Mold frustration

[Humbo]

Hi!
I've purchased several molds lately, but I just can't get them to cast good boolits. First, we have the two Lyman molds, #452461 and #452490. First one drops boolits that measure .448 on one side, and .452 on the other. Second one drops boolits measured .446 on one side, .453 on the other, they're supposed to be .452. Molds close perfectly, so no problems there. I have tried different alloys, same results. Boolits are nice and have nice fill-out, they are just out of round. A copule of 6-cavity Lee molds also have the same problem, but not as severe.

Then we have the RCBS 300 grs SWC GC. It drops beautiful boolits, but they're supposed to be .452, my mold drops them at about .458-.459. Mold closes perfectly, and boolits are nice and round. I already broke one handle on one of my RCBS LAM2 sizing them. They are so big that after sizing, the crimp groove is pretty much gone.

I also bought some molds from Veral at LBT, no out of rounds boolits there, and they drop exactly at the right size.

Do I really have to spend 100 dollars or more on molds to be sure to get the decent stuff? At first paying 175 dollars for a mold was stinging my wallet, but now it seems more and more like a bargain.

I can't see any evidence of the mold halves close improperly. This is from Lyman #452461
http://home.online.no/~kjel-phu/bilder/IMG_3300.jpg

[Leadsmith]

I assume you are talking about used moulds. My first thought is to question if these were all bought from the same seller. On the first two moulds is the narrow dimension 90 degrees from the parting line and the fat dimension on the parting line? If so, I would suppose someone lapped the faces of the mould blocks where they come together. That would produce what you describe, bullets too narrow in one dimension and original dimension along the parting line.

The RCBS may have had the cavity lapped out, the results are good for a 45 LC or a 45-70 or any 45 caliber rifle.

Wonder what the experts on this board will say? (I'm not one of them)

Bob

[Humbo]

Leadsmith, thanks for the reply. I forgot to mention, these are brand new molds. And I haven't done any modifications at all, I only prepared the molds for casting.

[Leadsmith]

Sounds like they didn't get the mould halfs fully closed when they milled them. Unfortunately you should send them back to Lyman for replacement. The only other choice is to lap them yourself to make them round.

The RCBS should be sent back as well, but could be sold to someone that needs that size bullet.

I'm not suspecting your technique since you mentioned using an LBT mould with no problems, and the bullet in the picture looks fine to me.

Good luck

[mtgrs737]

I would send them back to the seller or the factory for replacement, be sure to send a sample of the bullets they produce so they can see the problem. The only other reason I can see is if the blocks did not expand properly and grew in one direction more than the other due to thermal expansion, but still .003" - .004" is a lot of difference at 90 degree measurements. Have you measuredd the base of the boolit cavity with calipers stuck in the base of the mould while closed? I'm thinking they are improperly machined, you should have no problem getting them replaced.

[HeavyMetal]

Currently quality control at many places seems to be on vacation.

In your case, and I'll use the 452461 as an example because you have posted a pic, this boolit looks perfect!

However it measures undersized! I'd contact the maker, in this case Lyman, send it back with a sample boolit of the same quality and a small letter explaining what you found wrong and ask for a replacement that met your size requirements.

With a sample as nicely cast as the one shown you may be able to get a bit more respect out of them then the average guys complaint of a bad mold.

You'll need to do this with each maker. I would also mark the mold I sent to Lee, in a suttle and out of sight spot, as they have a tough time admitting they make mistakes. I had them send me the same mold back telling me there was nothing wrong with it! It to was undersized!

Good luck.

[Shiloh]

I would send them back to the seller or the factory for replacement, be sure to send a sample of the bullets they produce so they can see the problem. The only other reason I can see is if the blocks did not expand properly and grew in one direction more than the other due to thermal expansion, but still .003" - .004" is a lot of difference at 90 degree measurements. Have you measuredd the base of the boolit cavity with calipers stuck in the base of the mould while closed? I'm thinking they are improperly machined, you should have no problem getting them replaced.

If it was mine it would go back in a heartbeat. Save your paperwork and send copies of reciepts. A firm but polite letter as well.

