Newbee needs some advice.....

[vincewarde]

I'm an experienced reloader who is just learning to cast. I am using 100% Lee stuff, including molds, push through dies, Alox, etc.

I am using Linotype for all my rifle bullets at this point.

I cast some 340gr bullets (plain base) for my 45-70 - but in my first attempt I used load data from the RCBS book and I am sure I pushed them too fast and got terrible accuracy and leading. I broke those down and have loaded them much lighter with data from the Lyman book. I may go out tomorrow and try them again.

Tonight I fired up the pot and cast a bunch of .30 cal and 8mm bullets. The bullets from the .309 160gr mold drop at .311-.312 and 145 grains. The 8mm bullets drop at .324-.325.

Here are my questions:

Since the .30 cal bullets are at near perfect diameter for my Mosin, and the 8mm are near perfect for my 8x57, can I use these without sizing?

If I can using them with sizing, should I worry about being 1/1000 out of round?

Again, if I can use without sizing, how do I seat the gas checks?

This forum has already been a huge help - THANK YOU to all who post such geat advice!

[Slow Elk 45/70]

I'm an experienced reloader who is just learning to cast. I am using 100% Lee stuff, including molds, push through dies, Alox, etc.

I am using Linotype for all my rifle bullets at this point.

I cast some 340gr bullets (plain base) for my 45-70 - but in my first attempt I used load data from the RCBS book their regular reloading manual?and I am sure I pushed them too fast What load/powder and got terrible accuracy and leading. Have you slugged the bore of your rifle, and really cleaned out ALL the copper fouling? data from the Lyman book. I may go out tomorrow and try them again. If you are shooting a Micro-Grove bbl with Linotype boolits, they will need to be oversize, they don't bump up to seal the groves and tend to lead and shoot lousy...IMHOTonight I fired up the pot and cast a bunch of .30 cal and 8mm bullets. The bullets from the .309 160gr mold drop at .311-.312 and 145 grains. The 8mm bullets drop at .324-.325.

Here are my questions:

Since the .30 cal bullets are at near perfect diameter for my Mosin, and the 8mm are near perfect for my 8x57, can I use these without sizing? Yes, make a dummy round, if they will chamber ok and are .001-.002, even .003 they should be fineIf I can using them with sizing, should I worry about being 1/1000 out of round? No unless you are weighing each boolit and shooting match.Again, if I can use without sizing, how do I seat the gas checks? The Lee sizer will seat them or push them on, if they are loose a dab of super glue on the base will fix that.
This forum has already been a huge help - THANK YOU to all who post such geat advice!

Try to give a little more info, like what kind of 45/70 , Ballard bbl or Micro, load you had trouble with powder/weight/ Alox may be a pain with lino boolits. Lino in a 45/70 is a waste of your resources, cut it 3 to 1 with plain lead. Let us know what you are trying to achieve, punching pappier, killing beer cans, Dragons, or just plinking/hunting. YOU will not be able to duplicate Jacketed velocities with lead, no matter if you use Lino, some work loads up to fps+ but not many, in some calibers.

I hope this helps, I'm sure you will get a LOT of info so be ready. Also Read the Classics and Stickies sections, lots of info there.[smilie=1:

[vincewarde]

Thanks for the quick reply. I was mostly looking for info on the .30 and 8mm bullets. I'm hoping to be able to use the same load in several different rifles. I have more than one, 7.62x54r, .308, 30-06, and 8x57. I know that if accuracy is poor I may need to slug the bore and size for each rifle. Just hoping to get lucky at this point. I don't need super accuracy - 3-4 moa would be fine.

As for the 45-70........ yes future bullets will likely be cast from WWs. I have lots available. The rifle is a H&R Handi. My initial load was 28gr of SR4759 behind the 340gr bullet. No signs of pressure and great accuracy for the first 6-8 shots. Then it turns into a pattern, rather than a group. This is why I think the problem is leading from too much velocity. The new load is 21gr of SR4759 with the same bullet. I am hoping for about 1200-1300fps.

As for use - informal paper punching is about it. I have a 500gr mold for the 45-70 - I might use that for pig hunting, but that's the only hunting I have in mind.

Thanks again!

[pdawg_shooter]

I wouldnt worry about out of round. By the time they get pushed down a round barrel with thousands of pounds of pressure behind them I would bet they are as round as any die can make them.

[Gohon]

Personally I would cut the Lino with WW also for the 30 calibers. For my 30-30 I'm using cast WW, heat treated to 420 degrees and then quenched for a 17-18 BHN. These are loaded and launch at 1970 fps with with great accuracy and no leading. The fly in the ointment so to speak is they are gas checked which certainly makes a difference. However even without a gas check design I think up to 1800 fps, provided there was a good bullet to bore fit would work just fine. For the speeds required of your 30-06 a gas check design is a must in my opinion.

