Widener's Has Wolf Primers

[hyoder]

As of 2:00 p.m. CDT, 7/14/09, Widener's has Wolf Primers

[jameslovesjammie]

Wow...the price sure is different than a year ago.

SP $132/5000
LP $135/5000

Weren't these like $89/5000 last summer?

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

demand has changed - supply and demand is the key here

Demand has been severe for about six months and supply has been wiped out, hence the price change. Still a bargain compared to the prices on other brands.

Regards,

Dave

[runfiverun]

they announced a 20-25% increase in price for the wolf's some time ago i have been expecting it once they finished their intro.

[JesterGrin_1]

But Powder Valley will have WOLF primers in on the 15th which is only a few hours away at a cheaper price. It would work out to $127.50 per 5000.

I know that is more expensive than CCI or Winchester or Fed or Remington primers but that is the past which for myself is sad to say.

So the WOLF Primers is still a good deal when you compair prices to the others. But they do have a harder primer shell which takes a harder hammer strike.

And I would like to ask what might be a dumb question lol. I have read that you can sub a Small Rifle primer for a Small Pistol Primer. But is the standard rifle primer as good as a Magnum Small Pistol primer?

[swheeler]

"Weren't these like $89/5000 last summer? " Three or four months ago.

[JesterGrin_1]

This is what they say on the Powder Valley Web Site about WOLF Primers.

We are due to receive a primer shipment from Wolf on July 15. Wolf has provided us with a list of what items we will receive. Based on this information all customers who have a backorder dating June 30 or before should be shipped within one week of Powder Valley receiving the primers. Wolf had a 25% price increase on their primers. All primers will be shipped at the new price.

[Bass Ackward]

But they do have a harder primer shell which takes a harder hammer strike.

And I would like to ask what might be a dumb question lol. I have read that you can sub a Small Rifle primer for a Small Pistol Primer. But is the standard rifle primer as good as a Magnum Small Pistol primer?


I hear this all the time so it must be valid.

Aren't these made for civilian applications with a reputation to establish? I ask because I have been using Wolf pistols for a few months and you can't prove it by me. Coarse they had 3 or 4 months to cure out and dry well acclimating to my humidity levels. Fresh primers always have more risk of moisture in them no matter what the brand.

Never a misfire so far. But I have guns with very little end play too. Even my 625s, that are about as light as I have ever used for hammer fall, go bang. Appearance under pressure seems about like WW to me. Competitive groups, but I am using AR brass too.

Don't use the small rifle variety, so I can't answer your question there. But wouldn't the rifle cup be even thicker / harder than the pistol primer if this is an issue? Magnum pistol primers are noticeably HOTTER than standard pistol too. I would say hotter than anything else I have used in awhile. So you may not need a small rifle primer.

[GabbyM]

Amazing! They still have some today.

Sinclair has Sellier and Bellot Large & Small Rifle Primers. They sell for match primer price but maybe they're good? At least they aren't Russian. I bought CCI benchrest LR primers last week from Powder Valley. They had them for a day.

Also noticed Sinclair has 8lb jugs of H-Varget. Haven't seen any of that for a while. I couldn't get any this summer so picked up some Benchmark for 53 grain 22's. Haven't given it a test yet to see how I like it. All this component scarcity has forced me to test new to me stuff.

[Bad Water Bill]

Got 5K of Wolfe last year I loaded some into 218 Bee brass. 7 of 10 were duds. I broke the duds down and for kicks and curiosity put the primers into 223 brass hoping that the problem was the firing pin not the primer. No luck as they still did not fire. Well 4.900 primers sitting on the wall and your guess is as good as mine as to how many more are duds. This is NOT the first time their SR primers have done this to me.

[Junior1942]

This thread certainly makes up my mind as to whether or not I'll buy a bunch of Wolf primers--NOT!

[jonk]

I've shot over 10,000 wolf primers and never a dud. Excellant consistancy too. I hope Grafs gets some too- I've got a backorder with them for wolfs.

[CSH]

Wolf LP primers at Wideners were $97/5K in Feb. Now they are $135/5K. That's a 38% increase in 5 months, and quite a bit more than the announced 20 - 25% increase. This begs the question, "will the price drop to more reasonable levels once the buying frenzy subsides"? My guess is not by much.

