38 special powder

[jballs918]

just wondering if there is anything out there for the 38. i just want ot see what hte price would be is all thanks guys

[Cherokee]

Patsreloading.com has bulk powders like AA2 and AA7 which will work in 38 Special

[RayinNH]

jballs, also at Pat's Reloading, Scot 453 and Solo 1000 will work in the .38 Special. I use the Scot 453 myself and can provide you with data should you desire. Data for the Solo 1000 is available at Accurate's site...Ray

[Lloyd Smale]

ive used surplus aa2 with good results in the 38

[rbstern]

Although surplus pricing is always nice, for .38 special, you are probably barking up the wrong tree for $ savings.

With faster powders, most loads use less than 1 cent per round worth of powder. Bullseye, Red Dot, Clays, etc. Lots of load data out there, and one pound of powder will yield 2000 .38 special target loads.

[David R]

I loaded up a box of 38s today with 2.9 grains of Promo (red dot). I will report back. Pormo is $79.99 for eight pounds at my local gun shop.

David

[fecmech]

Dave--Bullseye is $51.95 for a 4 lb. keg at Johnsons, I just picked one up a week ago. If you look in the Lyman cast bullet handbook you will see there is no real velocity advantage with any of the slower powders over BE,231, or Red Dot in the .38spl. Both 231 or BE will give you an honest 900fps with excellent accuracy with 158's and about 850fps with 358429 and keep you in the 17000 psi range. I know you like to experiment as I do so have a ball and try em all! That said I now only load 2 loads for the .38, 4.2 BE for the RN & 358429 and 3.1 BE for the wadcutters. Good luck Nick

[David R]

Thanks Nick,

The red dot shot pretty well. I think with this gun it will shoot anything. I blasted off 200 rounds tonight at the indoor range. My 38 seems to prefer the 231 so far and it does meter much better. I have not tried the bullseye yet, but will as soon as the dillon shipment comes in. (probably monday) I agree what ever is most accurate is the thing to use even if it costs $.01 per charge. With Bullseye, you get over 2,000 charges for twenty bucks. That is a penny a shot. Pretty cheap.

I tried 231, and red dot in the 45. I went back to 3.5 grains of bullseye. It is by far the most accurate load in my 45. I am getting ready for the WNYOPL, so I have a bunch of 45s ready. Probably enough for the whole summer. Maybe I will buy the 4 lb keg and be done with it. I like that price much better than one pound at a time.

Also Nick, there is a 10 cavity #39 mold on Ebay. I am watching it.

Jballs918, Looks like the only surp powder would be #2 which I think is similar to the promo I have been buying. Its a fast burning flake powder that does not meter too well in the quantities we need for a 38.

[RayinNH]

David, I've tried to find Promo in four different gun shops. Three have never heard of it, the fourth had it listed in their computer as a powder that they can order, but hadn't as of yet...Ray

[Bodydoc447]

In other words, can I substitute grain for grain Promo for Red Dot in pistol loads? I've not read up on Promo but I saw it at the gun Show last weekend.

Thanks for any information,
Doc

[StarMetal]

You fellows better stop listening to guys that don't know **** about powder. Promo has the same burning rate as Red Dot, but is a denser powder so it's not the same by grain measurements. In other words 3.5 grs of Red Dot and 3.5 grs of Promo aren't the same. Read it here for yourselves, right from Alliant who makes it.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/products/promo.htm

Joe

[RayinNH]

Doc, yes, weight for weight not volume for volume. They both have the same burn speed...Ray

[rbstern]

David, before you settle on a powder, try Clays.

I have shot 38 special with HP38 (231 equiv), Red Dot, Clays, Power Pistol, HS6, and 4756. Clays performs as well or better than the others, but has a huge advantage in cleanliness. There is so much less soot on the gun after a Clays session, it's remarkable. The only limitation I have found is that I need to use 3.4 or more grains (.53cc) to eliminate position sensitivity with lighter boolits.

[RayinNH]

rbstern, in the April 2006 issue of Handloader they mentioned a new Alliant powder called "Clay Dot". I quote the magazine "Clay Dot is intended as a replacement for Hodgdon's Clays but is to be priced quite a bit lower- a clear attempt by Alliant to cut into the 12-guage target powder marketshare enjoyed by Clays. Moreover, Clay Dot is intended to be both a weight-for-weight and a volume-for-volume replacement for Clays."

Clay Dot will be sold only in eight pounders like Promo. Something new to play with.
Ray

[swheeler]

It will have to burn cleaner than the other DOTS to compete with Clays, or be a lot cheaper!

[omgb]

I use Clays and love it. I tried 2400, Unique and Bullseye but stuck with Clays. it's cleaner than anything else and at 3.4 grains per load, it's cheap too,

[David R]

*************************************************

Promo

Smokeless shotshell powder
America's number one economy-priced 12 gauge target powder. Promo has the same burn speed as Red Dot, but is more dense, thus requiring a smaller bushing to obtain the same charge weight.


**************************************************

I don't know **** about powder:violin:

Nuttin personal Joe

David

[David R]

I have a can of clays in the cabnet that I bought years ago when the sport shop was out of Bullseye. I will try it. It was nuttin special in the 45. BUT when using the 231 in the 38, or 45 LC, my hands get all black and silver from the powder resadue. Worse in the 45 LC.

Daym this new gun thing is fun!

David

[StarMetal]

[quote=David R]*************************************************

Promo

Smokeless shotshell powder
America's number one economy-priced 12 gauge target powder. Promo has the same burn speed as Red Dot, but is more dense, thus requiring a smaller bushing to obtain the same charge weight.


