suppose.

[runfiverun]

just suppose that the primer/powder/brass shortage is just part of the demo's plan.
think about it...
drive up the prices on everything by 100% then throw a tax at that inflated price.
don't think so...
bought a pack of smokes lately?
not only that but even without the tax if you make 24,000 a year and your shooting budget is 1,000 it is still gonna be 1,000 even if the price of the ammo is double.
your shooting will just be cut in half.
either way he wins somehow.

[Ole]

Nobody can keep any in stock because people are panic buying.

Just imagine how hard it would be to find canned green beans if everyone that ate canned green beans decided they needed a lifetime supply in their pantry right now!

[Ole]

BTW: If you don't believe me, buy an air rifle. Those are still cheap and ammo is plentiful. :mrgreen:

[monadnock#5]

Primers have disappeared from the marketplace. Hoarders, panic buyers, used by manufacturers to make loaded ammo? A combination of some or all of the above? Me not know.

Manufacturers pounding 24/7 to meet demand.

So where's the ammo? Have you checked stock at ammoman.com recently?

I don't know what's going on here, but it ain't good whatever it is.

[Tom Herman]

Hi Folks,

I've been scouring the local gun shops for months. Forget the big stores, as their ordering is controlled by people with heads in places other than where they should be.
The locals order when they need to. I watched the shelves go bare, and now start to slowly get stocked again.
At first, there was zero powder, other than a few bottles or cans of stuff that no one would normally find useful.
Gradually, the amount of powder has been increasing. One store now has a full shelf of powder (but still no Unique!), with at least ten different types.
Yesterday I about fell over when I found a single brick of Federal Small Pistol priomers sitting there!
I am dangerously low on them, so I snagged it up. The price was just under $60.00/M, about nearly double what I paid for them last time I found any available.
No, I'm not happy about the price, but I think it will come down as demand slacks off.
What I'm seeing leads me to believe that availability is getting better over time...

Happy Shootin'! -Tom

[rhead]

Another possibility along the same line is that the tax increase is coming and enough people know it is coming that they think it might be smart to buy some ahead now and avoid the tax to the extent that they can.

Ole: Works for green beans too. If you liked green beans and figured that tyey would cost 3 times as much next year wouldn't it be financially prudent to buy as many cans ahead as you could afford. Of course growing green beans is easier than making primers.

You are right about the airguns, cheap ammo and plenty of fun.

I hope I'm wrong and it is just a lot of paranoia driven

panic buying. Either way it sure is agrivateing right now.

[mooman76]

Some where they will have to give in and get some primers out there for us loaders one way or another and soon. You don't need to buy their bullets and powder and brass if you have no primmers to make it all work! They got more loaders/loader wantabees than they've ever had and allot of them are going to loose interest and give up and go home if they can't get what they need!

[archmaker]

I have noticed an increase in ammo and primers, but an increase of Zero to 1 is a huge increase percentage wise.

I have been looking for the last few months for primers, powder and ammo.

I noticed an increase in powder first, and now I am able to find some ammo, even Gander Mountain is starting to getting some ammo in, and in some cases it is quite a bit of some that has been missing (223).

I saw the other day at the Gander Mountain in College Station (I had some time to kill before I had to attend a recruiting event - yuck!) that they had 200 primers for LP magnum for $4.45 per 100. Nothing else but they did have some in stock.

I left these as I am okay on LPM, and just recently acquired 2k of LP from Midway, and traded another 1k for some excess SP that I had.

So I think the "green beans" are starting to show back up.

On another note I have been charting the price of primers on Gun Broker and I am noticing a trend of downward prices of what people are willing to pay. Not a lot of difference, but now some of the prices are stating "Free shipping".

What does this mean? I do not know, but IMHO I think we are going to see a trickle of supplies hit the shelves and they will stick around longer and longer until it gets to look more like normal.

[runfiverun]

i ain't sayin they are causing it.
i'm sayin they knew it was gonna happen and are gonna take advantage of it somehow.

[Ole]

Well I read a lot of other forums (mainly only post on this one) but, to me, it's not hard to tell why there's such a shortage.

I read a forum where a gentleman that owned a lever action rifle went to his local Gander Mountain/Cabelas/etc and bought 30,000 primers. All of the same kind. Because he didn't like not finding them in the 3-4 places he normally shops.

Now that guy has every right to buy 30k primers for his .30-30. I'm just pointing out where the problem might lay with the stores not being able to keep the shelves stocked.

:drinks:

[Recluse]

Well. . . we're doing this to ourselves.

A year ago, I had to fly to Maine for my father-in-law's funeral. Avgas (100LL) has never been cheap, but in Rochester, New York, I paid $7.62 per gallon. Back home in Texas, I was still paying over $4.60 per gallon and thought THAT was a deal.

Then guess what? A whole bunch of pilots just said, "To hell with it. I'm cutting my flying WAY back."

