, I remember reading your real interesting story quite awhile back while surfing the web one day. Glad to find it again and look forward to the succesful conclusion!Bucks, I haven't seen hide nor hair nor tracks of my old boar in about a year. I also saw a much younger boar about 200 yards from the scrape tree mentioned in the article. He wouldn't have tolerated that. I suspect he's dead.

[snowtigger]

The only Lee mold I ever liked. I quit buying .44 molds after I found this one.:-D

[Dale53]

I blush[smilie=1:

Dale53

[azrednek]

I tried some 300+ gr 44 mag slugs a friend loaded several years ago when he was knee deep into silhouette shooting. I don’t recall if they were cast from the Lee mold or commercially produced. I do know they are definitely not for the recoil sensitive shooter. The loads were almost manageable in my friend’s 10 inch Dan Wesson but out right painful in my S&W 4 inch model 29. Might be ok in your huge Blackhawk but you might want to keep a bottle of Advil in your shooting bag!!

[Dale53]

asrednek;
Frankly, the 300 gr bullets full tilt in my 4" 629 are just flat BRUTAL! I swear I can feel the gun "unscrewing" from the bullet:mrgreen:

However, in either my Model 29 S&W 8 3/8" barrel or my 7 1/2" Red Hawk (both wear a scope) they are not too bad at all for hunting. They do give me all the recoil that I need...

Dale53

[Blackwater]

I too like the Lee and other 300's, but in my OM Super Blackhawk, they're as pleasant, if not even moreso, than the fully loaded 240's. I DO feel the twisting of the gun in my hand more, but it's more of a good, hard "shove," as Elmer would put it, than the 240's, which are more "spirited" in the speed of their recoil.

But then, SA's do recoil quite differently than the DA's, regardless of make. I don't know if I've got a tiny spur in my wrist or what, but Smiths hurt my wrist, while I can still shoot the Ruger SB all day long without discomfort, even with full loads.

[Dale53]

Blackwater;
I am probably a "heretic" as I have put Packmayr grips on ALL of my heavy recoilers. Smith's hurt the base of my thumb with standard grips. I haven't hurt myself since I installed them. I even have them on my snubbies. I've got a new S&W Airweight and might even put some on it. I'll have to give it a workout, first. Concealment is important - don't want to excite the population, you know.

Dale53

[Bucks Owin]

My old 10" Flattop Ruger .44 wears an XR3-RED gripframe from one of my Single Sixes at present. The stock XR3 gripframe beats the hell out of my middle knuckle!

Alas, since I want to shoot some "production gun" silhouette with this sixgun, I guess I'll have to reinstall the stock gripframe....

OWWW!!!

Dennis

(The "redesigned" gripframe gives about 1/8" more "knuckle clearance" behind the trigger guard for you folks not well versed in Rugers. The .44 "Super Blackhawk" of later vintage has the square back "dragoon" gripframe....)

[44man]

Bucks, I love that boolit and it shoots great with 21.5 gr's of 296 out of my Blackhawk. Fed 150 primer ONLY. I have shot a pile of deer with it too. I just can't get H110 to shoot from the Blackhawks but it is the only powder for the standard Redhawk. The SRH also loves 296.

[drinks]

The bullet would be great for me, except my Handi rifle has a .431" MG barrel and I need at least a .432+ bullet of hard alloy for any accuracy.
I have beagled the mold, but it did not do .433" with the alloy I use before starting to fin badly.
It casts .430 as it came.

[Bucks Owin]

Bucks, I love that boolit and it shoots great with 21.5 gr's of 296 out of my Blackhawk. Fed 150 primer ONLY. I have shot a pile of deer with it too. I just can't get H110 to shoot from the Blackhawks but it is the only powder for the standard Redhawk. The SRH also loves 296.

I'll give that recipe a try amigo!

FWIW, I did a little experiment awhile back with W-296 and H-LilGun behind the RCBS 250K boolit. Used Win cases and WLP primers. 22.0 grs gave me 1401 fps with the 296 and 50 fps more with the LG at apparently less pressure, and slightly better accuracy. I'm really stuck on LG in heavy boolit loads. Have you tried any?

Best,

Dennis
who is wrapping his middle knuckle in anticipation of firing some of these stump thumpers! :-)

[Bucks Owin]

The bullet would be great for me, except my Handi rifle has a .431" MG barrel and I need at least a .432+ bullet of hard alloy for any accuracy.
I have beagled the mold, but it did not do .433" with the alloy I use before starting to fin badly.
It casts .430 as it came.

