Homemade copper plated boolits?

[sheepdog]

So I got a mess of copper jackets I really can't recycle. Its just not an option. So me thinks I got a plan to do something creative with them but feel free to shoot holes through my dreams and correct me as I'm just guessing here.

1.) Make ammonia solution from stale urine
2.) Soak copper jackets in solution til they break down to elemental copper
3.) Submerge boolits in solution and add current
4.) Wait til results appear
5.) Remove copper plated boolits and wash stale urine off

Think it will work? I found info here but using a kit with copper supplied. http://support.caswellplating.com/index.php?_m=downloads&_a=viewdownload&downloaditemid=8&nav=0,1

[Old Ironsights]

Talk about pissing away your casting time...

[mtgrs737]

Why not just buy some ammionia at the dollar general to make your copper plating solution, or do you just want to make your own using beer as a starter solution?

[sheepdog]

I suffer from cheap bastardness but mostly just curious if it can be done. Not sure if it even has enough ammonia to completely dissolve copper. Sounds like this can work.

[par0thead151]

im interested in copper plating boolits... just not with urine!
i will spend the 5$ to get 5 gallons of pure ammonia at the dollar store!
has anyone on here successfully done copper plating?
how time intensive is it? what about added cost?

[looseprojectile]

Some of the best shooting bullets I have ever shot were plated ones bought from makers that were eventually put out of business on a polluting rap. Plating was a good idea that did not survive because of the cost of compliance with enviromental laws. Twenty years ago plating boolits was a viable and excellent way to make bullets, not now. I still see some plated bullets for sale and wonder how they do it.
Up to 1991 I delivered hazardous waste to various disposal sites and you wouldn't believe the cautions and processes and expense in place then, not to mention how it is done now. Government regulations will eventually outlaw everything we casters now do. You can bank on it. I am fairly sure I will not live long enough to see a total ban on cast boolits as I am seventy but you can be sure it is going to happen. Our legislators will create a freedomless utopia for us. Ya right. Hell, this reply has turned into a rant. Sorry.
You don't have to reinvent the process of plating lead, as a little research on the internet will fill you in, but I have been shooting unplated cast just fine for a long time. Good luck.

Life is good

[Wally]

It is simple...you obtain copper sulfate and place in a tub of water. On the bottom of the tub you place a piece of aluminum flyseceren. Place the bulets base down on the screen. Attach a wire to the screen. You then place the other wire in the solution not touching the bullets or screen..to that wire attach anything made of copper. You then apply DC electrical current to plate the copper on the bullets. You must get the polarity correct (ie anode/cathode). Wear rubber gloves, when in contact with the solution, as it is toxic. The longer you run the current the thicker the coating. However one should pickle (clean) the bullets so that the coating is even. Acid works best, but is dangerous---you can boil in a solution of diswashing liquid & water...be sure you don't touch them with your bare hands as that will contaminate them.

[MtGun44]

Use to plate steel nails by just dropping them into copper sulfate solution and wait
overnight. Not sure if it would work on lead, maybe not enough distance down the
electromotive scale.

Bill

[ETG]

+1 on Copper Sulfate. Used it long ago to copper plate - no urine needed :-) Auto battery charger works great. Don't remember where I got the copper sulfate - had a 50# bag and never did go through it. Don't recall seeing in any stores for years - course I wasn't looking for it either.

[Wally]

This will work, but the copper will be removed from the solution, so that the plating would be very thin, too thin to do anygood.

[Marlin Hunter]

+1 on Copper Sulfate. Used it long ago to copper plate - no urine needed :-) Auto battery charger works great. Don't remember where I got the copper sulfate - had a 50# bag and never did go through it. Don't recall seeing in any stores for years - course I wasn't looking for it either.


I think eBay has it for sale. I think it comes in a blue powder. I do not remember and don't feel like looking it up.

[303Guy]

Like this?
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo327/303Guy/MVC-038F.jpg

Copper sulphate, sulphuric acid, some other acid to make it work better, low current DC souce and the rub - arsenic!:cry:

Without the arsenic, the acids form a black oxide layer between the copper and the lead. I don't know whether the copper will stay on during firing. But copper can also foul the bore. Nickel can be added to the solution I think.

[sheepdog]

I understand how electroplating works this was more about can FMJ scrap can be dissolved to a usable format for it. I still don't see a yes.

[leadman]

If the jackets are for bullets you would use if they had lead in them you could have a mold cut to hold the jackets and pour molten lead in them. They would be Sheepdog HotCors!

They could be sized with a Lee push through sizer.

[briang]

If the jackets are for bullets you would use if they had lead in them you could have a mold cut to hold the jackets and pour molten lead in them. They would be Sheepdog HotCors!

They could be sized with a Lee push through sizer.

I think he wants to use jackets from recovering range scrap, which would be to mangled use in such a way.

