Why didn't you guys say it was

[Nate1778]

this easy.

I am here at work and forgetting to take my, new to me, Lee 10# pot and 125 grain .38 special mold home I decided to have some fun here at the shop. Besides its not like I have a million things to do or something. Fired it up and let the alloy melt, then put my mold on the can to get it warm. Came back out and cast probably 20 bullets, all of which were wrinkly and not right, but I did it. Came back in and used that thar search function, hah more heat. so went out there and put the mold back on the can and the wrinkled bullets back in the can. Came back out after 25 minutes or so after some phone calls and started again, still wrinkly but not near as bad. So I said I will keep going. About my 5th try I noticed the alloy starting to stay liquid on the sprew plate a little longer, and wa-la. Beautiful bullets. I kicked out about 2 dozen of the prettiest bullets till I got another call. That's enough for now. I am absolutely amazed at how easy that was once they got up to temperature and how quickly one can produce, even two at a time. I didn't even flux cause I didn't have any and the lead flowed very well.

If I had known it was going to be this easy I would have been doing this a while ago......






http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w157/nate1778/DSC_0077.jpg

http://i175.photobucket.com/albums/w157/nate1778/DSC_0074.jpg

[putteral]

Nice looking Boolits! You did good!
:drinks:

[qajaq59]

Shhhhh! ...... Don't tell everyone or there wont be any lead left for us.

Kidding aside, if you have decent equipment and listen to the advice of a couple of the old timers, it's a piece of cake, isn't it?
Years ago I tried it with crap for equipment and not quite enough knowledge. I then gave it up quickly. This time around I read the forum and bought a decent pot and a good thermometer. Now it's just a relaxing thing to do.

[AZ-Stew]

Years ago I tried it with crap for equipment and not quite enough knowledge. I then gave it up quickly.

35+ years ago I started casting for a couple of muzzle loaders I had. There weren't any pre-made swaged balls available then, nor was there an Internet with a fabulous forum like this to learn from. I started with a Lyman RB mould, a Lyman dipper and I used a pipe tobacco can on my wife's gas stove for a casting pot. The only resource I had was the instruction sheet that came with the mould and whatever I could find to read (gun magazines, etc.) All the info available at the time claimed that absolutely pure lead was mandatory for muzzle loader ammo. If I had known then what I know now, I'd have found some tin to alloy with it to improve castability. Pure lead is a PITA to cast with, and a touch of tin wouldn't have hurt the ML balls. Took me a while to figure it all out.

Anyway, it's good to see the newcomers and hear the stories of their success.

Nate, your boolits look great. One seems to have a slightly dented nose, but otherwise, you have good fill-out and the base corners are square. Use an old towel, folded on the bench next to your casting pot to catch the boolits when you drop them from the mould. After you drop them, use your sprue plate knocker to push them to the back of the towel so you're not dropping new castings onto them. That'll get rid of the dents.

Regards,

Stew

[beagle]

First time I cast, I made 311291s for the .30/06. Turning funky wheel weights, a fishing sinker or so and maybe a lead soldier into nice, shiny bullets made me have a feeling that there ought to be something illegal about the process.

That was in 1958 and I haven't lost the thrill yet./beagle

[Rockchucker]

We all go through the same things don't we. Congratulations, your boolits look great!

[462]

Lube 'em and load 'em.

[Calamity Jake]

Then thangs look awful, you better send um to me!!!!!

I will take ofum!!!!:kidding:

Really, nice job and ain't it fun when you know you have done it yourself.

[Blammer]

BTW, "Hey this is EASY!"

there it's been said! lol

ah another addict in the works...

[DLCTEX]

I was fortunate that as a kid my Great Grandfather helped us boys work through casting lead toy soldiers. He had spent a lifetime of casting boolits, babbit bearings, etc. and was a vast storehouse of knowledge. When I embarked on this casting venture his words of advice came back and helped me through some problems. Some of the things I did intuitively should be credited to him also.
I just lift the edge of the towel enough to roll the hot boolits to the back to make room for more.

[Bill*]

First time I cast, I made 311291s for the .30/06. Turning funky wheel weights, a fishing sinker or so and maybe a lead soldier into nice, shiny bullets made me have a feeling that there ought to be something illegal about the process.

That was in 1958 and I haven't lost the thrill yet./beagle

Don't worry.... If the gov't has its way it will be illegal soon enough

[JIMinPHX]

Nice job for the first time out of the gate. :drinks:

Good choice of boolit too. That little dandy is very versatile. I've loaded it in every .38, .357, 9mm, & .380 that I've ever made ammo for. I've pushed it as fast as 1250fps with good results out of a .357.

Don't be shy about making lots of them. They don't go bad.:cbpour:

[Ole]

Nice job for the first time out of the gate. :drinks:

Good choice of boolit too. That little dandy is very versatile. I've loaded it in every .38, .357, 9mm, & .380 that I've ever made ammo for. I've pushed it as fast as 1250fps with good results out of a .357.

Don't be shy about making lots of them. They don't go bad.:cbpour:

Jim those boolits look familiar.