A few days ago, I topped off the wing tanks for $2.49 cents per gallon. A friend of mine topped his plane off for, get this, $2.18 per gallon--he paid LESS for 100LL avgas than I pay for the premium gasoline for my wife's Avalon.

Yes, the avgas jobbers took the "supply and demand" route and priced their product way up there, coincidentally in late spring and summer and early fall when most (pleasure) pilots fly. A lot of pilots finally got fed up and said, "No way."

Personally, I cut MY flying way back as well save for the medical mission trips.

Now, this is a bit apples to oranges here, but so long as we have the BONEHEADS out there who go and buy up 50K of primers when they don't even have a reloading press, but they buy up the supplies "just in case," that's not planning head--that's panic purchasing.

When you have the BONEHEADS who buy up 50K for the sole purpose of scalping those primers on Gunbroker and elsewhere, that's not planning head--that's something I can't say on a family-friendly forum.

So guess what? I'm doing what I did when avgas shot sky-high (no pun intended). I'm cutting back on my shooting. Instead of loading and shooting 600 to 800 rounds every week/two weeks, I'm cutting that back to 200 to 300 rounds every two to three weeks.

Now, that also means less money for my range since I'm not there as often. And guess what else? They're closer to the industry than I am--and yeah, they're raising some serious hell with THEIR suppliers, who in turn are now raising some serious hell with the manufacturers.

I drafted a letter this weekend to Winchester and CCI reminding them what happened to Colt when Colt decided to put their government contracts and business ahead of everyone and everything else. I was polite, but firm, that I did not appreciate being viewed as a second-class citizen and being made to wait until the Government got THEIR fill of good before I, the citizenry, got mine.

If even one third of all 80 million gun owners did the same thing (wrote the manufacturers), we wouldn't even be having this discussion because we'd be too busy casting boolits and reloading ammo and going shooting.

But we're worse than a bunch of old ladies. And why not? Hell, less than a lousy TEN PERCENT of gun owners even care enough to join the NRA or any RTKBA organization. That's PATHETIC.

And THEN, of the four million or so NRA members, not even a fourth will bother to write, e-mail or call their elected officials or gun manufacturers or whomever.

Instead, we congregate on forums like this and preach and whine to the choir.

If we spent even a fifth of that time raising cain with gov't and manufacturers. . .

:coffee:

[Slow Elk 45/70]

:kidding:Recluse, I like your point, you are right IMHO, but trying to get people to hang together on ANY issue is almost UN-do-able. To many different opinions and no one can get a majority of folks to go along , with out a battle. Look at the group buy mold situation, start a thread, try to get people to decide on a design.....No wonder it is hard to get a Honcho.:roll:

We want it all, but as you say, a lot of people won't even support the NRA, let alone the other organizations. So, everyone will keep buying as soon as it hits the shelf, they just started loading/shooting/casting or they are taking advantage of the situation for $$$[smilie=1:
or they think they need enough for 10years. Who knows, they may be right.

This is no different , if we all sounded off in unison, someone might listen, maybe we need a "Community Organizer" Har , Har :twisted::twisted: :kidding:

[joejr]

at ktp yesterday,200 primers per person and they only had a couple bricks of win standard large pistol and rifle

[Storydude]

Over one BILLION rounds of ammo were purchased in March alone.

Do you people REALLY think CCI, speer, Fed, win, rem, can keep up with demand like that?

Again, is it panic buying or sound financial sense? How many here wish they had bought SA .308 battlepacks for 39.99? X39 ammo for 80 bucks 1200?

Those that do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. History in this case being 1993-1994.

[Idaho_Elk_Huntr]

Most here are old enough to know what it was like when Clinton was in. What I want to know is why everyone waited till Obama gets elected and then realizes they need , ammo, powder and primers. Did you think it would be any different? I think people are buying because most realized they should of had a stock and didnt. Looks like many here were not prepared.

[dakotashooter2]

Watching the outdoor channel last night and it was stated tha CCI is at max production and producing 4 million rounds of 22 RF per day. Thats about 2 million cartons a year. Since this country has several million shooters thats not gonna leave much if they are hoarded.

[jonk]

Watching the outdoor channel last night and it was stated tha CCI is at max production and producing 4 million rounds of 22 RF per day. Thats about 2 million cartons a year. Since this country has several million shooters thats not gonna leave much if they are hoarded.


That's not enough to shoot. It sounds like a big number but that works out to 18 rounds of 22 ammo per KNOWN gun owner per year. Of course there are other manufacturers, Remington, Winchester, etc... but even if they are all making them at similar rates buying 2 boxes of 50 per gun owner per year would keep the shelves bare.

I for one say then that production is not nearly high enough.

[anachronism]

If the Manufacturers are truly running this hard, then there are some pretty damn big warehouses somewhere, that are full of shooting supplies.

