.58 H&R Huntsman Ball Size?

[Jeff H]

I remember when the H&R .58 Huntsman first showed up on a rack of a local shop and have wanted one since. That's been a while (QUITE a while) and I never saw any used ones in the intervening years. I finally found one (threaded breach) and it's on it's way to me now, possibly to be here tomorrow.

I was wondering who might have been shooting one of these for a while and if you could tell me whether this is a .560"/.562" or if it's in the .570"/.575" class for balls. I prefer a tighter fit over easy loading but a .570" or .575" is going to be a bit TOO tight for a gun that was meant to take .560" to .562"

I am certain there will be no manual with it and I have given all my ML books to a friend. All the same, I have found that information on the old Huntsman is pretty slim. I will obviously have the rifle to measure soon but am interested in others' experience as well.

Thanks much.

Jeff H

[dk17hmr]

I use a Hornady .570 round ball in mine.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=41499&highlight=huntsman

[Hanshi]

I bought a Lyman .562 mold long ago and it loaded easily and shot fine in my .58. Thing about NOT going to a larger ball is that you can use thicker patches if necessary. If your ball is too large there's not much you can do but live with it.

[Jeff H]

Doug,
Thanks for the input! The linked-to post was a nice bonus.:-D

Hanshi,
Thanks for the input to you as well. I am used to .50s and .54s, where the ball diameter options are generally within a few thousandths. When I started shopping around for balls and nolds for the .58, I found quite a difference in the size range.

I would not have asked whether I should shoot a .490" or .495" in a .50, knowing that experimentation was t he only way to sort that one out, but .560" to .575" is quite a range. Looks like I will start with some .560" and .570" balls and several patch thicknesses and work up or down from there. If "tighter" gives me discernably better accuracy, I will take t hat over "easy loading" myself.

While I have your attention, do either of you know if there is a half-cock or "safety notch" on the hammer on these? This is a "AL" SN, pre-transfer bar action. Mine arrived today in worse condition than expected but it is salvageable. The firing pin will not retract on its own so it's REALLY gunked up orf the spring is broken. There's enough gunk in the action that I can't tell if the hammer rebounds or not. There is no major pitting, so whatever the previous user slathered it with seems to have neutralized the nasties but the combination of that lube and the fowling created a cheesy, black paste.

Thanks again, guys.

Jeff H

[dk17hmr]

Its a rebound hammer. The "half cock" is at the point where the hammer wont go forward its not much but there is a click with mine.

If you would like to try a handful of .570 before you buy a box or a mold send me a PM. I got 2 boxes when I got the rifle and a member of this forum saw my hunting story and sent me a few pounds of round balls for it not sure what size they are but I can send some of those also if you would like some.

[Jeff H]

Doug, thank you. That was a very gracious offer.
My daughter went to visit friends near Lodi (OH) and stopped by The Log Cabin Shop and picked up some balls and patches for me today.

I found the half-cock notch too - AFTER I disassembled the action. Not the least amount of blue worn off the edge either, as if had never been engaged, indicating a bit of a geometry problem. I have no idea how anyone used it like that, and they USED it, because the thing was full of gunk. The firing pin spring is not broken, the recess was just so full of crap it wouldn't move. Found plenty of rust spots in the bore and could not even get the breech plug in, the threads were so full of hardened gunk.

All the same, I intend to get it back together before the weekend and try the .570s with a couple different thicknesses of patches. I will work it from there and then invest in my mold - IF I can find one! Everything is in short supply. I have pure lead saved - I just need to latch onto a mold. Still kicking myself for not restocking on caps a while ago. Last time I had to buy caps, they were just over a buck a hundred.

[clodhopper]

I used to have one and it was happy with .570 RB.
Mark

[Jeff H]

I used to have one and it was happy with .570 RB.
Mark

Thanks for the input, Mark.
.570" balls are on their way! I am glad I am set up to cast with the prices for this stuff today. Last time I BOUGHT round balls, I paid $6/100 for Speer .595" balls. At the time it was hardly worth casting balls and all my casting efforts went toward conicals for my Old Army and centerfire handgun stuff. WIth what caps cost, I am beginning to think about a flinter.