Maybe they'd "bump up" if cast out of a softer alloy?

Just a thought,

Dennis

[snowtigger]

I blush[smilie=1:

Dale53

I kid you not. I've got two different versions of the Kieth bullet, and two other gas-ckeck molds, but the 310 Lee is the only one I cast nowadays.

[Dale53]

snowtigger;
That is gratifying to hear. One of our goals, years ago, when we first thought of this project was that we would make a "custom" serious bullet available at working men's prices. We did just that. A bonus is we ended up with a really accurate bullet that spawned a forty five Colt 300 grainer, also. Frank gets a lot of the credit because he put up the money for 25 moulds. They sold well, so he came out just fine.

I have a prototype 180 gr GC RF .358 bullet mould on my bench right now. Frank had Lee make it up and then fell ill and required open heart surgery with many complications following. After several years he seems to be getting MUCH better and maybe, just maybe we can get Lee to proceed after we do some tests.

Dale53

[44man]

I confess to never trying Lil gun because I get such good results from 296. I plan on getting some but I am always kind of broke. I read a lot of good things about the powder so it will be a new job for this year.

[TCLouis]

Does this bullet look anything like the 35 180 CGC RNFP that LAR45 had made up a couple of years ago?

Any chance we could see a picture of it/do a mold run?

I Love the 310 but the nose is so fat it will NOT let me seat a round when the bullet is loaded to the lower crimp groove in my SRH. I will likely NEVER need the powder capacity gain anyway as it seems to be very good at drilling big deep holes in dirt. Maybe next year I will get a chance to hunt with it! I do not see stopping it in any TN deer no matter what the entry point and angle.

Plenty accurate and with the 18,5 grain loading is very VERY accurate in the SRH a kicker in the RH and kicks like heck in the SBH ( sure glad I got rid of the knuckle buster grip!)

[Dale53]

TCLouis;
I'll try to cast some bullets with it in the next few days (no promises as I have guests here until Friday and I leave for a weekend match at Etna Green, IN (ASSRA .22 only matches). It could be next week. I'll try to get some cast, if possible this week.

Dale53

[454PB]

I Love the 310 but the nose is so fat it will NOT let me seat a round when the bullet is loaded to the lower crimp groove in my SRH.

I had the same problem, and if you read my earlier post in this thread, you'll see the solution. This boolit is so long, it doesn't size completely in the Lyman sizer dies. That long nose section will stay oversized and cause it to bind in the throats of the cylinder. I have to size and lube in two steps, because lube will come over the top of the boolit nose if done in one step. The other solution is to use a Star sizer which pushes the boolit completely through, sizing full length.

I also have the Lee .452 300 grain GC that Dale53 refers to, and it has the same characteristic. It also is just as great a boolit!

[Bucks Owin]

Oh Happy Day!

My mold arrived at last. I'm sure looking forward to trying some of these stump thumpers. Sure is an impressive looking boolit Dale53!

I can practically hear the "thump" now.... :-)

Dennis

(I'll bet it could slam some steel too!)

[Bucks Owin]

Bucks, I love that boolit and it shoots great with 21.5 gr's of 296 out of my Blackhawk. Fed 150 primer ONLY. I have shot a pile of deer with it too. I just can't get H110 to shoot from the Blackhawks but it is the only powder for the standard Redhawk. The SRH also loves 296.

I'm gonna give W296 a try right out of the gate now that I have some boolits.
This sounds fairly "full tilt".
Any suggestions for a possible silhouette load that won't wear me out for an afternoon's shooting? I've got lots of HS-6, some LilGun and some SR-4759 on hand. I want to go burn some powder, not do a 70 mile round trip to town! ;-)

Also, it looks like I can crimp in either groove and have enough cyl length. (And my throats are plenty large enough to handle it) Which groove is normally used?

Dennis

A little Unique left too....

[Bucks Owin]

I too like the Lee and other 300's, but in my OM Super Blackhawk, they're as pleasant, if not even moreso, than the fully loaded 240's. I DO feel the twisting of the gun in my hand more, but it's more of a good, hard "shove," as Elmer would put it, than the 240's, which are more "spirited" in the speed of their recoil.

But then, SA's do recoil quite differently than the DA's, regardless of make. I don't know if I've got a tiny spur in my wrist or what, but Smiths hurt my wrist, while I can still shoot the Ruger SB all day long without discomfort, even with full loads.