**************************************************

I don't know **** about powder:violin:

Nuttin personal Joe

David[/quote

I'll bet most of us use volume powder measures. The powders aren't alike by volume. That can be very dangerous. How many of us weigh each charge for pistol cartridge reloading. You don't know **** about powder.....nothing personal...guess you haven't been at it real long.

Joe

[David R]

I have nothing more to say about this subject.

David

[StarMetal]

I have nothing more to say about this subject.

David

I certainly hope so....now neither do I

Joe

[KYCaster]

Geez, Joe. Go back and read the ad you referenced and David's post [B]CAREFULLY, [B]then tell us who don't know ****.

Jerry

[rbstern]

rbstern, in the April 2006 issue of Handloader they mentioned a new Alliant powder called "Clay Dot". I quote the magazine "Clay Dot is intended as a replacement for Hodgdon's Clays but is to be priced quite a bit lower- a clear attempt by Alliant to cut into the 12-guage target powder marketshare enjoyed by Clays. Moreover, Clay Dot is intended to be both a weight-for-weight and a volume-for-volume replacement for Clays."

Clay Dot will be sold only in eight pounders like Promo. Something new to play with.
Ray

I'm anxious to hear what people's initial results are.

[David R]

1253
Oly cow! I finally got the pic to show up.

This is from my K38.
358429 made from 1/2 WW and 1/2 lead with some tin.
Drops from mold .3575 sized at .358
Weight 172 grains nekkid as a jay bird
Lube 2/3 LAR45 carnuba 1/3 50/50
Powder 3.7 grains PROMO
Primer CCI Small Peestol
Case RP
Crimped on groove.

5 shots 17 yards from a rest

[swheeler]

not bad!

[Bodydoc447]

Excellent! I just scored an Ideal 358156 4 cavity mold for non-gas checked SWC with the classic Thompson bullet. I hope it does as well.

Doc

[Lloyd Smale]

there are actually two differnt #2s being sold one is a flake that doesnt meter to well and theres a real fine version that meters very well. I just picked up 3 more kegs of the fine stuff and i use a pile of it and its a very accurate powder.
Thanks Nick,

The red dot shot pretty well. I think with this gun it will shoot anything. I blasted off 200 rounds tonight at the indoor range. My 38 seems to prefer the 231 so far and it does meter much better. I have not tried the bullseye yet, but will as soon as the dillon shipment comes in. (probably monday) I agree what ever is most accurate is the thing to use even if it costs $.01 per charge. With Bullseye, you get over 2,000 charges for twenty bucks. That is a penny a shot. Pretty cheap.

I tried 231, and red dot in the 45. I went back to 3.5 grains of bullseye. It is by far the most accurate load in my 45. I am getting ready for the WNYOPL, so I have a bunch of 45s ready. Probably enough for the whole summer. Maybe I will buy the 4 lb keg and be done with it. I like that price much better than one pound at a time.

Also Nick, there is a 10 cavity #39 mold on Ebay. I am watching it.

Jballs918, Looks like the only surp powder would be #2 which I think is similar to the promo I have been buying. Its a fast burning flake powder that does not meter too well in the quantities we need for a 38.

[trumpetman]

Hi. This is my first post on this forum. Lots of good info here.

I've been using Promo for about 7 months. I'm sold on it now, after taking time to find the correct bushings and dippers (or make my own) for each load that I use, weighing and re-weighing each charge until I am satisfied that I'm getting a good, consistent measure for each charge. This was really time-consuming at first, but well worth it. Now I have some really good, clean Promo loads that fill the cases (and hulls) much better than Bullseye to get similar velocities -- at even less cost.

WARNING: I have been warned that if you ever change lots of Promo, you'll have to re-weigh and re-calibrate each charge because Alliant does not necessarily keep the same density level for each lot of Promo. I don't know if this is true, but I will definitely take this step to avoid a possible KA-BLEWIE!

I use Promo with .38 Special, 9MM, light .357 Magnum (Cowboy) rifle and revolver, 12 gauge 1 oz loads (up to 1225 fps) and 1 1/8 oz loads (up to 1250 fps). Most of my 12 gauge loads are around 1200 fps, which is where Promo shines, in my opion.

[Shiloh]

Been using Bullseye for years. I pretty much just shoot 148-150 gr wadcutters.
2.7-2.8 gr. gives supert accuracy and very mild recoil.

SHiloh

[smokinbarrel]

I`ve had good luck with 700X, alot cleaner than Unique or SR7625, would like to give clays a try too

[mtgrs737]

Here is what someone told me years ago about the Dot's and Clays as to their burning residue. This person said:

Hercules (Alliant) uses wood cellulose to make their powder and Hogdon uses cotton to provide the cellulose for Clays. The wood cellulose leaves more ash behind than the cotton cellulose when it burns so that is the difference between the two. This same person told me that Red Dot was a double based powder that had a higher flame temperture than Clays and that was why my WWAA 12 ga. cases were only lasting 3 reloads before they split and were burned up at the crimp (I have noticed that the new WWAA cases seem to be thinner at the crimp and of a harder plastic than the old cases were so maybe that is the reason). Now I don't know if any of this is true or not so Joe don't flame me for posting it, I just wanted to throw it out there so maybe some of you guys that know about powder could confirm or not.

[Ricochet]

Additionally, Promo is said to be what Alliant makes when a batch of one of their several other powders turns out off-spec. it gets sent back to be turned into Promo. I don't know what the reprocessing involves, it may be as simple as running it between rollers to make thinner, faster burning flakes adjusted to the Red Dot burning speed. That would explain why the bulk density is variable.

[TCLouis]

Thank you for the Information DavidR.

I Know how to weight powder when someone give me load data in grains, so I will try that IF I can find PROMO in Middle Tennessee.