Probably won't get to try it this weekend now, as that elusive half-cock notch is so far up on the hammer that it's already past the sear when the hammer is against the front face of the hammer slot. Looks like I may have some parts issues to deal with.

Jeff H

[leadman]

Let me know if you need parts for the internals of the action. I have a few I accumukated over the years.
I have both a screw in breech plug and a push-in with an o-ring. Haven't gotten around to making a tool for the screw in plug yet.
On Greybeard Outdoors there is a good section on these guns. There is someone making an aftermarket ram rod for these guns too.
Took my first elk in Arizona with my 58. Used a 575 cast out of WW that I molded.
I have used 570 commercial and my own 575 cast balls with the 575 being more accurate. Been awhile since I have shot mine. Will have to break them out soon.
H&R probably won't help you at all on parts as they are a different company now.

[Jeff H]

Let me know if you need parts for the internals of the action...............


Aw, maaaaan! I just bought an action from a guy on GBO yesterday.

After running through the whole problem on GBO, I got a suggestion from one of the more experienced members, but after shooting it today, I am right back to suspecting a shortened sear nose. In fact, there is no question in my mind now. Someone did did a "trigger job," without considering the consequences of the timing.

I used the .570s and .015" patches my daughter brought me and they did OK. I only had time for an improvised range session but could tell that I got off to a good start with ball/patch size.

Thanks, Leadman.

Jeff H

[dk17hmr]

Hubbard makes aftermarket parts, like ramrods and brech plugs. I have a ramrod and it is much better than what they were sent out with.

I have never really done any serious target work with it just enough to get it sighted in and deer hunt with it. I found 80gr of RS worked pretty good producing 2 1/2" at 50 yards, which is good enough for hunting in my neck of the woods

[725]

+1 for Hubbard. Very good quality.

[10 ga]

I prefer the .565s. I have about 500 of various sizes I've picked up over the years. 58s usually are packed 50 in a box. The most unique ones are the remington "golden". They are .57+ as they are harder loading than the .570s. The not so "secret" is a good tight patch. I prefer linen when I can find it. Usually browse the racks in "Goodwill" or "Salvation Army" for cheap linen suits or pants. I can buy enough cloth for hundreds of custom cut patches for what only 100 would cost from commercial production. Next best is pillow ticking available at Wally Mega Mart in the sewing/cloth section. $5+- will get you enough to make hundreds of patches. Be wure to wash to get the starch out of the new cloth. For lube I use the 1 part bees wax, 1 part deer tallow and 1 part peanut or safflower oil (It has very high burn/smoke temp.) mix. Hope you have a much fun with your .58 as I have with mine. It's a Cabelas traditional hawken. Best to all! 10 ga

[Jeff H]

......available at Wally Mega Mart in the sewing/cloth section............... 10 ga

As for shooting patches, I used to buy pre-cut, pre-lubed Ox-Yoke patches for much less than it was worth to cut and lube them and they shot extremely well. The ones my Daughter just picked up were over $6/hundred. So, being smarter than the average bear, I wander into WM to grab a couple yards of pillow ticking.....

Said bear didn't seem so smart all the sudden when he ambled about, beginning to doubt his own mental capacity, going 'round and 'round in a circle where he THOUGHT the material used to be. USED to be! The only GOOD thing about it is that I realized I wasn't actually losing my mind or just lost in WM!

Thanks, 10 ga. I have wanted a .58 for a long time. Been wanting a nice little .40 or .36 too. Too bad H&R didn't sell extra barrels in a wider range of calibers for the old girl.

Incidentally, I will now have to find a new source of cotton flannel remnants for cleaning patches too now.

[Jeff H]

+1 for Hubbard. Very good quality.

Got one with my Huntsman.
Looks brand new.
Very nice workmanship and complements the brass hardware on my rifle.

[Jeff H]

Just wanted to "stop back in" and report that, with your help, I managed to sort out this "issue" with the Huntsman. It was the trigger after all. I got a brand new one from Numrich that matched perfectly except for two things. It had an extra pin sticking out the side, which is no longer sticking out the side, and thesear nose was about 1/16" longer. This allows the hammer to stay rotated back just enough that it does not keep the firing pin pushed into the nipple chamber. It is now as it should be.

Thanks for the help, guys.

Jeff H