FWIW, I noticed less "apparent recoil" with a 300 XTP or Sierra at 1100 than I do with a 250 at 1475....

Dennis

[454PB]

Bucks, in my guns, this boolit shoots best when seated long (crimped in the rear groove). Your results may vary.

If you want a milder load, let me cast my vote for Bluedot (love that stuff). About 12 to 13 grains should get you 1100 to 1200 fps in that 10" barrel. I've gotta confess I shoot nothing but mild loads in my 10" Flattop, it's just too valuable.

For my Redhawk and this boolit, it's all out with H-110, WW 296 and Lil'Gun.

[Vegas Vince]

I just recieved the mold from F&M last week along with several other's. Hope to cast some this week if time allows.

Vince

[Bucks Owin]

Bucks, in my guns, this boolit shoots best when seated long (crimped in the rear groove). Your results may vary.

If you want a milder load, let me cast my vote for Bluedot (love that stuff). About 12 to 13 grains should get you 1100 to 1200 fps in that 10" barrel. I've gotta confess I shoot nothing but mild loads in my 10" Flattop, it's just too valuable.

For my Redhawk and this boolit, it's all out with H-110, WW 296 and Lil'Gun.


Thanks pal. HS-6 is fairly close to Blue Dot, maybe I'll give it a "shot". Funny, I've never tried Blue Dot even though I like Green Dot in shotgun and .38/357 target loads. A friend talked me into a bunch of HS-6 from his raving over his 250K loads with it but I'm not as keen on it as he is. I can't get the SD that he claims, pressures jump easily and the stuff smokes like black powder! Oh well....
I'll get some Blue Dot and try some SR-4759 as well.

I confess, that I too like to run the old FT at less than full throttle although the velocities seem to stay up well with the long barrel...
LilGun and SR-4759 are pretty easy on it pressure wise....

If I end up as "gung ho" with silhouette shooting as I do with most shooting endeavors I'll probably look for a NM Blackhawk* and retire "ol Betsy" from full time duty.

Thanks again,

Dennis

* Perhaps a .45 Colt Hunter. I love that caliber, wish there was a 10" version. (Why not since it's a "hunting" sixgun?) I toyed with the notion of a Clements .45 conversion on "Betsy" but his price and my conscience kinda nixed that idea.... ;-)

[DX250]

I was reading through this thread as i am going to buy this mould, i noticedthe 12 to 13gr suggestion on bluedot and just wanted to let you know that in my modern reloading book lists max of 10.7gr at 1110fps and 34900psi 1.6"oal. 5.7" barrel that is the same data form alliant.

[chunkum]

This boolit is so long, it doesn't size completely in the Lyman sizer dies. That long nose section will stay oversized and cause it to bind in the throats of the cylinder. I have to size and lube in two steps, because lube will come over the top of the boolit nose if done in one step. The other solution is to use a Star sizer which pushes the boolit completely through, sizing full length.

I also have the Lee .452 300 grain GC that Dale53 refers to, and it has the same characteristic. It also is just as great a boolit!

I haven't this particular bullet, but have encountered the problem with one or two others. The Lee sizing dies are inexpensive and can also be used as a second step to get the long fat nose of the bullet down to "sub-throat" size after first lube/sizing/gc-seating operation in the Lyman 450 or in the RCBS of similar mechanism.
Best Regards

chunkum

[Newtire]

Seated to 2.500" with 44.5 gr. RX-7 in my Marlin .444, that bullet goes inside 1" @ 50 yds. & kills on both ends. I cast out of wheelweights & these were air-cooled & lubed with liquid alox.

[454PB]

I don't argue with any loading manuals, but I looked at my chronograph data for .44 magnum. I went as high as 14.5 gr. of Bluedot with this boolit in my Redhawk, and 13 gr. in my old Herters S.A.

These are my loads AND NOT RECOMMENDED in any other guns!

I agree, the Lee sizers are an excellent solution to sizing these extra long boolits.

[Bucks Owin]

My Lee mould dropped some nice boolits yesterday with a pretty soft alloy of 80% pure "ML type" lead and 20% linotype. Resulting bullets can be easily scratched with a thumbnail. (Yes, I know, I need a hardness tester some day). Dimensions were .430" at the front "guide portion", .432 at the front band and .434 at the rear band. A mix of 50/50 WW and lino should result in an even smaller boolit shouldn't it? Like almost "tumble and shoot"?

