Help!!!!!

[tmak]

ok i've been lurking for way to long learning lots but i've ran into some troubles that i know that some one here can help me out.

mix 23 lbs wheel weights
1 lb tin
5 lbs pure lead
casting temp 575-700 same results

i don't care if their frosted but i have never had a bullet come out of a mould with pieces broken like this.

so any help would be great.

[madcaster]

Maybe let the lead solidify a couple of seconds longer-also CHECK to be sure there is no zinc present!

[Rusty W]

I had the same problem with a 400 grain 45/70 from a Lee mould. I fluxed the mix with some old candle wax and stired the pot. Then I waited a little longer before I cut the sprue and opened the mould. I don't know which one helped but the problem went away. I cast around 700-750 in a bottom pour Lee 4-20.

[44man]

First you are wasting tin like crazy. At the most you only need 6 oz and 3 would do all that you need.
Then it looks like you are cutting and opening the mold much too soon. From the frosted look you are much hotter then you think.

[HeavyMetal]

Are you dropping these and air cooling or are you water dropping?

I would also like to know if your tin was pure or a solder alloy.

If a solder alloy it may not be enough tin for the amount of lead/antimony in your alloy which look a little "brittle".

Double check the tin content you added. If it was 95-5 solder you should be pretty close to 2.5% tin in the mix.

So I would take a good hard look at when these a breaking.

If they break as the come out of the mold I think the mold is to hot, if they break when they hit what your dumping them on try water dropping.

The boolits look well filled out and don't have the tell tale "divot" in the base signaling to high an antimony content.

I would try again but try to keep the mold cooler. If you casting with one mold leave it open after every other pouring and wave it in the air a bit to cool it. If you have a second mold that is the same caliber or weight try casting in tandum this may give you the cooling period you need to stop this.

[snaggdit]

My math says 29lbs of alloy. 1 lb of tin (pure or 95/5) makes the tin 3.4% of the alloy. Now WW have around .5% tin already. You are talking about 4% tin. 1-2% is all you need. I think you need to go with the suggestions about lower temp, cooler molds and letting the boolits cool a bit longer before dropping. We are all just guessing here, but give the ideas a try. Scientific method says to only change 1 thing at a time so you know what the problem was when you fix it.

[mooman76]

I second or third or whatever, Let it sit a couple seconds longer before you open the mould. Also I agree you are wasting tin and money. You add tin which makes it harder then pure which makes it softer? Pistol bullets don't need to be that hard. You can run with staight WW's or WWs with pure mixed.

[Dale53]

I recently picked up a good tip from Mike Venturino when casting. He uses a small manicure fan (4-5" diameter) for $7.00-$7.50 from Target or Walmart (both have them in the fan department). I have mine clamped just above my casting table off to the side about 8-10" above the surface of the bench. I have the bench padded with a thick towel. I fill the mould and set it under the fan for 2 seconds and both the sprue plate AND the mould blocks maintain a proper temperature for casting with out overheating. It cools the sprue quickly but does NOT over cool the mould. It is a REALLY worthwhile addition to the casting bench.

Your bullet metal AND mould are too hot and you are opening the sprue too soon. The fan will solve part of this (and you can turn the pot down a bit for the rest).

FWIW

Dale53

[jdgabbard]

Your alloy is too hot, and your cutting and opening too soon.

[tmak]

ok guys thanks for the help. let me give you a little more info.

I'm casting in a stainless pot over propane the temp has been pretty easy to control.

I am using a rcbs thermometer and tried a friends which is a lyman and they were within a few degrees of each other.

I'm dropping them on a towl that is folded several times. so no water dropping

i've ran it cold enough so the dipper freezes when i'm filling the mould. which is around 575. And the bullets look just the same other than not filled out.

i agree i need to slow down on the sprue cutting.

I'll quit waisting tin because it is way to much $.

Do you all think it best to add some pure lead to soften up the mix and if so how much?

I have casted hunderds of lbs in 20 to 1 for bpcr from .375 to .512 so that is what i'm used to and this is w/w mix is turning out to be a mess. i'm thinking i need to just go back to 20 to 1 for the pistol loads they are slower than my black powder loadings so why not?

