bear loads for my 6 inch 686 357 s&w

[grizzlydueck]

Hello all I just am getting into the world of cast bullets -I am a hunting guide -prospector-ppc shooter years back -And have now bought a 686 6inch 357 mag for guiding and while looking for the mother load! Please do not respond with any rifle -shotgun -anything other than 357 hand gun advise ...thanks !

[Throwback]

For hunting black bear I like the idea of the 358429 173gr bullet cast from ACWW. Accurate #9, 2400, and H110 are my favorite powders here. H110 is a little but sensitive to the cold and is best used with a magnum primer but it is very accurate and usually will give you the highest velocity.

I don't have a date listed here but I got 1,285 fps with the listed maximum of 15gr H110 out of a 4" Ruger Blackhawk. It works very well with no issues in cold weather but in hot weather it shows too much pressure. For this reason I have backed off a half-grain for my high-end loads.

13.5 gr of 2400 has worked well for me.

In either event, back off 10% and work your way up from there. Each gun is a law unto itself.

[NSP64]

I used to load the 160 gr sil hornady bullet over max loads of bluedot(10gr). If you don't hit em you'll catcch him on fire.Or use the 130gr fmj round for 38 super over 9.5 Bdot and work up.

[Larry Gibson]

grizzlydueck

In Blackhawks, L & N frames and Security Sixes I use old H110 load data under the 357156 cast of ww/lino alloy in a 60/40 mix. I use 17 gr H110 which is 1/2 gr shy of the old max load. Granted this is over the max used in manuals today but I only use this in the heavier revolvers for which the .357 was first made or for which the revolvers were made for the original .357 loadings. Those who don't want to excede current manuals certainly do not have to. I have been shooting this load since '68 in numerous heavier framed .357s without a single problem. I do suggest you work up to it though if you decide to try it. In a 6" barrel it always gives a genuine 1400+ fps velocity. Penetration and accuracy are all that could be desired. It is the load that the .357 Magnum was claimed to be.

Larry Gibson

[Bullshop]

I have a small business casting and loading ammo. I also live in bear country. For folks handicapped with the 357 I load the Lyman 220gn SWC-GC cast in straight WW and quenched. I am not in my shop right now so cant look up the load but I believe it is with H-110 powder. It is a very accurate full power load in either revolver or rifle.
If you would like I could make my way to the shop and find the powder charge. Today I am just sitting at the computer nursing myself after what feels like a mak truck impact but is more likely a flew bug. If its important I will try to navigate the staires to the shop. If not I will sit here and sip rose hip tea and share my misery.
BIC/BS

[Snapping Twig]

Lyman 358429 is 170g from WW.

I load that over 15.5g W296 and a WSP.

Check the data and work up to it.

I use a non magnum primer and have excellent results.

[waksupi]

Welcome aboard, Grizzlydueck. Good luck with keeping a subject on topic on this board. Never seen it happen yet, but I admire you asking!

[dk17hmr]

I will vote for the 358429 also. I dont worry about bears here in Michigan, seems they avoid me even when I am hunting them, but I often carry my 4" 357 magnum with me in the woods when cutting wood or hunting. It is ussally loaded with a max load or close to max, I would have to look, of H110 and a 358429 or a 358156. I prefer the 429 over the 156 beecause I dont really care to seat gas checks on that small of a pistol bullet.

I did just get some 190gr Flat Nose Gas Check bullets that would probably be a better choice, just because of the extra meat.

[GP100man]

Gotta agree , 358429 pushed as fast as the boolit will stand !!

GP100man:castmine:

[Slow Elk 45/70]

Yup, 358429, WW water dropped, 13.5gr 2400, in the Ruger blackhawk, security6, back off to 12.5-13.0 for Smiths L&N
I haven't found anything I like better in years of shooting 357.

[Beerd]

If you like the idea of a tumble lube boolit, Ranch Dog Molds has a good looking 190 grainer in 35 caliber.
..