[mike in co]

Got 5K of Wolfe last year I loaded some into 218 Bee brass. 7 of 10 were duds. I broke the duds down and for kicks and curiosity put the primers into 223 brass hoping that the problem was the firing pin not the primer. No luck as they still did not fire. Well 4.900 primers sitting on the wall and your guess is as good as mine as to how many more are duds. This is NOT the first time their SR primers have done this to me.


wolf makes three different sr primers...what did you buy ?

i'll take them.

i sold over 300,000 wolf primers in dec/jan.

i run a biz...and not a single customer has complained about thier primers not working.

personally, if you have 7 duds out ot 10...its the operator, not the primer.

no one can stay in biz with a 70% failure rate.

mike in co

[StarMetal]

I've been using Wolfs for 8 years now. I've never had a misfire. About the only thing I've noticed is this: Sometimes I'll drop a primer on the floor. Well I noticed often with the Wolf primer the anvil will pop out. I've never had that happen with any other brand. This only occurs with large primers...rifle/pistol.

Joe

[BPCR Bill]

I shoot Wolf 22 match ammo, (made in Germany) and 4 years ago it was $24 a brick of 500. Now it's double that, if you can find it. Just like everthing else.

Regards,
Bill

[JesterGrin_1]

The only thing I have used thus far from WOLF is there Large Rifle Primer. And I have found they are much harder to set off than the Federal 210's I have been using. I know this as I have a light hammer spring in my 1895 Marlin GS in 45-70 and would have to strike the Wolf primer 2 times for them to fire. But my Fed 210's fire without a hitch.

So I have to decide if I wish to make the hammer spring stronger for the Wolf or just keep it the way it is and just use Fed 210's

[Hip's Ax]

Federal primers are the most sensitive of all so your claim makes sense.

This is why its generally agreed not to use Federal's in semi auto rifles like the AR, M1 or M1A. I use Federal's in my bolt guns and something else in my semi's.

I use CCI #34 mil spec in my NM M1 7.62 because the 7.62 Garand is the slam fire king of all time. I use CCI BR2 in my 30-06 M1's and my NM M1A. I have been using CCI BR4 in my NM AR but recently bought Wolf SRM as I couldn't find any BR4's for a LONG time. Haven't fired many yet but so far so good.

I did buy a lot of Wolf LR and LRM because a friend of mine that does some pretty heavy in depth testing told me the Wolf is the best large rifle primer bar none. I have a 6.5-284 1000 yard rifle and a 6XC 600 yard rifle on the way and my friend told me in no uncertain terms that I wanted Wolf primers for them.

[Recluse]

This thread certainly makes up my mind as to whether or not I'll buy a bunch of Wolf primers--NOT!

I'm not a fan of Wolf primers, either. I've had sporadic luck with them (small/large pistol) back when they first hit the market.

Some folks have told me they've "improved." I'll take their word for it.

For the price increase they've laid on themselves, they'd better have improved to the point of being perfect.

:coffee:

[shooterg]

Know quote a few who use Wolf SRM in AR's. All are satisfied(including me). Bang every time. Don't see why other sizes would be any different, but haven't been there yet !

[StarMetal]

Junior,

I sure wouldn't make up my mind by what is posted here. I'd buy a pack or two and try them.

With that said I've fired them just about every type of firearm. Bolt rifle, semi rifle, semi pistol, revolver, lever actions...etc.. No misfires, none requiring second firing pin strikes. One other thing I noticed I didn't mention is they seem to fit tighter in the primer pockets then other brands and I like that. I've taken primers that have been noted as not to use in AR 15's and repeatedly kept rechamber a loaded round. Never went off from slamming home. Yes it did have a very very minute pin mark on the primer. If you want to know the truth I've had more misfire problems with CCI then any other.

I will note that Wolf primers have gone up in price substantially. This has to be price gouging. Before Obama was elected Wolf's were running about $19 a thousand from Wideners. After his election the first disappeared, like other brands, and then Wideners got a few in and they went to $24 a 1000. So now Widener has a pretty good bunch of them and they are around $29 a 1000. Did Russia elect an Obama? Did their finance and mortgage market collapse? Did their automotive industry file for bankruptcy? I think not...I think American greed and price gouging. You bet I'm angry. Everytime sometime comes along that threatens our firearms freedom prices on AR 15 change faster then the number prices on gasoline station signs.

Joe

[9.3X62AL]

Well stated, Joe.

Maybe we are our own worst enemy, in terms of the primer and component shortages. Every bleat from the hoplophobes sends us headlong to the gun shop or internet, panic-buying into multi-month backorders. Then, when product arrives--surprise, surprise--there's a 20%+ price increase. And people pay it.