[Ed Barrett]

If you look at the number of shooters and gun owners before the Obamanation, compared to the number of reloaders it was only (by my very inaccurate polls) less than 10 percent, more like 5 percent. I see people who have never reloaded buying dies books and supplies. Most of them have not even reloaded yet. They are getting their info on what to buy from their "brother-in-law" who once reloaded a box of 30-30 ammo with a Lee Loader. (and most of them went off) 20 years ago. On the other side of the equation are the people on this board who load by the "bushel basket". I have taken several of these people and shown the what reloading really is, about half throw up their hands and say it's not for them, the other half I am trying to bring them in to the reloading fold. Try to be patient and maybe things will settle down some day.

[dakotashooter2]

I contend that excessive taxation or regulation of ammo is a violation of the second amendment. Since firearms are dependent on ammo for their function ammo is as much a part of the second amendment as the firearms themselves.
Since the second amendment is a right granted to all citizens, making firearms and/or ammo excessively difficult or expensive to acquire would be discriminatory to those who are of low income. Prohibitive cost or regulation limits or eliminates their ability to utilize that right. Does the government have the right to charge us for the basic use of our rights????? Will the future bring microchip "speech meters" so we can be taxed on every word we utter. Will people at pubilc events be subject to an "assembly" tax??? Will we be charged a "life" tax??? Will they assess a "liberty" tax???

I really see no difference.

[leftiye]

Yup, All that's needed is for us to let them think that we'll stand still fer it!

[klcarroll]

I have never subscribed to "Conspiracy Theories"; ......Mainly because in our culture, conspiracies don't work!

Conspiracies fail, and they fail at a geometric rate, ....because NO ONE can keep their mouth shut!

If one person knows a secret, then there is some chance it will remain a secret.

If two people know a secret, ...someone will blab within 90 days.

If four people know a secret, .....it will leak out in two weeks.

If eight people know a secret, ....it will be on the front page of the New York Times tomorrow!!


So..........., I have a real tough time believing that there is a deep, dark conspiracy in operation: .......Particularly when we're talking about the current batch of Democrats!! (....A bunch who absolutely LOVE to hear themselves talk!!)

Kent

[runfiverun]

don't have to be a conspiracy. just a plan buried in paperwork that no one cares to reveal.
the beauty of the plan, is that the people being taxed would cause the increase themselves just like smokers and drinkers. and people that eat at the drivethroughs [yes there is an extra tax there]

[monadnock#5]

Nineteen posts back I asked rhetorically where all the ammo was that was supposed to be on the shelves in lieu of primers. Today I found it at Riley's in Hooksett. 5.56, 7.62X51 and 39, plus .50 cal. By the case. There were still plenty to go around when I walked out. Way to go Federal. The prices weren't too bad either. $369.00 for 5.56 and $339.00 for 7.62X51.

Primers OTOH, and as expected, are in very short supply. 0 in stock at Kittery TP, and only a few, maybe 8000 of some types (LR,LRM,SRM,LP and SPM) at Riley's with a 1,000 mix and match limit per customer. No SR in the northeast as far as I can tell.

[JSnover]

If you're gonna float a conspiracy theory make it a good one. The shooting sports industry must have given billions to Obama through all the usual DNC channels because he promised them more legislation (or the threat of it) in order to boost sales/profits for the manufacturers and dealers and generate more taxable transactions for the gov't.
Give it a rest, folks. Obama scared a bunch of people out of their armchairs and supplies dried up. This has all happened before.

[mooman76]

Most here are old enough to know what it was like when Clinton was in. What I want to know is why everyone waited till Obama gets elected and then realizes they need , ammo, powder and primers. Did you think it would be any different? I think people are buying because most realized they should of had a stock and didnt. Looks like many here were not prepared.

Actually it did start way before he got elected in fact it started when everyone thought Hillary had a chance. It just snowballed and took awhile for the manufacturers supplies to run out and it kept getting worse after he did actually get elected plus the fact that allot of us now remember the original Clinton ban and what happened. Yes allot of us didn't forsee it getting as bad as it has. I knew the gun thing would be there but I got all the guns I need already not that I wouldn'tlike a few more. My mistake was think I was safe because "I reload". Who would have thought that there would be a primer shortage? Not I. I have enough to get me by a year or 2 but I have to admit I am getting a little nervous and if I saw some primers I would snag up a few boxes. I got allot of powder sitting on the shelf but what good is powder without primer. It's just one link in the chain.

[rhead]

It started when it became obvious that the republicans were going to be stupid enough to let the media pick McCain to run against the Dem's pick. Like the good little lap dog he is McCain didn't even seem to contest the race. Once he was in the dems had it in their pocket and this was on the way.

[anachronism]

Anyone who looks at the current situation, and doesn't realize that the market is being manipulated, has blinders on.