[docone31]

I usually go straight WW and some zinc!! I run my pour really hot, and water drop. I cut my sprue as soon as it "freezes". The colour flashes and the center pulls in, then I cut the sprues.
I have had that result with my ingots. They were too hot when removed from the mold.
They are actually looking good. You just need to water drop rather than towel drop them.
I tried the tin route, and just wasted tin. I did not notice any better results from tin. Heat did the trick.
It looks like your heat is on target. Nice crisp corners, no wrinkles, "frosting" looks good on a load.

[Hang Fire]

First you are wasting tin like crazy. At the most you only need 6 oz and 3 would do all that you need.
Then it looks like you are cutting and opening the mold much too soon. From the frosted look you are much hotter then you think.

Ditto on all the above, been there done that.

[Slow Elk 45/70]

Tmak, non-magnum pistol boolits at 20-1 mix , sized .001.002 over bore size should be just fine at 750-1000 fps , I like 16-1 for mag pistol 1000-1400fps.

If you size correctly for the bore of your pistol , you should not have a leading problem , unless you have other issues with your weapon, and there are lots of variables.

Take the advise above on the tin, sprute cutting , heat , and try to set a rhythm for your casting. I think you will be better served going to your old mix @ 20-1, you can add a bit of tin [solder] if your fill out is not what you want. 50/50 WW- Pure works fine also, this way you save WW and tin, Pure is the cheapest componet you have. You don't need to be a metallurgist to do this. The Kiss Principal works here. WFM

Don't get discouraged to quickly, try the changes and work through it, have some fun, you will get it done.

[shotman]

You said a mix of wheel weights I have the same thing They are also very hard. You have a zinc/babbit in the mix add pure lead and it will clear it up. I bought a 50lb "WW" deal said it was Pure WW, that may have been true but it was not lead/antimony WWs. I run some in a shotmaker and had a mess. I made boolits and that is what they did. I added about 50% lead to get them to work

[Bret4207]

First you are wasting tin like crazy. At the most you only need 6 oz and 3 would do all that you need.
Then it looks like you are cutting and opening the mold much too soon. From the frosted look you are much hotter then you think.

Pretty much agree with 44man. The boolits aren't all that frosted looking to me, nicely filled out, good looking boolits over all. Just wait a bit longer and you should be fine.

On the alloy- just use straight WW! I can't understand where this idea that we have to harden WW comes from. It's about perfect, too hard almost, for most shooting from zero to 14-1500 fps at least just as it comes. And save the tin for when you really need it. That stuff is expensive.

[Humbo]

Maybe you could try smoking your mold as well. Had a similar problem with a Lyman mold, bullets would stick and the front driving band would sometimes break on one side when opening the mold.

[243winxb]

5 lbs pure lead Are you sure its 100% Lead? Any chance its a mix containing Bismuth? Or some other metal.

[tmak]

the mould is a new lyman and had a burr on the front driving band that caused the bullet to hang up.

the tin is 99.999 bar stock
the "pure" lead is sheet lead out of a x-ray room and i cut out the solder joints.
so if i'm reading this right i could cut this mix 50/50 with my pure and it would be just fine. this billet is a 200 gr swc .452 in a 45acp to say 800-850 shot in a 1911

[fredj338]

How does your alloy look @ 700deg? Is it smooth & glassy after fluxing or does it look thick? I know that zinc can cause all kinds of problems in casting. I've been casting for years & never seen bullets look like that, w/ chips taken out of them. I cast mostly straight ww or 50/50 ww & pure lead. I save the tin for 20-1 or 25-1 LHP. Are you fluxing before pouring?

[tmak]

I have ran the temp up to 750 with no change in the look. I'm going to try and mix it with pure at 50/50 and see what happens i'm begining to think there is some zinc in the mix some how some way. I'm also going to try a small fan on the mould for a second or two

[243winxb]

the "pure" lead is sheet lead out of a x-ray room It may have a high % of Bismuth. If at the 52% level, the bullet diameter will get larger after 3 days. Here is a PDF file listing alloy content % Note the low melting temperature. http://www.aimspecialty.com/AIM-fliers/Radiation-Shielding%20Alloys.pdf

[tmak]

success!!!!!!!!!! yeah we got the mould cleand up it is now burr free. bullets are dropping free now. i also split the mix 50/50 with "pure" lead. and they arent breaking when i'm opening the mould. i will let you now if the bullets grow after the 3 days aging time.