Are those the same samples you gave me? I got those loaded up but haven't shot them yet. :brokenima

[lead-1]

Show off

:kidding:

[snaggdit]

Nate, those look just great. I guess you missed the warnings about this being addicting. For some, it is worse than crack. One good casting session and you will be hooked for life! Welcome to the addiction and the biggest forum of enablers around...

[denul]

Nate1778, I bought a 6 cavity version of these several months ago; your post inspired me to more with them. Mine are soft (BHN 10) and heavy ( 131gr), but sized .3565" and lubed (LBT Blue) in the base groove only and seated to just cover the crimp groove, over a mild load of WST, they worked extremely well in the Springfield XDM. 100 rounds later there was no significant leading, maybe because I'm not pushing these very hard. They were accurate,too.
The 6 cavity version(#916523) is in stock now at Midway, but the photo there shows a bullet cavity in the mold different than the depicted cast bullet itself. What I got is the bullet you are casting, which is the one pictured in their mold cavity photo. At $38.49, plus the handles, you can really get some serious production of a great bullet for a very modest investment.

Thanks for your post - got me fired up for a day!

[Landric]

Those look nice.

I'm in the process of putting together stuff to start casting. I'm starting small, to make sure its something I want to do, before I spend a lot of money. I bought a Lee two cavity mold (starting small), 255 grain .452 RFN and working on a deal for a Lyman 2 cavity 358430. Those are the two bullets I like that cost the most to buy. I figure even if I hate it (which I don't expect to), I am willing to cast those two bullets to avoid paying what they cost to purchase. I expect I'll really like casting, after all I really like handloading, and casting is the next natural step.

I just collected some wheel weights this morning. I should be getting started sometime next week.

[Fire_stick]

Well done.

It's easy and fun!

[sheepdog]

nor was there an Internet...

Yes thank God for the Intardnet. [smilie=1: But in a desert of idiots and misinformation this site is an oasis that continually refreshes. I think the guys in ar15com just about talked me out of casting before I stumbled here and thought "you know what, I think I might be able to do this after all". And doing it I am! (rather poorly but practice makes perfect).

[Nate1778]

Update:

Had a chance to have a real casting session this evening making buck shot and the above bullets. I also learned what it is to get some moisture in the mix, not pretty, no one hurt but that won't happen again. Apparently one of my ingots was wet and I did not catch it.

The bullets I cast tonight I did not drop in a bucket of water like the first and I used a wet towel. I noticed they are much softer and easier to scratch and are getting nicked up being in a Tupperware together. I noticed the water dropped ones do not. I understand the difference in methods, but which one is right? These will be used in several different guns at target practice velocities, but I certainly don't want them to soft. I am also going to need to size them as they are dropping at .360. So which is the best to water drop or not?

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

If you are using WW's, no need to water drop. I push straight WW's, air-cooled, non-gas checked to 1200 FPS in my 357 mag with no leading and decent accuracy. BTW, those boolits look great and welcome to the addiction!

[lurch]

Update:

Had a chance to have a real casting session this evening making buck shot and the above bullets. I also learned what it is to get some moisture in the mix, not pretty, no one hurt but that won't happen again. Apparently one of my ingots was wet and I did not catch it.

The bullets I cast tonight I did not drop in a bucket of water like the first and I used a wet towel. I noticed they are much softer and easier to scratch and are getting nicked up being in a Tupperware together. I noticed the water dropped ones do not. I understand the difference in methods, but which one is right? These will be used in several different guns at target practice velocities, but I certainly don't want them to soft. I am also going to need to size them as they are dropping at .360. So which is the best to water drop or not?

Ah, a visit from the Tinsel Fairy... I'd just as soon she not visit as well.

As to which method is correct - they both are, but I'd use a dry towel and not a wet one. It just depends on what you want. I'm not sure what the overall effect would be, but a wet towel might cause uneven cooling, but rapid enough in some spots that you get hardening and in some spots you don't When lead-antimony alloy is hardened in this way, it grows a little bit. Uneven hardening to my way of looking at ti could give you some lopsided boolit in a couple weeks. Never tried it,and don't know for sure, but it's something I might be concerned about. Another thing to consider is storage time. If you are going to shoot you water dropped boolits in a reasonable time frame, you'll get the benefit (or detriment depending on how & what they are used for) of hardened boolits. If you let them sit for say over a year, the hardening effect goes away and they boolits will gradually start approaching the hardness they would have been if they had not been water dropped. Little nicks & dings are of no real consequence to the average boolit. So, it just depends........

I only use air cooled wheel weights at this point and can push a 357446 to 1350fps in a 6" 357 and a 429421 to 1400fps in a 44 with great results on both.

As others have said, good job for the first go at ti. I wish my first ones came out like that. :drinks:

[snaggdit]

IMHO, there is no need to water drop most pistol boolits. WW will be fine air cooled for anything including hot 357/44s. If you find leading in the fast loads then I would think about water dropping but only if needed. Rifles are a different animal. Heck, for that matter, many use 50/50 pure/WW air cooled in ave pistol loads and they work fine. I'm talking 9mm/45 at 800/1000fps.