Whatcha think,

Dennis
who swapped off his Lee .430" sizer in trade and is waiting for a .430" sizer for his Lyman 450.... ;-)


Oh!!! BTW, which nose punch is used with this boolit? (I guess just about anything would work on that big ol' meplat! LOL)

[454PB]

ML lead is muzzle loader? If you up the lino content to 50%, you end up with an alloy close to wheelweights. The more linotype in the mix, the larger the diameter.

I make my own nose punches, but I think the punch for 429421 will work. As I recall it's a little tight and puts a small ring on the nose.

[MT Gianni]

Grind the flats off of a 1/4" bolt and use it as a toppunch. Gianni.

[Bucks Owin]

Thanks guys.

Yes, after casting some more yesterday with a high lino content, they miked a thou or so larger than the 80% pure lead (Muzzle loader soft).

I have 421 punch and I have plenty of 1/4" bolts. (good tip!) Now I'm just waiting on the .430" sizer for my 450 and some gaschecks.......

In the meantime, maybe I'll see how much lead scrapes off the first batch loaded unsized with two coats of Lee Liquid Alox and shot plain base at reduced velocity....

I'm kinda impatient to get this load developed to try out on the steel in two weeks!

Dennis :Fire:

[handy458]

Does anyone use this without the gascheck? I was curious about the accuracy. I was considering this for my 4 5/8 Ruger at about 1150-1200 or so. Sorry fellows, I know I'm a little cheap.

[454PB]

Yes. In my previous post where I mentioned using Bluedot in my old Herter's .44 magnum, they were shot barefooted. No leading and excellent accuracy. The only glitch was that they hit 8" higher at 25 yards than the 250 grain loads the gun was sighted for. They shot so well that I reset the sights for the heavier Lee boolit.

By the way, that load chronographed 1158 fps. in my 6" Herter.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=932&d=1139523847

[handy458]

Thanks 454 ..............I'll give it a try then.

[MacGregor]

what's the Lee top-punch for this mould?

thanks

[454PB]

Lee doesn't make top punches. You have to find a Lyman or RCBS to fit. As I mentioned above, I think the Lyman 421 will work, or you can use MTgianni's idea and cut a bolt head off.

[MacGregor]

sorry, the lyman top punch...

[Bucks Owin]

Well, my .430" Lyman sizer still isn't in and I want to get some idea of velocities/pressures etc as my "Silhouette season" starts on the weekend. I'm gonna fire some of these barefoot over 17.0 grs of LilGun later today. I'll let you know results...

Dennis

UPDATE: 1100 fps, mild pressure, 3" group @ 25 yds (but it's likely my fault, wasn't having an "on" day). Recoil less than full tilt 240 gr loads...Leading minimal (Tumbled in LLA)

[Ed K]

snowtigger;
That is gratifying to hear. One of our goals, years ago, when we first thought of this project was that we would make a "custom" serious bullet available at working men's prices. We did just that. A bonus is we ended up with a really accurate bullet that spawned a forty five Colt 300 grainer...Dale53

Hello all I'm new to the site and casting. I was looking for a heavy 45 and caught this comment. A search on "452-300-RF" turned up nothing on this site. Any more info available on this bullet?

Ten or more years ago I got turned off on Lee after a bad experience with some of their reloading tools and switched to RCBS & Dillon. I'm getting the feeling that their casting products are a little better quality - especially the 6-hole molds and would be willing to give one a try

Thanks, Ed

[MacGregor]

i just bought the 430-310-RF 6 cavity LEE mold... took about 10 tries to get used to it, and get it heated up, but after that it was smooth sailing.. cast over 100 keepers first session, and that was not a solid run, it was while i was cleaning a bucket of wheel weights and casting ingots at the same time. The 6 cavity molds are great, just wish they made them with the hollowpoint pin as an option... heh

[9.3X62AL]

Welcome aboard, MVESK.

I am pretty impressed with the Lee 6-cavity molds I have--for the price, the quality is certainly there. The Lee 1- and 2-cavity molds I have run from half-decent to dismal. I think Buckshot (one of the moderators, he lives close by and we shoot together) once said that he considers the smaller Lee molds to be "disposables", and that's probably the best way to view them.

