Temperature of lead for casting

[smokeeater]

I am new to casting bullets, but have melted lead before for other things.
I just purchased a Lee mold for 50 caliber REAL bullets, and have no idea
how hot the lead should be to cast good bullets.
I have always just dipped out the lead for what I was doing as soon as it
reached a melted state.
Is there an easy way to tell when it is at the proper temperature for
casting bullets? Thanx for any suggestions......

[docone31]

My .50cal., R.E.A.L.s are great!
I run my pot at full tilt. I heat my mold so when I pour, it takes six seconds for the sprue to "freeze". I float my mold in the lead to preheat it. The R.E.A.L.s drop right out of my mold.
Before I cast with my Lee molds, I soak them in mineral spirits for two days. I just let them sit in it. I get lots of aluminum flakes in the bottom of the container.
If they are frosted when they drop out, worry not. Frosting is good!
Essentially, crank up the heat in the pot, preheat the mold, watch the sprues for the freeze. The center should pull in at freezing. At that moment, desprue.
I use a wood dowel to push the sprue plate. Do not smack the mold! If I have to, I tap the mold to drop. Sometimes they hang back, but not always.
Do everything gently.
Do not smack the sprue plate! Just push with the dowel directly the sprue freezes.
One thing I have learned with Lee Molds, relax.
I have my Lee Bottom Pour Pot on a concrete paver block, if I need to push the sprue with the dowel harder than it should, I rest my mold against the block to push the sprue. Do not smack it!
The way to determine when the mold is up to temp, pour lead into it. The sprue should take six seconds to "freeze". That is my way. I get some great castings out of it.
You will not need to smoke the mold. Soak it in mineral spirits for two days, cast away! Smoking made no difference at all in my casting. Of the smoking techniques, a BIC lighter works better than a candle, or match.
My molds have not been smoked!
Welcome to the madness, and enjoy the ride.
Let us know how you do.
I made my lube for my R.E.A.L.s. Stinks but effective.
Beeswax, corn oil, crisco. No fouling, easy loading, cleans up fast with hot water.
Mix the corn oil into the beeswax untill it is the consistancy of Vaseline. Add Crisco to stiffen it.
Makes good leather care also.

[geargnasher]

Smokeater, do what Doc says but add one thing:

Do not cast with your new Lee mould without some sort of quality sprue plate lube or you will have a galled, sticky, smeared mess of a sprue plate and mould blocks within the first dozen casts, and it is a pain to fix. This problem with aluminum moulds is compounded at the temps required for good fillout and light frost.

Many folks here absolutely swear by Bullplate (sold at the Bullshop, link at bottom, detailed info in "sticky" on shooters.gunloads.com page), I've been using something else that works very well until I can get some Bullplate.

Gear

Btw, it's not so much the pot temp that's so important, it's more the MOULD temp that determines how well your boolits turn out.

[runfiverun]

i like to start my aluminum molds so hot i can get bored waiting for the sprue to harden and i just pour out the lead i then give the thing a good wipe down inside and out with a damp rag then go to casting.
i also have to keep the rag handy throughoput the session.
don't be afraid to mix in about 1% tin with your lead for good fillout.

[Shiloh]

The proper temperature is the one that produces good boolits. Alloys will vary this some.
I like to cast as cool as possible but sometimes have to turn up the heat for complete
fill out.

SHiloh

[winelover]

The proper temperature is the one that produces good boolits. Alloys will vary this some.
I like to cast as cool as possible but sometimes have to turn up the heat for complete
fill out.

SHiloh

Well said. I gave up on my thermometer years ago!

Winelover:coffeecom

[mooman76]

What's a thermometer? I concider it a handycap. Allot of the newer casters act like they can't cast without them. You learn how hot the lead should be buy how your bullets are coming out. If you are casting with pure lead you need more heat and can get away with more because real soft lead doesn't frost as easy as the alloys.

[geargnasher]

A thermometer is the same thing in casting as blinders and 2"-tall barrel ribs are to trap shooters. It's the new craze. I've been tempted to buy one solely for the purpose of notating the temp at which each mould/alloy combination is happy, and the size of the end result. I often find myself casting slightly too hot near the end of a session and get quite a few undersized culls. Also I use Lee pots and their thermostat is all over the map, especially on a full or near-empty pot.

Gear

[snaggdit]

Everytime I am told on here I need to get a thermometer I agree and tell myself I need to get one but to this day I haven't. I'm beginning to agree that as with anything, as you get comfortable and more knowledgeable having to know the exact temp is not that important. Would it have helped me as I was starting out? Probably, but there were lots of other helpful things to buy as well. Only so much money to go around and soooo many molds...:-o

[geargnasher]

Everytime I am told on here I need to get a thermometer I agree and tell myself I need to get one but to this day I haven't. I'm beginning to agree that as with anything, as you get comfortable and more knowledgeable having to know the exact temp is not that important. Would it have helped me as I was starting out? Probably, but there were lots of other helpful things to buy as well. Only so much money to go around and soooo many molds...:-o

Exact temp is kinda like exact alloy: For most applications other than hunting or defense, who cares? Just stay in the ballpark, if you know where the ballpark is (this is where I need some help at times!) I DID invest in a Lee hardness tester awhile back, been wanting one for years, but it didn't end up actually solving any problems at all. I wasn't having alloy issues, so it turned into just something else to check and monkey with.

