alloy for a gc rifle boolit?

[Box13]

If Im going to use a gc on my 30-30 boolit (31141)how soft can the alloy be?I know you want a fairly hard alloy without a check but how soft can you reasonable go with a gc installed.I have everything from pure lead...to wws...and lino to choose from but dont like to use up the harder stuff if I dont need to as its getting more and more expensive.Can I just use lead or is ww needed or would I have to use lino?...Robin

[Nora]

My question would be, what are you going to use the boolit for? Target, hunting, plinking?

[runfiverun]

ww's and soft mixed and water dropped can be pushed as fast as a j word in the 30-30.
with just as good or better accuracy.
makes a good hunting alloy too.

[Box13]

Ill be using them for sight in and limited target/plinking at my home range...but the main intent is for hunting.As I am casting them myself I could shoot a lot more for the dollar...I just want to know what kind of alloy to use for a reliable hunting boolit.My first castings are wws I just didnt want to waste wws if I needed to use lino...Robin

[shooterman]

i agree with runfiverun. my mix is 4lbs WW and 1 lb soft. i try for about 3% antimony. i personally don't quench just air cool. 2000 fps is possible with no leading whatsoever.
13179
13180

[madsenshooter]

WW will work fine for hunting, lino gets into the realm of too hard. They'd be like Full Metal Jacket boolits with little or no expansion.

[Slow Elk 45/70]

Hullo Box13, welcome, I use 50/50 pure/WW, it also makes a difference how fast you want to push the boolit. with a GC you should be able to get 1700-1800fps with out leading, if your boolit is sized correctly for your bore. Water dropped you should be able to go 2000fps or a little faster. Then you will probably need WW/Linotype.

Most of my 30/30 shooting is done at about 1700fps, my top end hunting load is 2,000fps.
I water drop all of my boolits these days, just personal preference, it makes my life simple, the older I get the simpler I seem to be[nice play on words].

So in a word, to answer your question, 50/50 with GC water dropped is good enough for the 30/30 at hunting velocities. IMHO

[Box13]

Thanks for all the info.Thats just what I wanted to hear.I have limited lino,40 lbs,but around 400 lbs pure and 100 lbs wws.50/50 ww and pure sounds economical and effective.The target speed is 1700+ so it looks like this is what I want.Now I should be able to make a great boolit and shoot it untill I really get it dialed in.My first batch of 100 are just ww and after seating the check and sizing/lubing they look great.Ive cast several k of pistol boolits with very good results but this is my first checked rifle boolit...Thanks again...Robin

[Bret4207]

If Im going to use a gc on my 30-30 boolit (31141)how soft can the alloy be?As soft as your individual gun will handle with that load I know you want a fairly hard alloy without a check(Who told told you that? Not true, depends on the gun and load and fit) but how soft can you reasonable go with a gc installed.I have everything from pure lead...to wws...and lino to choose from but dont like to use up the harder stuff if I dont need to as its getting more and more expensive.Can I just use lead or is ww needed or would I have to use lino?...Robin


Look, I mean no offense and I'm not picking on Box13, but this is another example of folks trying to apply hard and fast rules to cast and IMO there are few hard and fast rules. I bet if you get a decent boolit, fit to your gun, and play with the loads a bit you could shoot near pure lead with or without a GC as velocities suitable for at least small game. I'm fairly certain that duplicating the old 32-40 loads in a 30-30 with a 311041 would be a snap with a decent barrel and fat enough boolit.

I suppose all I'm saying don;t assume you're locked into a certain area with cast just because the magazines or "hard cast" crowd says you are.

[Box13]

Thats why Im asking for opinions on what alloy to use.This is my first gc rifle boolit.So as always I ask for advice then adjust for my gun.For my first casting with this mold I used wws and they will be shot next weekend as a test to see where to go from there.With the advice I got here I think I will have no trouble dialing it in without a bunch of unknowns popping up.Thanks all...Robin

[grumpy one]

As Bret said it depends on how lucky you are with internal barrel dimensions. My 30-30 is dimensionally challenged in that area and may be a bit sensitive on that account. Best accuracy I've ever found is with a near-maximum load of SR4759 (17-18 grains) behind a 170 grain flat-nose, with driving bands about .001-.002 over groove diameter and nose about .002 over bore diameter. That probably gives me about 1700 fps (20"barrel) though I haven't measured it. Indications are for that load in my rifle, straight air cooled WWs, which run 10.5 BHN, are a bit soft. The best results I've had so far were with 14 BHN, which means a bit more alloying or a mild heat-treatment is needed. However I need to do some more work in the range of 14 to 18 BHN to nail down the best hardness. Unfortunately results are rather variable so a lot of testing is required.

The complicating part is that you want to hunt with the same load, so you have to give some thought to how much expansion you need and how much toughness. You are working in a hardness region where it shouldn't be too difficult to find a solution, though. I suggest you start off at the range finding out what is the minimum hardness you need, to give you maximum accuracy without leading. Then stick to that hardness for your hunting load. The final alloy choice will then depend what the required hardness actually is, together with what you are going to shoot at.

[Bret4207]

Thats why Im asking for opinions on what alloy to use.This is my first gc rifle boolit.So as always I ask for advice then adjust for my gun.For my first casting with this mold I used wws and they will be shot next weekend as a test to see where to go from there.With the advice I got here I think I will have no trouble dialing it in without a bunch of unknowns popping up.Thanks all...Robin

B13, start with the WW. WW cam often be driven at near jacketed speeds and give fine performance on deer size game. Many of the guys here report going as soft as 50/50 WW/pure lead and still pushing them along at 1800+ fps. It all depends on your rifle and what it likes. At speeds above 17-1800 fps a good FN WW boolit often comes out of a deer looking like a perfect Remington CoreLokt picture, if you can even find the boolit since they have a tendency to pass through.

The GC will help make things easier, but even a GC won't prevent all leading if you exceed your rifles needs.

If I could give some advice- get that barrel fouling free before shooting much cast. Some guns it makes no difference, but overall a clean barrel is the way to start.

[Recluse]

The GC will help make things easier, but even a GC won't prevent all leading if you exceed your rifles needs.

If I could give some advice- get that barrel fouling free before shooting much cast. Some guns it makes no difference, but overall a clean barrel is the way to start.

What leading usually tells me--with MY guns--is that something was wrong with my load and not the lead. Too fast, not sized correctly, improperly lubed, didn't slug the barrel correctly, etc etc.

95% of everything I cast is from straight WWs that I drop straight from the mould into my water bucket. I do this so that I know my boolits are consistent, so if anything needs to change, it's my loading configuration.

And the advice about getting the barrel free of fouling--especially any copper fouling--is spot on the mark true.

:coffee:

[pdawg_shooter]

Use pure lead ( 2% tin to get it to fill), leave the GCs in the box and paper patch. You can then load as fast as you want with NO leading.

[Box13]

Paper patching is one thing I have never gotten around to trying...Im guessing it somewhere in my near future..Robin

[pdawg_shooter]

Paper patching is one thing I have never gotten around to trying...Im guessing it somewhere in my near future..Robin

You will be amazed at what that little bit of paper will do for you. Soft lead at 2200fps, and with a BHN of 18 or so you can go over 3000fps. Accuracy that will equal, and in some cases exceed that of jacketed bullets. NO leading because lead never touches the barrel. Ease of cleaning. Polishing the bore better than anyone can lap one. A bit of work, yes, but anyone who reloads and especially those who cast are not afraid of work.