[454PB]

mvesk, I use the Lee C452-300-RF in my .454 Casulls and .45 Colt. Excellent bullet and a .45 caliber version of what this thread is about. Be aware that it casts heavier than 300 grains, in wheelweights mine are around 315 gr., and after applying a gas check and lube they go 320 to 325 gr.

My Lee "disposable" moulds have been in my casting room for up to 30 years and some have cast 10,000 boolits.

[Dale53]

I firmly believe that the path to longevity with the Lee moulds is good lubricant. In fact, all moulds can use a "spare" amount of lube at the "contact" points. The best lube I have found for this purpose is Bullshop's sprue plate lube (a recent addition to my "kit of tricks"). It does NOT build up and "burn on" as everything else I have tried does (creating all kinds of problems).

After application, following Bullshop's instructions, you WILL get some wrinkled bullets but it soon burns the excess off but the Lee two cavities alighnment surfaces remain slick and easily come together correctly. The stuff really has worked for me.

Dale53

[Bucks Owin]

I firmly believe that the path to longevity with the Lee moulds is good lubricant. In fact, all moulds can use a "spare" amount of lube at the "contact" points. The best lube I have found for this purpose is Bullshop's sprue plate lube (a recent addition to my "kit of tricks"). It does NOT build up and "burn on" as everything else I have tried does (creating all kinds of problems).

After application, following Bullshop's instructions, you WILL get some wrinkled bullets but it soon burns the excess off but the Lee two cavities alighnment surfaces remain slick and easily come together correctly. The stuff really has worked for me.

Dale53

Yep, when Lee blocks don't want to align it's because they need a little lube on the pins in my experience.

I've just been using bullet lube but it does tend to "wander" if applied carelessly. While I'm finding a source for some Bullshop lube, I wonder if a soft carpenter's pencil or some graphite would work?

Dennis

[chunkum]

the carpenter's pencil does help quite a bit.

[Dale53]

Before I got Bullshop's lube, I used Rapine Mould Release. It is nothing more than microfine graphite in denatured alcohol. It worked well, but not as well as Bullshop.

Bullet lube did not do it for me - baked on and as soon as it got hot lost its lubricating ability (in spite of the fact that Lee recommends it).

Dale53

[Ed K]

Thanks for the warm welcome and quick comeback. The response on this forum from you fellas is impressive!

Still welcoming any and all comments about my original question however I'm feeling bad about hijacking Dennis' "44" thread and just wondering about a pointer to the specs and/or a drawing for this mold/bullet. Lee does not appear to have such details on their site.

Thanks again, Ed

[Dale53]

The Lee C452-300-RF is nearly a carbon copy of the C430-310-RF bullet. I don't have drawings of it but you can get an idea from the picture on the Lee web site:
http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1146715428.1363=/html/catalog/bullmol2.html

I have a two cavity mould for this and a Ruger Bisley Vaquero but have not yet worked with this bullet (don't need a high performance bullet for Cowboy Action Shooting). I expect it will do everything that a feller needs doing with a .45 Colt in a strong (Ruger) revolver.

There is loading data for similar bullets on:
http://www.sixguns.com/tests/tt45lc.htm

Load the bullet as long as your cylinder permits (just like the C430 in the .44 magnum which I HAVE shot a good bit of ) and use an appropriate dose of H110, W296, or Carbine Ball (WC 820) "For the ride of your life"!)

Dale53

[JudgeBAC]

Just received my Lee C430-310. I cast a bunch this morning using 50% lead 50% linotype. They cast .434 but only weighed in at +-298 gr. I sized them to .430 since my throats measure .431. I hope to shoot them this weekend depending on the weather. Like others I had some problems with getting good bullets cast smoking the molds and using bullet lube as a lube per the Lee instructions. I haven't tried the fixes listed elsewhere on the site. I am a little reluctant to use the comet since my bullets are already casting large but I may try enlarging the vents and losening the sprue plate. I plan on ordering some Bull Plate Lube but havent gotten around to it yet. The Lee molds do seem to like higher temps or it could be the alloy I am using. Any thoughts on enlarging the vents and losening the sprue plate? By the way great design - kudos to the designer. This is a great looking bullet. Thought I would try N100 and 2400. Any other suggestions for powder?:castmine:

[Junior1942]

Go by a NAPA store and buy a can of spray "Dry Graphite Film Lubricant" called "dgf 123." I believe the NAPA # is 765-1413. It's high @ ~$9 but worth every penny. Spray it all over your mold *except* inside the cavities. Spray the bottom of the sprue plate and close it, and it will wipe graphite on the top of the blocks. It works.

