Moa

[44mag1]

Can anyone here tell me how to use a normal scope without mill dots to accurately adjust the turrets to the correct MOA given known bullet drop at known distance. For example,If 1 click equals 1\4 inch at 100 yards. how many clicks to center on 500 yards if you know your bullet drops 48"

[RU shooter]

4 clicks on your scope @ 500 yds will move your impact point 5"plus or minus a smidge.So if you know your drop its simple math from your lets say your 100 yd zero.

1 MOA@100 is 1"
1MOA@200 is 2" and so on and so forth

Tim

[Tom Myers]

Can anyone here tell me how to use a normal scope without mill dots to accurately adjust the turrets to the correct MOA given known bullet drop at known distance. For example,If 1 click equals 1\4 inch at 100 yards. how many clicks to center on 500 yards if you know your bullet drops 48"

If 1 click = 1/4 inch at 100 yards, then at 500 yards 1 click = 5 times 1/4 inch or 1.25 inches.

Divide 1.25 into 48 to get the number of clicks to zero at 500 yards.

48 / 1.25 = 38.4

So 38 or 39 clicks should put you right on target.

Hope this helps.

Tom Myers
Precision Ballistics and Records (http://www.tmtpages.com)

[44mag1]

This does help, thanks. Now I just need a ballistics calculator where I can put in BC and muzzle velocity to tell me how much drop out to the chosen distance.

[1Shirt]

It is my less than humble opinion based upon experiance, that unless you are dealing with the very top of the line scopes and big money, the markings on the scope are a good indication of movement, and only that. There are far to many variables involved particularly in shooting cast at X vols. to be able to dictate that 1 click at 1/4" will work on target. The referenced given by the responses are most excellent, and in theory will work a large percentage of time with jacketed blts at factory vols. If everything involving scopes, bal tables, vols, etc. worked just like the books said, life would be great, but shooting at least for me would become routine and boring. Books, tables, charts, etc. are good stuff, and I will continue to read and digest. That also said, I get more real world info that is practical from this web regarding both cast and condum shooting.
Good Luck!
1Shirt!

[jhrosier]

This does help, thanks. Now I just need a ballistics calculator where I can put in BC and muzzle velocity to tell me how much drop out to the chosen distance.

Try this one: http://www.huntingnut.com/index.php?name=News&topic=4

Jack

[44man]

It is my less than humble opinion based upon experiance, that unless you are dealing with the very top of the line scopes and big money, the markings on the scope are a good indication of movement, and only that. There are far to many variables involved particularly in shooting cast at X vols. to be able to dictate that 1 click at 1/4" will work on target. The referenced given by the responses are most excellent, and in theory will work a large percentage of time with jacketed blts at factory vols. If everything involving scopes, bal tables, vols, etc. worked just like the books said, life would be great, but shooting at least for me would become routine and boring. Books, tables, charts, etc. are good stuff, and I will continue to read and digest. That also said, I get more real world info that is practical from this web regarding both cast and condum shooting.
Good Luck!
1Shirt!
I am glad someone said it! :Fire:

[Tom Myers]

This does help, thanks. Now I just need a ballistics calculator where I can put in BC and muzzle velocity to tell me how much drop out to the chosen distance.

Take a look at the Precision Ballistics & Records System

Tom Myers
Precision Ballistics and Records (http://www.uslink.net/~tom1/)

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/System.gif

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/Firearm.gif


http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/Dataentry.gif

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/Trajectory.gif

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/Sights.gif

http://www.tmtpages.com/LinkSkyImages/forum_images/PrecBallistics/Wind.gif

[thebigmac]

HEY TOM, YOU JUST SHOWED WHY THIS FORUM IS THE BEST AROUND..... THANKS FOR POSTING ALL THAT INFORMATION FOR A MEMBER. WHENEVER A MEMBER NEEDS INFORMATION ALL HE HAS TO DO IS LIST HIS NEEDS AND SOMEONE HERE (usually more than one) WILL RESPOND WITH ENOUGH INFORMATION TO SATISY HIM.

[44mag1]

This is neat, will it work on a mac?

[felix]

That is a long distance starting at a hunnert. Use the program to get close. Aim at a rock, the smallest size you can hold for sure at your desired distance. Look for the AVERAGE wind amongst the weeds between you and the rock, paying much more attention to the closer weeds. You must shoot through the average wind. Set the gun with a firm grip sighted at the rock. Move the cross hairs to HIT where the projectile actually did HIT. Obviously you must see clearly the impact area to do this. Repeat this a couple of times and you are sighted in. ... felix

[44man]

Good info too Felix.
The biggest problem is the scope. I sight in a LOT of guns for fellas I install scopes on. Sometimes even a good scope will not follow clicks. Some marked 1/4" will be close with elevation but windage can be 1/2" or more and it could even be the other way around.
Since scopes went to the inner tube, moving one adjustment a little too far will alter where the other adjustment contacts the tube.
Red dots are notorious for having one setting change when adjusting the other. Inside tubes are smaller.
If you are adding a lot of clicks of elevation on a scope you are also making the gun shoot more and more sideways.
Too many times I have to shoot a group, add clicks, shoot another, add more clicks and shoot another so I can actually measure with a ruler to see what each click does. I then tape inside the cap and mark the actual adjustment in there.