[303Guy]

... this was more about can FMJ scrap can be dissolved to a usable format ... You could dissolve it in sulphuric acid to make copper sulphate or you could use it for the .... ummmm ... aahh ... anode? ... cathode?... by just letting it lie on a conductive grid. Even if you were to use an acid solution (with all the other bits in it) without copper sulphate, sooner or later the copper will dissolve to bring the electrolyte to its correct copper sulphate concentration.

[shotman]

How about soaking them in Coke? I know it will eat up a penny Copper sulphate is used as a crop spray or used to be. The guy on feebay has anything you need his price is $6.00 a lb and its 99% pure need info email me --ragebhardt@msn.com--rick

[Bigjohn]

Sheepdog, I have not researched this idea so I cannot comment on whether or not it would work. If the science is right then it will, but Gilding Metal (Jackets for Boolits) are not prue copper from what I read recently.
The plating process is simple enough but the rate at which the metal bonds with the boolit would need to be known, otherwise you will end up over or under sized.

And damn it, CRS has made me forget what the other metal is! I tink it's zinc.

John

[303Guy]

And damn it, CRS has made me forget what the other metal is! I tink it's zinc.
Gilding metal is a copper alloy, comprising 95% copper and 5% zinc. Technically, it is a brass. Gilding metal is used for various purposes, including the jackets of bullets ... OK so there you have it. I did try adding zink sulphate to my solution but I have no idea whether any zinc actually got deposited with the copper. At that time I did not know what gilding metal was made from - it just seemed like a good idea! Mmmmmm..... interesting! I did my boolit ten or fifteen years ago. Hell, I better get on with my projects and hunting!:shock:

[lead Foot]

Wally's right . Even if you could dissolve the copper, it wound be to thin to be any good . But give it a go I would like to know how you get on. You can fined Copper sulphate at your local gardening store. I used a similar process to remove copper from the inside of my barrels. Try about 1 1/2 volts DC works better. Bye the way I used watered ammonia for the electrolyte. It's cheap from the grocery store.
Lead foot;:drinks:

[303Guy]

Even if you could dissolve the copper, it would be too thin to be any good . That is true if the copper does not adhere to the lead. With low currents and the correct concentrations of the right chemicals, a fairly heavy, non-porous coating of copper (plus a little zinc) can be obtained, but whether it will survive the trip throught the barrel ...... ? To get the copper to bond as in plating (as opposed to a deposit on top of) one needs toxic chemicals and carefully controlled conditions. That's not to say it can't be done, just that a little effort may be required.
But give it a go I would like to know how you get on. Me too!:drinks:

[JIMinPHX]

I understand how electroplating works this was more about can FMJ scrap can be dissolved to a usable format for it. I still don't see a yes.

The way I've seen commercial platers do it, is they throw a bunch of copper nuggets into the plate tank & turn on the current in one direction, then, after the nuggets have dissolved, they put in the parts to be plated & turn on the current with reversed polarity. I don't know what the plating solution was.

I would assume that brass jackets could be substituted for the copper nuggets.

[RollerCam]

PART ONE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KM_hr5eCNo

PART TWO: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amv9ZfRLo-U&feature=related

PART THREE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-OZit3muEU&feature=related

[Hickory]

I don't have to take up drinking beer for this, will I?

[waksupi]

I really can't see why anyone would want to do it. As it is, with good lube and bullet fit, you don't get leading. I'd just about bet that you would copper foul your bore with these.

[MtGun44]

+1 on waksupi.

Bill

[zxcvbob]

It's a "because you can" thing. It doesn't have to make sense or be practical. :D

I'm impressed that he got a non-cyanide plating solution to work without flaking off in the tank.

The more boolits you plate at once (and the large the caliber), the higher the current should be. The plating thickness is proportional to the current density and the time. If you hang a whole bunch of bullets at once, you'll need to either crank up the current or let them plate for a long time.

I'd rather just use plain boolits.

[leftiye]

Look up posts by a member called "Gently." He's been putting a thick (.003") coat of copper on his boolits. He can direct you to a company that will supply you with alla the stuff you need. I believe it's called Texas Plating Supply. To avoid the black oxide layer caused by acids, you have to "pickle" the lead before plating. This also makes a good adhesion between the copper and the lead.

[nanuk]

I believe bluestone is copper sulphate.
available at most agriculture stores near you
used for killing pond scum, algae, and weeds in sloughs

also works ok for treating hand peeled posts for fencing, being a preservative
porous grained wood such as poplar works well. don't use resinous wood.
adds about 30 years to fence posts.

[Freightman]

Looks like fun! like I need another project.

[firefly1957]

I tried plating lead with little luck I had the black coating and when I cured that then copper just sank to bottom of solution? 303guy you said arsenic? are you sure it is not cyanide that is what is used commercially. Your bullet does look better than mine did.

[CLAYPOOL]

Copper sulfate is at farm stores for your pond water to kill water weeds. Do not do the whole pond at once as the rotting weeds WILL remove too much air for your fish to make it..
SEE YUW
CLAYPOOL