Someone on this very forum gave me the tip several months ago.

[Dale53]

JudgeBAC;
I recently put a couple of new Lee moulds into use. I normally clean a new mould with brake cleaner spray then wipe carefully with a paper towel. My new moulds did not appear to have ANY preservative on them. However, it appears that they did and the brake cleaner did NOT remove it. It took FOREVER before bullets started to cast well. They had the appearance of trying to cast bullets with an oily mould. I perserveered (that means I kept on casting:mrgreen:) and FINALLY everything started to go together. Of course, the next time I will not have that problem.

In the future, I will do what I used to do. I will take a new mould, just before casting, into the sink and scrub it with detergent and a toothbrush. That WILL remove any preservative and I won't have to go thru that miserable "breaking in" period. You might try the same thing...

One caution, make sure that the mould is dry before you introduce it to molten bullet metal....

FWIW
Dale53

[Bucks Owin]

Just received my Lee C430-310. I cast a bunch this morning using 50% lead 50% linotype. They cast .434 but only weighed in at +-298 gr. I sized them to .430 since my throats measure .431. I hope to shoot them this weekend depending on the weather. Like others I had some problems with getting good bullets cast smoking the molds and using bullet lube as a lube per the Lee instructions. I haven't tried the fixes listed elsewhere on the site. I am a little reluctant to use the comet since my bullets are already casting large but I may try enlarging the vents and losening the sprue plate. I plan on ordering some Bull Plate Lube but havent gotten around to it yet. The Lee molds do seem to like higher temps or it could be the alloy I am using. Any thoughts on enlarging the vents and losening the sprue plate? By the way great design - kudos to the designer. This is a great looking bullet. Thought I would try N100 and 2400. Any other suggestions for powder?:castmine:


I like Hodgdon's LilGun for the heavier boolits in most any handun caliber. (Especially .357) I think it'll do anything H-110 or W-296 does but at lower pressures in most cases...

I'm curious as to whether Alliant's new "410" powder might be in the same league although they publish no handgun data for it yet. A look at the shotshell loadings of both companies shows "410" might be slightly faster than "LilGun" but shows similar velocity/pressure curves....

After all, LilGun was developed as the "ultimate" .410 bore shotshell powder....(hence the odd name) Maybe if they renamed it something like "BigThunder" or "NukeBlast" or some such, a few more handgunners would be apt to give it a try in heavy boolit/mag case handgun loads! :-D (Tongue firmly in cheek...)

Dennis :Fire:

BTW, since I already PM'd de Judge regarding LG/310, I'm just using his post as a "launching point"....

[Dale53]

Dennis;
Frankly, I would like to try some "LilGun" my self. However, I have LOTS of WC820 that I paid $3.50 per lb and it is working extremely well. I just can't bring myself to pay $20.00 lb (local price) for something that may not give me anymore than I already have.

Dale53

[454PB]

Dale53:
I use both WC820 and Lil'Gun in my revolvers. In .454 Casull, Lil'Gun will exceed the velocities safely generated by WC820 by a considerable amount, less so in .44 magnum, but still there. I've had the Lee 310 up to over 1400 fps. in my Ruger Redhawk using Lil'Gun.

I agree with you, WC820 is a great all around powder for these calibers, and I shoot a lot of it. For full out maximum effort loads, Lil'Gun is THE powder. Most of us seldom need that last 100 fps. from our handguns, but if you want it, try the Lil'Gun.

Between my supply of these two powders, I haven't bought any H-110 in several years.

[Bucks Owin]

Dennis;
Frankly, I would like to try some "LilGun" my self. However, I have LOTS of WC820 that I paid $3.50 per lb and it is working extremely well. I just can't bring myself to pay $20.00 lb (local price) for something that may not give me anymore than I already have.

Dale53

Funny you should mention that! I was thinking of ordering some of that reclaimed powder myself. Prices on most ALL components are ridiculous...

(LG is $22.95 around here...:roll: )

Dennis

(454 PB I haven't bought any H110 either for awhile. I do have some "old" W-296 on hand though and LG definately "outpowers" it with 240 gr and heavier .44 boolits...)

[Dale53]

454PB;
>>>I've had the Lee 310 up to over 1400 fps. in my Ruger Redhawk using Lil'Gun.<<<

When I first started hunting deer with a .44 magnum, I would practice with a 1200 fps load and hunt with a 1300 fps load. However, I got lazy one trip and didn't bother to load the heavier ones and just used my 1200 fps load. After the trip, I asked the deer if he noticed any difference. He didn'nt answer (LOL):mrgreen: .

