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View Full Version : Is this a good fluxing agent?



BrushBuster
01-30-2006, 09:18 PM
When I begin casting with my Lee 20 lb. bottom pour, I intend to flux well then cover my melt with Kitty Litter for the full casting session. Trouble is, I don't have a cat! What I do have is two bags of floor absorbant material called Zorb-all, and it is 100% diatamacious earth.
Have I got a good fluxing material here, and is it good for my intended purpose?

brushy the newbie

Buckshot
01-30-2006, 09:23 PM
...............Yup, you're good to go.

.................Buckshot

carpetman
01-30-2006, 10:34 PM
BrushBuster---NO you cannot use that floor absorbent. It messes up the whole scheme of things. The kitty litter makers only make so much and it is intended for cats. So if you bought a bag and used it for other purposes,that would mean a cat is deprived and either gets a busted bladder or all constipated,or ruins the carpet. This is good. Someone might learn they don't really want one of the mangy things. If you use floor absorbent,you don't get the target that comes on the bag of kitty litter. You deprive yourself of a lesson in humility by not buying kitty litter. You don't get the character building experience of standing in line at the grocery store with a bag of kitty litter and having all the other customers and the cashier looking at you thinking you are a cat lover. You don't get the satisfaction of thinking if they only knew. You also mess up the economy. The floor absorbent is cheaper(same product) so you don't spend as much money. This is not good. Several of us here are on retirement and our pay raises are based on cost of living. Some cheap skate comes along using floor absorbent when they could buy more costly kitty litter makes our pay raises less. The only saving grace to all of this is you said you don't have a cat.

454PB
01-30-2006, 11:04 PM
Actually, if you had a cat, you could save some money by using the old cat litter when you change it out. You will get used to the smell and the burning eye sensation after a few sessions.

Us retired guys learn all sorts of ways to save $ while on a fixed income [smilie=l:

BrushBuster
01-31-2006, 01:19 AM
Okay, probably that was a dumb question, cause I figured this stuff I had hanging around for years would be the ticket. But I'm the cautious type! I'm also allergic to cats, let alone not having one.

From Buckshot, a straight forward answer.
Carpetman, I think I got your approval, sort of. Is that stuff really cheaper than cat litter? Can't remember what I paid for it.
454PB I too am just another of those cheapskate retired types, working all the angles, and enduring the course of an old newbie. But I like it so far!
Thanks guys. :lovebooli

carpetman
01-31-2006, 01:53 AM
Brush Buster---You said you think you have my approval. Well I must say the way you phrased yourself "trouble is I don't have a cat". That aint trouble,that gets an A+. Oh BTW welcome to the place.

yodar
02-18-2006, 10:44 PM
When I begin casting with my Lee 20 lb. bottom pour, I intend to flux well then cover my melt with Kitty Litter for the full casting session. Trouble is, I don't have a cat! What I do have is two bags of floor absorbant material called Zorb-all, and it is 100% diatamacious earth.
Have I got a good fluxing material here, and is it good for my intended purpose?

brushy the newbie
----------------------------

No it isnt good for FLUXING. It will help gather contaminant particles from the surface of an alloy as an adsorbtion agent

Marvelux is a flux in material that I am loath to recommend ,because tho it works, it must be used properly or it will cause grief.

Rather than go into that let me remind you that FLUX is a physical adjunct, not a chemical agent. It helps aggregate particulate contaminants on the surface of alloy and aggregates bad particles and dirt into clumps which you scoop off.

I recommend boric acid or 20 mule team Borax, which if left alone, will fuze into a glassy crust which you scoop off. DONT STIR ! Let it crust, then scoop


Yodar

Chuck 100 yd
02-18-2006, 10:51 PM
Throw in a couple of loaded rounds, gets the dross out quick!! I have a cat you can have for free.

357maximum
02-19-2006, 01:15 AM
Why you all making fun of tabby for.








They are purrfect to have around




Don't have to make the long walk up and staple another one on the board, they self procreate, and are just jumpy enough to make it real, plus the coyotes gotta have something to play with.

454PB
02-19-2006, 01:45 AM
The only grief I know of with Marvelux is the fact that it absorbs moisture. Your stirring spoon (stick, screwdriver, tire iron) has to be preheated before plunging it into molten alloy. For those of us that cast in poor ventilation, that's a small price to pay, and it there is a clearly printed precaution about that fact on the container.