[Tom Myers]

This is neat, will it work on a mac?


The software is designed to run on a Windows operating system.
I do not know the specifics but there is software available that makes it possible to run Windows programs on a Mac computer.

Tom Myers.
Precision Ballistics and Records (http://www.tmtpages.com)

[jhrosier]

This is neat, will it work on a mac?

If you have a spreadsheet that will open .xls files, try this one:

http://www.nfa.ca/content/view/58/197/

The link to download the spreadsheet is at the bottom of the page.

Jack

[MtGun44]

In my experience, calcs and tables give a decent rough estimate only of trajectory in the
real world. You can 'get on the paper' that way, but you need to shoot YOUR load in
YOUR rifle to find out what it will really do.

Bill

[44mag1]

http://www.hornady.com/ballistics/ballistics_calculator.php

[Ricochet]

It is frustrating to realize that your impact points often don't move anywhere near the amount that the marked movement per click would suggest. Also that when you, say, move 8 clicks to the left and then 8 clicks to the right, you're not back where you started. There's lash in the mechanism.

[crabo]

It is frustrating to realize that your impact points often don't move anywhere near the amount that the marked movement per click would suggest. Also that when you, say, move 8 clicks to the left and then 8 clicks to the right, you're not back where you started. There's lash in the mechanism.

If I am going to move in one direction, I back it up a couple of clicks in the opposite direction before going the direction I want to go. That seems to help in the slop in the mechanism.

[AZ-Stew]

In my experience, calcs and tables give a decent rough estimate only of trajectory in the real world. You can 'get on the paper' that way, but you need to shoot YOUR load in YOUR rifle to find out what it will really do.

Bill

44mag1,

Bill sent a lot of wisdom your way in the above quote. I've been shooting 500 yard rifle matches this year and have been learning a lot about trajectories, but more importantly, about the effects of WIND. It's a devil, and until you shoot a lot in it at long range, don't begin to think you're a 500 yard shooter. The trajectory tables, calculators, BC tables and all that other stuff are NOT the last word on the behavior of a projectile in flight. They'll give you the general idea, but only experience will tell you the true story about your rifle and load with respect to both trajectory and wind.

Regards,

Stew

[Doc Highwall]

If you know that you are shooting at 500 yards and the boolit drop is 48 inches an easy way to do the math is this. In layman terms a min of angle is 5" at 500 yards, 48"/ 5" =9.6 min of angle, round to 9.5 min of angle times the click value of your scope. 1/4 min clicks = 4x9.5 min =38 clicks.

[Bullshop]

This past summer shooting at 600 yards with my boys we set wind flags out. One at the target, one at mid range, and one at the shooting position. The flags seldom agreed to the wind direction. At times the mid range flag was 180* to the other two. The mid range flag was lower than the other two flags so I learned that the surrounding terrain has an effect on what the wind is doing.
Another thing I notice since we have plenty of winter here is that when driving in a snow storm the snow never blows straight down the road but looks like a snake winding its way down the road.
When I shoot in conditions like these I do as a jury in court and take the preponderance of evidence.
If shooting with a scope the angle of mirage is a good indicator.
BIC/BS

[Ricochet]

If I am going to move in one direction, I back it up a couple of clicks in the opposite direction before going the direction I want to go. That seems to help in the slop in the mechanism.
I do the same. You want to always approach the final setting from the same direction. I think the scope mechanisms may just push the crosshairs one way, against a spring. The trick is to figure out the best direction to approach it, for repeatability. Like always tuning up to pitch on a guitar, never down. I haven't figured out a way with a scope to recognize which direction is "pushing," vs. slacking off and letting the spring pull it, though. Maybe I'm misinformed and it's being driven by a screw both ways, anyway.

[BD]

It would be a better scope than I've ever owned if you could crank in 38 "clicks" in elevation without the change in windage moving you off an 8 1/2" x 11" paper at 500 yards.

it would be a better scope than I've ever owned if the "value" of the first click cranked was exactly equal to the "value" of a click 40 clicks later.

I'm not saying that such scopes don't exist, just that I've never run across one, or maybe it's that I can't afford one :)

All the published ballistic info can do is to help you get near the target at 500 yards. You still need to find a 500 yard range to shoot YOUR rifle to establish the elevation adjustment YOU will need.

I've sat at the bench next to a guy shooting the identical load in essentially an identical rifle, and had the difference in elevation change adjustment differ from 200 to 600 yards by 5 MOA. And that was with 1/4 moa national match iron sights shooting condoms with a BC of .362

BD

[Storydude]

My G1 phone has a ballistics calculator available for it. I've found myself using it more than once to get on paper. Like was said, the numbers crunched just are approximate. It says XXX clicks but you'll actually end up using YYY. But good for getting on paper beyond 200 yards.