You know, I believe Elmer was correct. 1200 fps is enough for most things. The heaviest big game I will shoot with a revolver is a deer (up to 300 lbs around here - corn and bean fed, you know). I can shoot clear through a deer end for end with the 1200 fps load. I really don't think I need more.

However, that is just one man's opinion. If I were hunting elk, moose or bear, I am relatively sure I would load the 310 Lee up to the highest velocity that is safe.

Dale53

[454PB]

Me too, Dale53. I used to hunt Elk with a handgun when I was younger and tougher. I carried my Redhawk in a shoulder holster for many miles until my ribs were black and blue. It seemed every encounter with wapiti was beyond handgun range, and I began wearing the rib rubber less and less and carrying a rifle more and more. In the gazillion miles I carried that gun and others, I never shot anything bigger than a deer. I did finish off several Elk I had downed with a rifle, but that could have been done with the Keith loads.

But I was damn sure ready if the opportunity arose.:Fire:

[Newtire]

Bucks, here's some info: http://www.castbullet.com/reload/lee310.htm
Hi Junior,
Just wondering about that "black-bore" condition. Is that a coat of evenly applied leading?

[Bucks Owin]

FWIW, 22 grs of LilGun gives me 1450 fps with an RCBS 250K boolit in my 10" barrel. This is a potent load fore and aft with pressures appearing only moderate...

Junior, I'm curious about "black bore" too...

Dennis

[JudgeBAC]

Ruger Bisley Hunter .44 mag. 4x Leupold Scope. :Tried two loads today. Didnt have time to load up a lot just wanted to see if I was in the ballpark. First load was 13.5 gr. 2400, RP case; WW primer. This one was all over the lot. Looked like a shotgun pattern. A good friend of mine says 2400 is a great powder with plain base bullets but he has never had much sucess with 2400 and gas checks or jacketed. The next load is very exciting. 17 gr. N110; RP case; WW primer 5 shots into 1.5 inches at 50 yards (with 4x scope). This is a mild load with no pressure signs at all. I plan on trying 17.5 and 18. I'm not sure where this load will top out. I have similar groups with 300 gr. sierra flat point and 18 gr. of N110.:castmine:

[Junior1942]

>Hi Junior,
Just wondering about that "black-bore" condition. Is that a coat of evenly applied leading?

No lead at all. It's a coat of evenly applied burnt lube.

[Newtire]

Bucks, I love that boolit and it shoots great with 21.5 gr's of 296 out of my Blackhawk. Fed 150 primer ONLY. I have shot a pile of deer with it too. I just can't get H110 to shoot from the Blackhawks but it is the only powder for the standard Redhawk. The SRH also loves 296.
Hi 44 Man,
What is the OAL of that bullet with this load?

[454PB]

Good for you. This shows what a great boolit this is, it just needs some load development.

[Bucks Owin]

Hi 44 Man,
What is the OAL of that bullet with this load?

Just thought I'd remind you there are 2 crimp grooves if that is a worry to you...

Dennis

(Trying 17.5 grs LilGun with it tomorrow)

[Newtire]

Just thought I'd remind you there are 2 crimp grooves if that is a worry to you...

Dennis

(Trying 17.5 grs LilGun with it tomorrow)
Just wanted to know the OAL so as to not "deep seat" the bullet & cause dangerously higher pressures. I was down in the garage cycling some empties with bullets seated to determine which .44's will feed in the new Ruger carbine I bought. It just happens that the Round section of the "RF" of that bullet lets me seat the bullet way out there to end of magazine limits without the bullet getting "Nicked" as it does with the SWC's I tried. I can go 1.645" with .010" to spare & the magazine still feeds. With the SWC's, they will feed without the knicking but they are seated deeper and was trying to minimize the "jump" to the rifling. Looks like the Ranch Dog design may be the hot ticket for this gun. The Lee 310 RF was a bit heabier than I had wanted but it sure feeds great. Will be next weekend before I get freed up enough to touch off a few rounds anyway.

[drinks]

Yesterday I reamed my Lee 310 out to .435", have a bunch of bullets sized .433" ready to load tomorrow and likely shoot Wednesday.
See if the extra size stops the MG Handi barrel from keyholing the 310.