[shotman]

Nate Are you using pure lead to cast? The first post looked like very shinny boolits. You say nicked easy. You need to add wheel weights to the lead. The other thing is not drive them fast . 700 800ft Your water drops are ok but also be very carefull that if you have a bad one and remelt that a small hole that can trap water will be a bomb in the pot.. I quit the water drop after the 2 scars on my face. Also now you need to be aware that wheel weights some are zinc. Thats not good in aluminum molds
Oh you know that you can buy seconds in jacket bullets for less that the 1st line stuff . We dont have seconds with cast.

[Nate1778]

My problem is I do not know what the alloy is. I got it with the production pot, it came with 10#'s in it and about another 25#'s of ingots. The ingots range from muffin shaped to LEE and I think Lyman molded ingots. They are relatively hard so I assume the have at least some wheel weights in them, don't know the composition. I don't think they are pure lead as I have some of that and know how soft it is. I can say when I take a water drop bullet and hit it on the side of one of the ones I made last night it leaves a indent in the small bullet, not huge but its there. Should I harden these particular bullets do to not knowing the composition of the alloy?

[Nate1778]

Ah, a visit from the Tinsel Fairy... I'd just as soon she not visit as well.





For some reason, one never understands this comment til it happens :mrgreen:. That's exactly what it reminded me of. Scared the dinner out of me, luckily it was my first ingot ever so I stood back once it entered. Sounded like a primer going off or something.

[TAWILDCATT]

I shoot 311291 WW as cast.cronyed at 1680 with 13.5 gr red dot.shoots one in groups at 100 yds. I shake to much now to do better.non of my bullets are heat treated,or water dropped.if your going over 2000fps you may have to harden.
:coffee:[smilie=1:

[qajaq59]

My problem is I do not know what the alloy is. Not too many of us know exactly what alloy we have. We can test for hardness. But I assume we'd need a lab to really know what the alloy is? But if I'm wrong on that assumtion I'd love to know how to test for alloy.

[Nate1778]

Not too many of us know exactly what alloy we have. We can test for hardness. But I assume we'd need a lab to really know what the alloy is? But if I'm wrong on that assumtion I'd love to know how to test for alloy.



Yeah, I know its something homegrown, just don't know if it is strait wheel weights, or 50/50 weights pure. I am almost 100% its not pure lead only.

[kyle623]

for target waterdropping is good since expansion isnt an issue. I waterdrop everything and have no issues anyway. some say size as soon as you can since the boolits will harden more after a few days. i do both and dont see any leading wether i size right away or a week later.

[Nate1778]

Last question and I am appreciative for the advice thus far. I don't want to start new threads for no reason, so. If I slug a barrel at .356 or say .357 what do I size them at. Should I size them a 1000th smaller or more. I plan on liquid ALOX lubing these till I get it down, then may move over to pan lubing, or if money is right a lub-a-sizer. Whats the rule of thumb as far as custom fitting a bullet to a barrel. Thanks again guys, and I give credit to the equipment, it was just as easy last night as it was the first time. I am excited to head back out there tonight......:-D

[snaggdit]

Another tip is pure will not harden, either water dropping or heat treating in an oven. It needs trace impurities to allow it to harden. In WW this is arsenic. Also found in magnum shot. 50/50 pure/WW would harden, since the arsenic is present. If you have a good ear, dropping ingots on concrete can give you an idea of hardness. More thud, purer. Higher the ring, harder the ingot. The thumbnail test is good for pure up to (air cooled) WW. Lino and harder will not mark with a thumbnail. Many here have hardness testers. If you want to send me a half dozen air cooled boolits I could tell you what the mystery alloy's hardness is. Give you some idea of the composition maybe. If interested, drop me a PM.

[snaggdit]

Rule of thumb is ALWAYS size BIGGER then groove. .001 to .002 over is standard.

[Nate1778]

Snaggdit, thanks for the offer, but your post helped me more then you think. The air cooled bullets would barely nick if I hit it with my thumbnail. Almost like it was right at the verge of being to hard to scratch. The water dropped bullets will not scratch at all. So with your info I am guessing this is close to pure wheel weights.


EDIT add:

so if I slug at .358 then my .360 bullets are fine without sizing, correct? Huh I would have thought it was the other way around. Thanks

[waksupi]

so if I slug at .358 then my .360 bullets are fine without sizing, correct? Huh I would have thought it was the other way around. Thanks[/quote]


I believe I would make up a dummy round with the .360, and see if it will chamber. Fitting the throat is good.

[Bigjohn]

My problem is I do not know what the alloy is.

I only sort my metals/alloys into a small selection of groups; lead (as close to 100% as possible), range salvage (name says it all), Wheel weights (Clip on), Wheel Weights (Stick on) and linotype.

I use the range salvage for a hard cast type boolit as most of the metal is very hard material, suitable for fast loads, 9mm etc.