[jeff423]

I know this isn't a cast load, but 18 gr. of Lil Gun under a 158gr Hornady XTP is quite effective.

Jeff

[azrednek]

I recommend the Lyman Spire Point bullet cast hard because of it's ability to penetrate deep into the bear's vitals. Lyman no longer manufactures the Spire Points so you would have to go the used route for a mold. See them here in the swapping and selling section and on Ebay. The Ideal and Lyman number is either, depending on the year it was made 35793, 357 93 or 357093. I don't have a picture available in my files of the 357 version, here is a pic of the 44 version. The point is sharper than pictured, when I seated this bullet I didn't have the proper seating stem and flattened the sharp tip.
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/dnisbet/AA-spire-A.gif

[legend]

if you HAVE to,358429 would be a good choice.
since you dont HAVE to,a .44magnum with 429421 might be a better choice.

[Pepe Ray]

The famed bear guide, Ed Stevenson (Sp?) carries a .357 as his "just in case" gun.
His daughter assists him in his guiding svc and packs a 357 as well. Ed explained his reasoning/philosophy of this unusual endeavor, in a Rifle Magazine a while back. Maybe it was a Handloader. Aside from the obvious, shooting ability requirements, the most important need was for a bullet that didn't deform , at all.
I can't argue with it.
Pepe Ray

[Screwbolts]

I would go with the Ranchdog or similar over a max charge of what ever powder you have. or the max charge you can shot accurately. If I was going to buy a mold for this purpose I wouldn't get anything less than 180 gr. and it would be a WFNGC or a LFNGC. I would use the heaviest bullet with the biggest metplat that you can shoot accurately.

Ken
Central NY

[rhbrink]

Ranchdog bullet shoots great in my 686, good mold and priced right, had to size my to .357 and seat deeper than crimp groove on the bullet, just seat to correct OAL and put a heavy crimp on the case, works just fine.

[MT Gianni]

We have had several group buys for a 180 gr fn. It is a near copy of the 180 or 185 gr LBT that are for sale from many distributors. I am pleased with it's penetration and meplate the two items that matter most in putting an animal down. Where are you at? Our bears in the US vary from 200 lbs to 5-600 lbs which can mean a lot for bullets to deal with. Are you guiding for bears or in a place where you might surprise them? Following up on a hit bear from a tree stand hunter over bait may need a different bullet than leading fishermen through 5' tall huckleberry.

[Pepe Ray]

Grizzlydueck;
I guess you need to differentiate to your responders, your requirements.
There's considerable difference between a bear hunting load and a grizz defence load. Especially when using cartridges of marginal muscle.
Pepe Ray

[Calamity Jake]

IMO, get enough gun to handle the job, your life may depend on it, Trade that 686 for 29 and use a hard 300gr boolit

[missionary5155]

Greetings Grizzlydueck and WELCOME
I view bears as I view mean hog hunting. I would not consider it with what I KNEW is minimum.
For PROTECTION I would use the heaviest 357 Flatnose boolit I can find. You are not shooting distance so POWER and Penetration is THE key. I would go the MAX my wheel gun could handle. I would not be overly worried about leading as you are not target practicing... the goal is staying alive. You NEED all the horsepower a 357 is going to give you.
I carry a sawed off model 19 down here ( 3.5") in the desert. It is loaded with a "drilled deeper Lee boolit" that weights 180 grains(softmix). I load it with 7 grains Unique. It is MAX. It is erratic at 25 yards. But I do not need 25 yards accuracy... I need 15 feet and less to stop the wild dogs if they get ugly. I normally also have a 44-40 SRC with me but sometimes no.
But for a bear ... ??? Not on purpose hunting.
Get a good Bear spray... That will keep a non killer away.
Me I carry a 41 mag up North ... I may never see a bear in East Illinois but I think a 265 at 1300 fps will do what I need. As soon as I can find a 280+ I will load that.
Mike in Peru HE is Risen !