Gear

[XWrench3]

basicly casting thermometers, lake any thermometer, will vary somewhat. it will also depend on the alloy (unless you are using pure (100%) lead. which, for a m.l. is what you should be using. anyway, basicly what i have found is to start off HOT, and cool down until everything gets "just right". exactly where that is is very varyable depending on every little thing that can change. if you are using a thermometer, record exactly where that temp is once you find it, so you can save yourself a bunch of trouble next time!

[BruceB]

After casting for forty-two years, I STILL don't have or need a thermometer.

The methods I use produce satisfactory bullets, at least for my uses.

Wheelweight alloy accounts for at least 95% of my casting activity, and I run my RCBS pot at maximum temperature all the time (about 870 degrees...I checked once, just out of curiosity).

I don't need a thermometer.

[snuffy]

In the first place, the lee R.E.A.L. boolit HAS to be cast from pure lead for it to work as it's designed to work. At least for front loaders. It's stepped driving bands are made to engage the rifling gradually upon loading, then the boolit shortens upon the charge firing to further engage the rifling.

Pure lead must be cast very hot. I do have a thermometer, but have never turned the dial on any of my lee pots to max to see how hot they'll get, (when I was using the thermometer.) But that's where the dial would have to be to cast the real boolit with pure lead.

I've never had a pure lead boolit frost. They're always shiny. As for how the real boolit shoots, as good as any quality conical muzzle loading boolit, and better than most. That's in a 45 TC Hawken flinter, a 50 TC Hawken percussion, and a Ruger 77/50 inline.

[sqlbullet]

A thermometer is hugely valueable to me....Not for determining what to do, but for re-producing it once discovered.

For my alloy, without adding any tin, I need to run the temp between 700 and 750. Any colder and I get wrinkles, hotter and I get fins.

If I add 2% of tin, then I can drop that temp to 650-700.

I agree that a thermometer isn't useful for figuring out how to do it the first time. But it is great for helping ensure that the first cast is 6 good bullets.

[geargnasher]

A thermometer is hugely valueable to me....Not for determining what to do, but for re-producing it once discovered.

For my alloy, without adding any tin, I need to run the temp between 700 and 750. Any colder and I get wrinkles, hotter and I get fins.

If I add 2% of tin, then I can drop that temp to 650-700.

I agree that a thermometer isn't useful for figuring out how to do it the first time. But it is great for helping ensure that the first cast is 6 good bullets.


You get fins at any temperature, it is a mould problem, not a temperature problem. The only accessory a boolit should ever have dropping from the blocks is "whiskers" or whatever you want to call them that form when it's filling out so well the vent lines begin to fill.

Gear

[qajaq59]

hotter and I get fins. Ahaaa..... Yesterday I had one of my molds suddenly develop a tiny little fin that was never there before. When I read your note it dawned on me why. I had gotten busy doing something else and I let the pot get a lot hotter then normal on warm up. Then I didn't wait long enough for it to cool back to where I normally cast. I'll bet the fin goes away at the right temp. Thank you much.

[sqlbullet]

You get fins at any temperature, it is a mould problem, not a temperature problem. The only accessory a boolit should ever have dropping from the blocks is "whiskers" or whatever you want to call them that form when it's filling out so well the vent lines begin to fill.

Gear

Agreed...It is a mold problem. Caused by those whiskers that come with high lead and mold temps.

Here is the sequence as best I can infer.

Lead and mold get over 750° and whiskers start. When the bullet drops from the mold, one or two of the whiskers break free from the bullet, and get crossed up on a vent line. Next poor, there is now a little gap since the whisker keeps the mold from completely closing. Since the lead and mold are very hot, and stay fluid longer, more lead seeps into that space, and the process repeats. Pretty soon I have a visible 'bugger' stuck to the mold, and 6-12 bullets with mohawks.

Don't have this issue if I keep the temp lower.

[1Shirt]

I cast as hot as the pot will go. I want a little frosting, and agree with Paco Kelly that at least some frosting helps to hold the lube. Also agree with use of Bullplate on all molds, think it is about the next best thing to dry toilet paper and sliced white bread.
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[theperfessor]

+1 for 1Shirt. I never use a thermometer for casting, just turn things up until I get good boolits.

I can see the use of a thermometer for smelting WWs, especially if you're worried about zinc and don't sort your WWs before smelting.

BullPlate is great, one of the best products bullet casters can use to speed production and extend useful life of molds, especially aluminum ones.

[Marlin Junky]

If you only use one alloy and one electric furnace there's little need for a thermometer (until something goes wrong with your furnace). However, different size mold blocks/mold cavities can require a little heat adjustment and this is where a thermometer might help. Adding a thermometer to your tool kit is a consistency aid, but not a necessity unless you're breaking in a new furnace that needs calibration. 760F is a good starting point for a neophyte ladle caster (it's easier to slow the casting rate than to speed it up) but the mold should be preheated to avoid long runs of rejects which can influence a premature decision to fiddle with the thermostat. I find a thermometer eases my casting when I switch alloys and/or try to repeat a bullet weight/hardness (or even diameter) that I was shooting months or even years ago. Being able to measure something promotes knowledge of that something... it's your choice.

MJ