Shiloh

[badgeredd]

Humbo,

I concur with the improperly cut theory.

If the Lyman molds are really that much different in diameters across parting line than perpendicular to parting line, I'd send them back immediately.

On the RCBS mold, I'd bet RCBS will replace it with no problem, particularly if you call their Customer Service line. Now for what its worth, you can lube the boolits with a good lube through a larger sizer, say .457, and then step them down to .454 and again to .452. By doing it this way you'll lose less of the lube groove and aren't using so much pressure. Although it is a hassle,:( you might be happy they mold larger boolits in the future if you acquire more 45 caliber handguns. [smilie=1: I have Three 45 LC single action revolvers and 2 of them need boolits at .4555 or larger to not lead the cylinder/barrel. ALSO A THOUGHT, PERHAPS rcbs WILL ALLOW YOU TO PURCHASE THE OVERSIZED MOLD AT A SUBSTANTIALLY REDUCED PRICE. :drinks:

On the Lee molds, I'd lap them in a NewYork minute. You can usually improve the aluminum molds with little effort and a lot of care. A little at a time is the secret there.

Edd

[runfiverun]

that totally sucks to have a mold cast that well and be out of round.
i would bet someone with a 45-70 might want that 300 grainer.

[felix]

Out of round boolits when sized/lubed concentrically are just as accurate, provided the high sides grab the lands upon seating equally. Many, many shots in the BR gun exhibit no SIGNIFICANT difference. ... felix

[pdawg_shooter]

Out of round bullets, if large enough, tend to exit the barrel round. Shove a bullet down a round barrel with 16000psi + behind it tends to make it round.

[looseprojectile]

I feel your pain. I am a confirmed do it yourselfer.
I have spent the last two days trying to straighten out a Lee mould. Aluminum is easier to muck with than steel. This mould is a 250 grain .379 diameter two cavity.
I am shooting it in a .375 H&H magnum Ruger #1.
When i received this mould I discovered it is a Bevel base, had to go. Then it is not so round, fixed that. Then I made a push through sizer from a .38 special crimp die. Annealed the die and ran a .375 reamer through and bingo, .375 on the nose. Needs to be at least .379. On to polishing it out with 320 wet or dry and split dowell. Good to go now.
I am telling you all this to let you know what lengths some of us will go to to keep from making our moulds from scratch. I have always known to buy quality and never look back. That said, I also get a kick out of beating them at their own game. I am currently inventing a way of installing a paddle magazine release on a Century arms G 3 rifle without drilling any holes in the receiver. It never stops.
I hope, I hope.

Life is good

[Humbo]

Thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate your input!
I will at least return the two Lyman molds, I have been in contact with them and they told me to return the molds with a couple of sample boolits. Returning them will cost me half of what I actually paid for them, but it's better than having a couple of molds making egg-shaped boolits. I had big hopes for the Lyman 452461, it's a nice design and should be perfect for a Freedom Arms 97 in .45 Colt.

I've decided to keep the RCBS mold for now. My brother has a rifle in .450 Marlin, it could be fun to test some cast boolits in that one. I will contact RCBS though, maybe they'll sell me another similar mold at a reduced price. It was a very accurate boolit, but sizing it down to .452 is just too much work.

While I still have your attention guys, do you have any recommendations on good boolits for the .45 Colt and the .454 Casull? Guns are FA 97 and FA 83, the FA 97 won't take too long boolits though.
Thanks!

[454PB]

Sorry to hear of your bad luck.

As to boolits for .454 Casull, I like the Lyman 452651 (very similar to your picture, but weighs 325 grs. in WW alloy) and the Lee C452-300-RF. The Lee boolit is slightly shorter than the Lyman, but weighs nearly the same ready to load.

[Leftoverdj]

This is not a normal state of affairs. The current panic buying has the makers selling everything they can turn out. I believe the number of duds is directly related to new help hired to meet demand. As they gain experience, the quality should improve.

If you are in the US, shipping should not be a major expense. Two moulds will easily go in the small USPS Priority Mail box for around $5.