I won't. I refuse to feed the predatory barstads. I've already been "hit up" at my local range to buy "stockpiled" WW LR primers--$100/1K. "G.I. Jane, bee-otch!" is a cleaned-up rendition of my response. Let the jackals and hyenas starve--maybe all those primers at 10 cents each will taste good with ketchup.

I don't HAVE to shoot for recreation. I have many years' worth of hunting and sight-in ammo on hand, and more than enough components to last at present shooting rates for the rest of my life. We need to HALT this panic right here, right now, or look forward to LOTS MORE such marketing ploys in the future.

STOP THE PANIC BUYING. Starve 'em out, and take the market back from the profiteering vermin.

[jameslovesjammie]

If anyone is unsatisfied...send your primers back to Wolf. They offer a 100% satisfaction guarantee and will refund shipping costs as well.

Read the bottom of the page: http://www.wolfammo.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5&Itemid=16

[jameslovesjammie]

Right on the money, as usual, Al.

[mike in co]

Wolf LP primers at Wideners were $97/5K in Feb. Now they are $135/5K. That's a 38% increase in 5 months, and quite a bit more than the announced 20 - 25% increase. This begs the question, "will the price drop to more reasonable levels once the buying frenzy subsides"? My guess is not by much.


i "believe" retail on wolf was 21/22 per k. both powder and widners were under retail....both were trying to move new a brand by pricing below retail.


the $27 per k is aprox the 25% increase annunced by wolf.

for all you "price gouging" whinners, should widners and powder valley now rebill everyone that they sold discounted primers to ???.....

so its ok to discount, but not ok to raise prices ???

give me a break...call me when you own your own company...

mike in co

[Heavy lead]

You guys that are angry have got to remember we live in a free capitalistic society, mostly that is forgotten. You must take the good with the bad. If they were price gouging they would get a hell of a lot more for them than $29.99/k. It's all about the supply and demand and nothing else. If you come back about an argument about that, then we have nothing else to talk about as you will never understand. Simply stated Al's post hits it on the head. If you don't want to spend the money for them, then don't, the power is in action or lack thereof not in b*&tching about it.

[StarMetal]

I believe Al was agreeing with me when he said "Well stated Joe".

Mike...sorry, I keep forgetting you're the person in the U.S.A to own and run a company.

Next time gasoline goes to over $4 n $5 a gallon I don't want to hear any complaints. I will tell you that the last time it did TN had an 800 number to turn in price gougers. Why would that be Mike?

Joe

[c3d4b2]

i "believe" retail on wolf was 21/22 per k. both powder and widners were under retail....both were trying to move new a brand by pricing below retail.


the $27 per k is aprox the 25% increase annunced by wolf.

for all you "price gouging" whinners, should widners and powder valley now rebill everyone that they sold discounted primers to ???.....

so its ok to discount, but not ok to raise prices ???

give me a break...call me when you own your own company...

mike in co

I have seen some info in the news about China complaining about the feds printing money and wanting to dump the US dollar. If the Fed's are printing money, the cost of imports will rise because the US dollar is not worth as much.

Also, the more money we send out of the country buying foreign products also has a negative effect on the value of the dollar.

The Wolf primers are still under the price I was purchasing Federal primers for before the election.

I also agree with Mike about the introductory pricing on the Wolf primers. When Bob Jones first started selling the Russian primers (pre PMC and pre Wolf) there was not much interest because they were an unknown. There was also a lack of interest due to some bad experiences caused by the primers needing to be seated differently than the primers we normally loaded. People were much more interested in purchasing them if they were viewed as a bargain.

The other thing I have noticed about Wideners is the pricing is not current on items they do not have in stock. I have also noticed they do not raise the prices (for the few items I have watched) on items in stock, until a delivery comes in with the new pricing.

[StarMetal]

I have seen some info in the news about China complaining about the feds printing money and wanting to dump the US dollar. If the Fed's are printing money, the cost of imports will rise because the US dollar is not worth as much.

Also, the more money we send out of the country buying foreign products also has a negative effect on the value of the dollar.

The Wolf primers are still under the price I was purchasing Federal primers for before the election.

I also agree with Mike about the introductory pricing on the Wolf primers. When Bob Jones first started selling the Russian primers (pre PMC and pre Wolf) there was not much interest because they were an unknown. There was also a lack of interest due to some bad experiences caused by the primers needing to be seated differently than the primers we normally loaded. People were much more interested in purchasing them if they were viewed as a bargain.