[snaggdit]

To answer your question, yes you can use them without sizing. Seating the gas checks can be done with an "at size" or slightly oversized push thru sizer. Do you have the .311 push through sizer? I have an SKS that slugged .311. I honed out my lee sizer to .312 so my boolits were over as well. Recent thread on how to do this a few weeks ago. My boolits were dropping around .312 as well. Now the sizer just seats the checks and doesn't do anything to the boolit. A thou out of round is no big deal.

As others have stated, lino is fine if you have tons of it but you could use water dropped WW just as easily. One issue though if you alloy down your lino. Lino causes boolits to drop bigger than WW or pure(being the smallest drop size) but lighter. Your .309 mold is dropping .311-.312 with lino right now and you are happy with the size. WW might drop .310 but will be a slightly heavier boolit, closer to the 160gr I am sure.

My last suggestion. Mosins are notorious for having various amounts of use over the years. Barrels can be anything from .309 to .314. Slug the barrel. It's not that hard and then you will know the groove size you are needing to size to (.001 over). Then if you have issues you know it is something else. Same advice for the 45-70. I tend to agree that pushing that boolit too fast gave you leading but boolit fit could be part of the cause as well. Sounds like you are ready to try a lighter load so hopefully that will do the trick. Good luck and have fun!

[Larry Gibson]

vincewarde

I'm an experienced reloader who is just learning to cast. I am using 100% Lee stuff, including molds, push through dies, Alox, etc.

I am using Linotype for all my rifle bullets at this point.

I also suggest you "cut" the linotype with WWs. A very good alloy with a BHN of 18 +/- can be made by a 60/40 mix of WW/Linotype.

I cast some 340gr bullets (plain base) for my 45-70 - but in my first attempt I used load data from the RCBS book and I am sure I pushed them too fast and got terrible accuracy and leading. I broke those down and have loaded them much lighter with data from the Lyman book. I may go out tomorrow and try them again.

Tonight I fired up the pot and cast a bunch of .30 cal and 8mm bullets. The bullets from the .309 160gr mold drop at .311-.312 and 145 grains. The 8mm bullets drop at .324-.325.

Here are my questions:

Since the .30 cal bullets are at near perfect diameter for my Mosin, and the 8mm are near perfect for my 8x57, can I use these without sizing?

Yes

If I can using them with sizing, should I worry about being 1/1000 out of round?

No, as mentioned the barrel will "round out" the bullets.

Again, if I can use without sizing, how do I seat the gas checks?

With the Lee push through sizer in the press set a bullet with a GC on the GC shank nose first on the ram. Then just push it far enough into the sizer to just crimp on the GC. Then lower the press ram and a small rod of just under .30 cal can then be used, with a small mallet, to tap the bullet back out. It will take a little trial and error to find out just how far. When see a slight sizing of the rear drive band it is far enough.

Also if you have a Lee Factory crimp die for either cartridge it may also be used. Solidly seat the GC onto the shank. Hold the GC by the bullet and insert it into the top of the LFCD so the GC is lined up with the jaws of the collet. Push the ram up so the shell holder pushes on the bottom of the collet and and closes the jaws. If you have the GC properly positioned it will nicely crimp the GC. Be carefull though as it is easy to over do it and scrunch the GC too much. You can adjust the LFCD in/out to set it for just the right amount of crimp on the GC.

This forum has already been a huge help - THANK YOU to all who post such geat advice!

You're welcome

Larry Gibson

[405]

vincewarde,
One item that usually gets put off until many pots of unknown alloys have been cast and shot is the BHN gauge. A really good investment for anyone dealing with the unlimited variety of unknown alloys most of us use. It won't give the quantitative analysis of an alloy but will at least allow you to use and mix up alloys with consistent hardness... a key to happy casting/shooting. Some are expensive, some not so much. A Lee hardness tester is about as inexpensive as any and for our purposes- accurate enough.

[vincewarde]

Well I went to the range today and had a great day. Got the 10/22 zeroed, ditto the SKS and the K31. But the highlight was the 45-70 Handi.

I fired a total of 26 rounds - the last 3 grouped 1.1 inches at 100 yards. Not bad for cast bullets with a 2.5 power scope. To say that I am happy would be an understatement. It appears that I've found a load it likes and I probably won't change a thing.

So next I will be trying one of the .30s or maybe the 8x57.

Thanks again for all the good advice!

http://family.douloscomputer.com/20090807_hr45-70_100yards.jpg

[vincewarde]

And all but one are right at .308. But my dad's old 99 Savage in .308 - which has never shot well - measured between .310 and .311. I always thought the poor accuracy was because of the light barrel!

You are all very right - the process is easy and definitely something I will be doing with all my guns!

Thanks again!

Vince

[hugh]

I did not ask the the question, but got some answers to what was on my mind .tanks