I know all about the dire warnings concerning lead poisoning, I've had my blood lead levels tested and they are fine :violin:

David R
02-19-2006, 01:57 AM
Actually, if you had a cat, you could save some money by using the old cat litter when you change it out. You will get used to the smell and the burning eye sensation after a few sessions.
[smilie=l:

Ever smelt an old lead pipe from some bathroom plumbing? Prolly smell the same as used kitty litter.

bobthenailer
02-19-2006, 05:30 PM
uses saw dust for a flux and also as a oxidation barrier left on the top of the melt i dont think you can use cat litter as a flux but you can use it for a oxidation barrier . saw dust is cheap and is what the smelters use see glen e fryxell articles on a simple art of fluxing at the los angeles silhoutte club web sight. bob

MT Gianni
02-19-2006, 08:20 PM
454pb marvelux can also cause any iron or steel in the vicinity of the melt to rust quickly. I don't know why chemically just the results. Gianni.

John Boy
02-19-2006, 08:47 PM
Have I got a good fluxing material here, and is it good for my intended purpose?
Buster, the short answer is ... No. But a pea size of beeswax is. Stir it into the mix and then scrap the bottom and sides of your pot. The slag rises nicely to the top

And I agree with bobthenailer. Sawdust is what the foundries use.

454PB
02-19-2006, 10:59 PM
454pb marvelux can also cause any iron or steel in the vicinity of the melt to rust quickly. I don't know why chemically just the results. Gianni.

That's due to it's hygroscopic nature. I Keep the container covered except while dipping.

abunaitoo
02-26-2006, 03:33 AM
I was using a flux I got from Midway. Kind of a mess and would not really clean the lead well. Read on the web about sawdust, so I tried it. Works great. Seems to fill the mold better. It's free. Only downside would be waiting for the smoke to burn off. Not a problem as I cast outside anyway.

Sawdust is a winner for me.

BrushBuster
02-26-2006, 01:50 PM
I really like these responses that provide CHEAP AND EASY solutions to fluxing and melt covers. I'm still sitting up here in the bush waiting for my casting components to arrive, and I guess this leaves me with too much time to think!

Now I've got to wondering what would be better; fine sawdust like from a table-saw, or coarser chips like a chain-saw produces? I do understand that the sawdust needs to be bone-dry to avoid any moisture reactions, and to get carbon circulating throughout the melt. I too will be smelting and casting outdoors, so smoke won't be a concern.

Also thinking about using clean wood-ash (which should smoke even less), for fluxing and covering. This would seem to make an excellent absorbing and anti-oxident melt cover, but do wonder how much carbon is left in ash? I'm fabricating a smelting pot that I can bring up to heat over a wood fire and then maintain temperature with a propane torch while I do my fluxing and ingot making. Hope this concept works?

One thing for sure, if either of these items works well, there is no reason not to flux often and get that alloy CLEAN.

abunaitoo
02-26-2006, 05:15 PM
Here is the like to the article that I read about sawdust. Made me a believer.
http://www.sixguns.com/crew/simplefluxing.htm

Blacktail 8541
02-26-2006, 06:41 PM
I've read Glenns' work a few times before and it has been helpful.

bobthenailer
02-26-2006, 06:43 PM
ive used the fine dust and small wood slivers from a electric planer with equal success! all wood was kiln dried

BrushBuster
02-27-2006, 01:01 AM
abunaiitto, thanks for the link to the G. Fryxell article. That pretty well takes the mystery out of this fluxing thing.

Here's a quote from an experienced caster from my neck of the woods. His advice brings up so many good points that I thought it was worthwhile posting for those of us just getting started:

on fluxing; I usually use paraffin when smelting raw wheel weights and
do it repeatedly all the while scraping the sides and bottom of the pot
until I get virtually no more crud on the surface.

The melt gets poured into ingots. The last pour invariably has a layer of
black grit on top of it despite my efforts at cleaning. I am guessing this
might be magnetite which prefers to cling to the iron pot rather than rise
to the surface but I could be wrong.

When the ingots are fed into my casting pot (RCBS) I flux again using strips
of oak left over from shop projects. Simply stir and scrape the pot with the
stick. If the metal is hot enough the stick will gradually char away and
introduce carbon into the melt to do its' job. Skim the crud and put your
K.L. or Zorball on top and I don't do much more fluxing unless I add quite a
bit more metal. If you use wood be sure it is extremely dry hard wood. Soft
woods contain resin pockets and might cause problems on top of which they
tend to catch fire when you remove them from the pot. Introducing even
minute quantities of moisture as contained in wet wood into a pot will have
you jumping with the result.

In the same vein I also learned a lesson about bringing ingots in out of the
cold the day before I want to cast to avoid water vapour condensing on the
ingot when brought near the heat of the pot. I warm them over night and then
take them directly to the pot outside.

With all this good advice I'm ready, but it's -25 outside! But then again, your ingots will cool quicker, right? :rolleyes:

Blacktail 8541
02-27-2006, 01:17 AM
BrushBuster, good post! It contains almost all the aspects on this subject in a very consise manner, the little part about the sap is very important. Thanks Much