The other thing I have noticed about Wideners is the pricing is not current on items they do not have in stock. I have also noticed they do not raise the prices (for the few items I have watched) on items in stock, until a delivery comes in with the new pricing.
\

You are correct Wideners doesn't raise the price on stuff they have in stock when there is a price increase. For a long while, for example, they had 120 grain 6.5 Remington bullets way under competitors pricing until they sold out of stock. Wideners, I've thought, has always been fair on their pricing. I believe the Wolf primers got jacked up other places and probably Wolf too.

Interesting note. Obama just recently went to Russia....before Wolfs price increase. After his visit Wolf's pricing went up. Wonder if there is a connection?

Joe

[felix]

Why wonder? You know. ... felix

[GabbyM]

As mentioned above in post #28. The dollar is falling last I checked. Since last years price on Wolf primers I'd wonder how much the dollar has fallen to the Euro or Russian Ruple.
With zero incentive to discount primer prices a sale would be odd.

Natchez had Fed LR Match in for less than two hours today. They had a 5K limit.

[mike in co]

\

You are correct Wideners doesn't raise the price on stuff they have in stock when there is a price increase. For a long while, for example, they had 120 grain 6.5 Remington bullets way under competitors pricing until they sold out of stock. Wideners, I've thought, has always been fair on their pricing. I believe the Wolf primers got jacked up other places and probably Wolf too.

Interesting note. Obama just recently went to Russia....before Wolfs price increase. After his visit Wolf's pricing went up. Wonder if there is a connection?

Joe

midway does the same thing. i see this all the time at gun shows...
"i can get that for $xx at midway....."....well except they have none on hand...and when on hand THEN the new price gets added.

its a "trick" to capture customers.....poor taste in my mind.....

mike in co

[mike in co]

I believe Al was agreeing with me when he said "Well stated Joe".

Mike...sorry, I keep forgetting you're the person in the U.S.A to own and run a company.

Next time gasoline goes to over $4 n $5 a gallon I don't want to hear any complaints. I will tell you that the last time it did TN had an 800 number to turn in price gougers. Why would that be Mike?

Joe

i dont know joe.....how many people on the street actually KNOW what the station paid for the gas ??
i did not complain about gas prices. most lemmings in the usa have no clue how much we under pay for gasoline. go look at the dollar to the euro to the cost of gasoline. we are spoiled( and yes i like it) but when the price goes up to close to market, i dont complain.

and it has nothing to do with this thread...........

( and before you reply...i was in the petro biz too....i do know how it was priced).

next
mike in co

[StarMetal]

midway does the same thing. i see this all the time at gun shows...
"i can get that for $xx at midway....."....well except they have none on hand...and when on hand THEN the new price gets added.

its a "trick" to capture customers.....poor taste in my mind.....

mike in co

No you misunderstood. New old stock at Wideners gets sold for the adjusted price which is figured by what it cost them and then add their profit. They don't raise the price on new old stock when the reorder price had an increase. They also tell you to buy them before the price goes up as they know ahead there's going to be a price increase. Wideners does not operate like Midway one iota. When Wideners says they have it in stock, you can bet they do. Is this a pitch for them? No, I'm kind of upset by their new decision not to open their retail doors to TN residents. It's mail order for everyone now.

Joe

[StarMetal]

i dont know joe.....how many people on the street actually KNOW what the station paid for the gas ??
i did not complain about gas prices. most lemmings in the usa have no clue how much we under pay for gasoline. go look at the dollar to the euro to the cost of gasoline. we are spoiled( and yes i like it) but when the price goes up to close to market, i dont complain.

and it has nothing to do with this thread...........

( and before you reply...i was in the petro biz too....i do know how it was priced).

next
mike in co

I'm sure you remember I was in the petro business too. I was also on the other end, at the service station selling it, as was my one of my best friends. I can tell you it wasn't the service stations jacking the prices back in the older years. Today I think they have a good hand because they just aren't service stations today, now they sell groceries, pop, beer, lottery tickets, cigs, etc.. They are out for a big profit. Don't forget to that other countries such as Germany, Italy, etc., don't have the vast oil reserves we have along with our refineries, nor do they have the buying power the U.S. has.

The people on the street don't know that the gasoline actually cost the dealer, but the State Attorney General of TN does and if you think there is price gouging he will know if you tell him what you see it being sold for and where. Sure isn't new old stock when it comes to gasoline. Example, station has a 10,000 gallon tank. Say they paid $1 a gallon for the gas. They sell it for, let's say, $2 a gallon. Well say they only sold 1000 gallon out of their 10,000 gallon tank and they get the call from management bump the price per gallon up to $3 because the price of a barrel of oil went up. Well what about the remaining 9000 gallons they paid a $1 a gallon for? Yeah I know the answer, gasoline is a commodity. Know what, I don't care, I don't believe in commodity pricing.

Joe

[Echo]

i did not complain about gas prices. most lemmings in the usa have no clue how much we under pay for gasoline. go look at the dollar to the euro to the cost of gasoline. we are spoiled( and yes i like it) but when the price goes up to close to market, i dont complain.

mike in co

Right. It is more expensive in Europe, but mainly because of the ungodly tax they lay on it to fund their socialist activities - I think... And for that matter, the states and feds here receive more from the sale of gasoline than do the oil companies.

I've heard that the gasoline companies cost for producing a gallon of gas is about 40 cents out the door, the rest being shipping costs, profits, and taxes. Right, they have shown some record profits, but if one were to look at those profits as a percentage of gross, rather than as a Jillion dollars, they don't make that much.

When I was a management consultant, I had two clients that made about 22% net profit annually. Small companies, maybe a million gross annually, maybe a little more. Most clients didn't do that well - maybe that's why they needed management consulting! The larger the company, the less profit as a percentage of gross income. The Big Boys would be dancing in the street if they could turn 10% consistently. And I would be buying their stock. Remember, those oil companies are owned by you and me.

[ddeaton]

I have Wolf primers of the assorted flavors because of the price back when. I have griped and tried to find something wrong with them since I started using them. Mostly because I dont like buying anything that comes from Russia, or anywhere other than the US for that matter. I have found that they shoot and load just fine in all that I have tried them in. I am using them in 308 bolts and autos, 45acp 1911 running through a Dillon 650. Since they are a little harder to light off, I am going to start using them in 30 06 for the Garand as was stated above for the slam fire reason. I had some light primer strikes in my 1911, but found a flaw in my sear catching the second notch and slowing the hammer down. Everyone was blaming the Wolf primers till I dug in deeper and fixed the real problem. My 2 cents worth.:violin:

[mike in co]

[QUOTE=Echo;615099]Right. It is more expensive in Europe, but mainly because of the ungodly tax they lay on it to fund their socialist activities - I think... /QUOTE]


not the socialist programs, but smart economics.
they tax both cars and gas deeply.
every euro that is spent on fuel is money going out of thier country. few european countries have natural fuel resources....they buy fuel.

so they do two things to minimize the cash loss.
one: they tax cars on engine size, bigger engine, more fuel, more money out of the country.
two: they tax fuel deeply cause as stated its all cash going out of the country.

all of this is why one sees micro cars in europe, that combined with shorter distances...they are not wide open spaces like in the midwest/west.
( anyone know the retail cost of fuel in mid east and russia ?)
mike in co

[BPCR Bill]

Sinclair International has Sellier & Bellot Large Rifle Primers in stock as of yesterday. Never used them, but read some good reviews of them so I ordered some.

Regards,
Bill

[StarMetal]

[quote=Echo;615099]Right. It is more expensive in Europe, but mainly because of the ungodly tax they lay on it to fund their socialist activities - I think... /QUOTE]


not the socialist programs, but smart economics.
they tax both cars and gas deeply.
every euro that is spent on fuel is money going out of thier country. few european countries have natural fuel resources....they buy fuel.

so they do two things to minimize the cash loss.
one: they tax cars on engine size, bigger engine, more fuel, more money out of the country.
two: they tax fuel deeply cause as stated its all cash going out of the country.

all of this is why one sees micro cars in europe, that combined with shorter distances...they are not wide open spaces like in the midwest/west.
( anyone know the retail cost of fuel in mid east and russia ?)
mike in co


Germany has premium premium gasoline too, not this 94 octane lawn mower fuel we call premium. They also pay dearly for emissions and the police are very tough on them for laws.

I can't remembe if it was when the first Bush went into Iraq or the second one, but I heard gas in Saudi Arabia was .45 a gallon then.

Joe

[Junior1942]

As of this minute, all they have is LR & LRM. And large pistol and rifle.

[GabbyM]

Powder Valley has Wolf here on Friday eve.

[JesterGrin_1]

Powder Valley has Wolf here on Friday eve.

On Post 7 I did inform the good people of this forum they would have them and at a cheaper price than the place talked about here.

But after going through the primers I have I decided I did not need anymore just powder so I put in an order today at Powder Valley for H-110 since they have been out of W-296. I hope it shoots the same. :) :castmine:

I might be in the odd Group but I feel a couple of K for each round I load for is enough. And when things quiet back down of which I hope they do then I will get more primers as needed not just a primer that might be in stock at this time.