[waksupi]

I'm assuming you don't generally live in bear country.
Put anything you want in the pistol. When the bear gets you down, if your gun hand is in his mouth, once you can feel his tonsils on your wrist, begin firing until the firearm is empty. This will generally solve the problem.
On the other hand, so to speak, if the bear has you by the non-gun hand, Place the muzzle between the eye and ear, and squeeze one off. This will end the situation in one shot, assuming you have directed the bullet through the brain.
This may sound a bit flippant, but it is not. If you really need a gun for a bear attack, these are the conditions you will find yourself in. If you are shooting when it is far away, it isn't a threat. If you think you will really need to defend yourself and others from attack, carry a shotgun, or rifle. Nothing else will take thier place.
I've seen so many topics over the years with the "what if a bear" theme, I get the fantods. I assure you, I don't carry a gun to the outhouse every time I go out, in an area that is frequented by black bear, grizzly, and lion.

[gon2shoot]

I'm assuming you don't generally live in bear country.
Put anything you want in the pistol. When the bear gets you down, if your gun hand is in his mouth, once you can feel his tonsils on your wrist, begin firing until the firearm is empty. This will generally solve the problem.
On the other hand, so to speak, if the bear has you by the non-gun hand, Place the muzzle between the eye and ear, and squeeze one off. This will end the situation in one shot, assuming you have directed the bullet through the brain.
This may sound a bit flippant, but it is not. If you really need a gun for a bear attack, these are the conditions you will find yourself in. If you are shooting when it is far away, it isn't a threat. If you think you will really need to defend yourself and others from attack, carry a shotgun, or rifle. Nothing else will take thier place.
I've seen so many topics over the years with the "what if a bear" theme, I get the fantods. I assure you, I don't carry a gun to the outhouse every time I go out, in an area that is frequented by black bear, grizzly, and lion.


"Place the muzzle between the eye and the ear and squeeze one off" ??
You mean on the bear right? :coffee:

[dubber123]

"Place the muzzle between the eye and the ear and squeeze one off" ??
You mean on the bear right? :coffee:

:grin: too good!

[waksupi]

"Place the muzzle between the eye and the ear and squeeze one off" ??
You mean on the bear right? :coffee:

Dealer's choice. :shock:

[MT Gianni]

I'm assuming you don't generally live in bear country.
Put anything you want in the pistol. When the bear gets you down, if your gun hand is in his mouth, once you can feel his tonsils on your wrist, begin firing until the firearm is empty. This will generally solve the problem.
On the other hand, so to speak, if the bear has you by the non-gun hand, Place the muzzle between the eye and ear, and squeeze one off. This will end the situation in one shot, assuming you have directed the bullet through the brain.
This may sound a bit flippant, but it is not. If you really need a gun for a bear attack, these are the conditions you will find yourself in. If you are shooting when it is far away, it isn't a threat. If you think you will really need to defend yourself and others from attack, carry a shotgun, or rifle. Nothing else will take thier place.
I've seen so many topics over the years with the "what if a bear" theme, I get the fantods. I assure you, I don't carry a gun to the outhouse every time I go out, in an area that is frequented by black bear, grizzly, and lion.

If you do not have the mind set to so this you should not be armed with a pistol in bear country.
Well written Ric.

[robertbank]

Dealer's choice. :shock:

.....whistle while you work.....


:mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgr een::mrgreen:

Take Care

Bob

[jdgabbard]

There was a big story floating around the net some 5 years ago or so. About a record size bear in Alaska, or oregon or something. Guy shot it 5-6 times with 300 mag before he could get it to stop. When examined further it was noticed that were some "older" holes in the torso. When looking at it further it turn out to be 6 slugs from a .357mag. Immediately they went looking for remains of anyone that might have been in the area in the last week or two. Sure enough they found a half eaten body.

Moral of the story. Bring enough gun or don't go at all.

I'm a firm believer that the .357mag is one of the finest calibers ever devised. But when it comes to a raged bear, I'd rather have a 4" 500 Smith.