Good for the goose but not the gander?

[jonk]

Bullet lube accomplishes a few things. It acts as a bit of a gas check, provides a film in the bore on which the bullet can 'float' down the barrel, and leaves a residue for follow up shots, all of which cut down on metal fouling, i.e. leading. I'd suggest it acts much like an oil in your engine in that regard, meaning that it provides a lubricating surface between two points of friction.

Ok, let's talk jacketed bullets. In those, the jacket itself smears along the bore depositing copper with every shot. Sometimes more, sometimes less, depending on jacket composition, barrel roughness, etc.

I'm wondering why the same idea of lubrication isn't used with jacketed? With the exception of moly coats it is not done. What would the harm be in tumble lubing some jacketed bullets with LLA or JPW? I'd think the same benefits would apply.\

If no one has any objections to the idea I'd try some over a chronograph and check for accuracy in a head to head test, and also see how it cleans up vs. no lube.

[44man]

In most cases you NEED friction. Even cast should not use a "SLIPPERY" lube.
Moly coated jacketed bullets have shown a higher incident of SSE events because the bullet moved too easy.
Something to keep copper off the steel is OK as long as it does not turn the bullet into a greased pig.
Even plated bores are not dead smooth, not like a bumper.
There are some bores that might be real shiny, I don't know and the M16 with a chrome bore is something I have never seen so I don't know what they look like. However, the boolit will still have enough friction.
I don't have the answer anyway but I do know a muzzle loader for round balls can be "shot smooth" and lose accuracy. I have never been able to get a chrome plated muzzle loader bore to work either although they might be OK for sabot's. I will not own a sabot shooter.
Strange the inline makers never offered a slow round ball twist??? They can't cut deep enough rifling with the tools they use anyway.

[1Shirt]

Will be interested in your results, please post them, with emphasis on vol. I would think that you would have to have M-die or similar case mouth opening to prevent stripping of the Lube. Good luck!
1Shirt!:coffee:

[MtGun44]

"Higher incidence of SSE events"

What reliable source can document a single event of SSE that can be proven not to have
been just a standard old dumb assed double charge or wrong powder or other normal
reloading misadventure? I include myself in the "old dumb-assed double charge" crowd,
by the way.

I kinda think this is a lot like Bigfoot.

Bill

[1Shirt]

MTGun44, I belong to that crowd also. To soon old, to late smart I guess.
1Shirt!:coffee:

[runfiverun]

i recall col. harrington done some work with lubing bullets,he used oils etc though and even moly iirc.
there was some mention of dieseling with too much oil in the bore.
i also recall match shooters using a bit of oil on the first shot, dipped on the bullet.
i know some 22 target shooters done/did? this.

[Jim_Fleming]

Sorry Gents...

But what is an SSE?

Just old dummy me...

[Bret4207]

Greased bullets were common in match shooting in the days before gilding metal jacket material was perfected. IIRC this would have been in the pre to post WW1 era. There were even special gizmos made commercially to lube the loaded bullet. Read Whelen, Crossman, etc to find info on it.

[44man]

OOPS, hit the wrong key, it is S.E.E or secondary explosive effect. It is something that can happen with a reduced charge of slow powder when a bullet moves out too soon and stops a split second at the rifling if the throat is long or some bullets make it into the bore a little before the powder gets lit good. The boolit acts like a bore obstruction. Lots of theory's about why it happens and I don't think it can be duplicated at will.
Anyway, it is a fact and both my friend and I had it happen with our Swedish Mausers. Thankfully, no gun damage. We used the listed accurate load of 4831, 46 gr, shot it for years with super accuracy too. Mine happened about 6 months after his did, bolts needed pounded open with a large mallet and the primers were, well, just gone with a huge pocket in the brass. I increased the charge but eventually went to Varget.
Anyway, it was reported in one of the gun magazines that moly coated bullets were showing a higher then normal incident rate. No, I don't remember where but it stuck in my mind and that's good enough for me.
I don't want to start an argument about it but as long as I can advise a warning, I feel better. It is up to each of you to determine what you feel is safe but I like my body the way it is.
It seems to me that we have been instructed for a long time, to remove oil from the bore before shooting.

[db2]

I feel 44man is right about moly coated bullets move easier than non coated. I have a pet load for my 220 swift, and when I moved to using moly I lost about 150 fps with the same powder charge. I took me a while to under stand what was going on. I know folks who believe in using moly, however for me it is to much of a hassle with bore cleaning, bore prep and coating the bullets. I did not see any accuracy improvements going to moly.

This is just my take on moly, I have no experience with any other lubes or coatings for jacketed bullets.

[swheeler]

Check this out, I did several years ago(03-04?) www.lubricationspecs.com/Whatsnew.htm - I bought one of the 2 for 1 deals on bullet slick and tested in 7mm rm for accuracy/velocity results. I followed their directions of coating bullets and conditionong the barrel to start. It definately reduced friction and dropped velocity by as much as 400 fps on the first shot, in the 7mag by the 15 shot velocity and pressure were back up to normal, not good for accuracy. I actually tried coating moly coated cast and jacketed bullets with it also, I'm thinking good ol gilding metal does just fine by itself. I gave the other bottle to a shotting friend and he was not impressed either. I do believe that treating bullets like this and using extremely slow powder could possiblely cause a SEE,I dont know this but don't want to find out either. If it's wearing a condom make mine NON LUBRICATED.

[TAWILDCATT]

Interesting as a number of machine guns had oiled cartridges to help extraction.
lead bullets have higher lubricaty than jacket.and I belive the old coated bullets were dipped in wax.not grease.many a gun blew up in the past and it was atributed to many things.but mostly it was wrong cartridge or over charge.you use to much lube on sizing cases and you get a dent in case.
but you believe what you want.as its all speculation.:coffeecom[smilie=1: