Colt trooper .38 special question

[44minimum]

My little nephew has inherited a colt trooper chambered in 38 special. I believe the same gun was manufactured one time or another in two different frame sizes, one size for 38 special and then later on a beefed up frame chambered in 38 special and 357 magnum. I would like to know if his weapon is the larger frame capable of handling 38 plus P and +p+ loads or if we need to stick to standard pressure ammunition. The serial number on the gun is 9169xx

Can any of you guys help out on this?

[Naphtali]

To the best of my knowledge, the TROOPER (not Mark III) has been Colt's 41 frame only, the same frame on which the Python is built. Assuming the revolver to be mechanically sound, there should be no issues with +p ammunition. I know nothing about +p+ ammunition.

[Rocky Raab]

I owned one once - and it's one of those guns I wished I had never let go. I loaded it warmish, but not full throttle. I didn't own a chronograph then (it was in the late Cenozoic Era) but I stuck to load manual recipes. I actually killed a deer with it, although I would never recommend it now - unless you can shoot one five feet below your toenails from a treestand, like I did.

I'd agree that there are no issues with +P ammo, but if you look at the straight skinny details, +P doesn't gain you much or cost you much in the .38 Special. I'd stay away from +P+ just as a general principle.

[Geraldo]

From The Colt Heritage, this one was built in 1957-58. The frame was based on the older Army Special/Official Police and was offered in .22, .38, or .357.

[nicholst55]

It's my understanding that .38 +P+ ammo is loaded to the same pressure as .357 Mag ammo. Not knowing how that Colt is heat treated, I think I would stick to standard .38 Spl, with perhaps an occasional .38 +P thrown in.

For the definitive answer, I think I would ask Colt.

[lastmanout]

I have a 6" barrel, I frame model '357' identical to your Trooper. A wonderfully smooth and accurate hand-finished weapon, made during the peak of Colt quality. I would NOT shoot hotter +p+ (30,000psi) loads in it. As mentioned the heat treatment/steel alloy might not be up to the pressures (two to three times standard 38 loads). The timing of Colt double action I frames is a wear spot. Lots of heavy loads and fast double action wears the hand, throwing the chambers off, causing lead spitting, etc. Parts and a good 'smith are not easy to find, anymore. You may never shoot it enough, but better to treat a fine old revolver to gentle standard loads. These pistols are usually very smooth and accurate. Old Wheelgunners favored the model for slow fire bullseye, many year ago.

[44minimum]

Thanks dudes for the input. One of my favorite loads for the other guns is 3.8 grains of titegroup behind a 158 grain lead bullet. Guess I might as well stick with it.

[NoDakJak]

I agree with lastmanout. One of my prize possessions is my "Colt 357". I owned a Colt Trooper and fired many +P loads through it with no apparent ill effects. I don't believe that I would care to fire +P+ loads through it however. If you want loads of that intensity you should switch to a 357 magnum. Treasusre that Trooper as it is one f the great guns.. Neil

[August]

I've always believed that the Trooper (originally) was the same frame and lock work as the Python. Only difference was the sight rib.

[Bret4207]

Lets put it this way- I have a Colt Army Special on the same frame as your Trooper. My Army Special is in 32-20 and is NOT among the guns listed in the same class as the Colt SAA. If 32-20 with it's heavier barrel and cylinder isn't listed as "strong" then I'd have to make the leap that the early Troopers like yours aren't either. FWIW- I've loaded my AS with SAA loads and seen no problem, but not as a general rule.

[Firebird]

Trooper started out as the "low end" police revolver, firing pin on hammer and less finish work and in 38 Special only; "mid-range" was the "357" Model in 357 magnum with the firing pin in the frame; "top end" was the Python in 357 magnum, firing pin in frame, full lug and vented top rib barrel and extra handwork fitting the action and finish.
Then in the early 60's Colt decided there wasn't any need for the mid-range "357" model, dropped it and made the Trooper in both 38 Special and 357 Magnum instead. There could be a difference in cylinder strength between the 38 special and 357 magnum Troopers, but I doubt it.

[gasboffer]

I owned one when they first were introduced. Heavy frame and cylinder. The hammer and trigger were made of some kind of powdered metal. Several owned by police in my department broke. They started replacing them with forged parts and didn't have any more trouble to my knowlege. They were great though, for pistol whipping unruly individuals.
IHMSA70

[mtgrs737]

I believe that +P adds about 1500 psi to the pressure of the standard 38spl. loading. I also believe that the +P+ adds about 3000 psi to the standard 38 spl. loading, so for each +P you get about 1500psi more pressure. I can't say where I read that info but if I am recalling it correctly the +P+ does not equal 357 magnum pressures.

[Hurricane]

Colt has said that any .38 Special that it ever made can be used with P+ ammo.

[Bret4207]

I put a lot of definite +P stuff through a Dick Special decades ago. Nice old gun, never a bobble.

[Char-Gar]

The old model Colt Trooper was built on the "I" frame, as were the Army Special, Official Police, .357 Magnum and Python. Even though the same frame was used, there were different steels and heat treatings for the various models on the same frame.

You are correct the Trooper was available in both 38 Special and .357 magnum. But, the magnum version contained different steel and the firing pin was in the frame and not on the hammer as was the .38 Special version.

38 Special +P pressure ARE NOT as high as .357 Magnum pressure and are safe to use in the 38 Special Trooper. The Trooper in 38 Special was essencialy a 4 inch version of the Colt Officers Model Match. They are sweet shooting, accurate and durable sixguns which are much to be desired.

38 Special +P loads do run as a higher pressure level than standard 38 Special loads, and while safe (won't cause the gun to fail) will cause ANY sixgun to wear at a faster rate than standard pressure loads. Standard pressure loads will also cause any sixgun to wear at a faster rate than low pressure target loads.

The handloader is able to match his loads and pressure levels to his needs and thus get the maximum service life from his pistol. I don't subject my revolvers to any higher level of pressure than that necessary to get the job done, whatever that may be.

I bought a one NIB at a gun show in 1965 and had it for six years when I had to sell it down river. I bought another in 2005 and it stays forever. I have an original set of Roper grips on it.

[Char-Gar]

gasboffer... You are confusing the Colt Trooper and the Colt Trooper MK III. The original Trooper was replaced with a newer cheaper version that did indeed contained sintered iron internal parts. That made for a rough trigger pull that could not be inproved with any amount of gunsmithing. That was just one of the major screw ups that Colt made about the same time. Those screw ups through Colt out the police market and the firm has never recovered to what is used to be. They also had a series of labor problems to kicked them when they were down so to speak. They have never got back up.

The new version is entirely different and has a shrouded ejector rod. The old model had an exposed ejector rod that was easy to bend if you bonked someody on the head with it. The new model was much better for head bonking, although inferior in every other way.

[Poygan]

Charger:
I had a Colt Trooper MkIII that had a great trigger pull IIRC under three pounds single action. It was almost as smooth as the Python I had....

[Dframe]

The mark III series came into existance in 1969 as a means of producing revolvers at lower costs. Seems hand fitting was expensive even then. As has been stated earlier All three of the I frame guns shared the same frame and action. That is the trooper the 357 and the python.
The trooper continued in the newer mark III version while the 357 did not. I own examples of all of them and like them all. Some people are put off by the (more S&W like) action of the mark III series but in my experiance they are some fine shooters. One of the most accurate guns I've ever owned is a .38 special metropolitan MK III. It was unloved and languished in an old police armory for years. It's amazing accuracy has made believers of a lot of people I shoot with. It certainly isn't as pretty as a python but it's just as accurate

[Rocky Raab]

While we're riding Colts, can anybody tell me what frame size the "Officers Model Match" was? I inherited one and the original checkered grips are just too fat for my small hands. I'll keep the old grips, of course, but would like to fit it with some more shootable ones.

[Guesser]

The OMM was a variation of the "E" frame, same as the Official Police.

[Rocky Raab]

Thank you, my friend. Although how much stock should I put in a definitive answer from a guy who calls himself Guesser? LOL!

[Guesser]

Rocky: I was precipitous in my answer; there were Match models also built on the "New Service" frame. I answered, thinking only of mine; a OM38 from 1941 and an OMS38 from 1951, both on the "E" frame size. And I do indeed spend a lot of time guessing!!!

[Rocky Raab]

Inherited mine from an uncle. It was originally either purchased or issued to another uncle (now deceased) as his official sidearm as an Air Raid Warden for the Civil Air Defense in the Big One. So it is at least as old as the 1940s. Priceless to me.