Rooster Red - Lyman Super Moly Shoot Off

[MGySgt]

Disclaimer - This is one test in one gun. Yours might very!

Dan, at MM, and I were conversing about Lubes and I wanted to try some Rooster Red to see if it would solve a leading problem in my Ruger. After I tried it and thought that it wasn't as good as Lyman Super Moly I decided to do the following Test.

Drew

Test Date – 1/16/06, Cloudy 45-55 degrees
Ruger SBH 4 5/8’s 44 Mag, Bowen Custom Classic rear sight.
All loads dumped with a Lyman 55 powder measure.
Starline Brass
16 gr 2400
CCI LP primer
285 grain plain base SWC Brass made by Mountain Molds
AC WW
Range 30 yards.

Rooter Red (RR) versus Lyman Super Moly (LSM)

30 rounds each were loaded, same dies, same lot of primers, same lot of 2400, same brass, same alloy, and same loading session. The powder measure was refilled to the same level for each set of 30 rounds. 5 charges were thrown before starting to charge the cases for each lot of ammo.

The barrel and cylinder were cleaned when changing from RR to LSM.

Groups were 5 rounds each shot over an Oehler 35P with 3 sky screens.

Same bench rest set up for both ‘Lots’ of ammo. Once the sand bags were placed on the bench they were not moved until all shooting was completed.

The chronograph was set up at the beginning and not moved until all shooting was completed.

All 30 rounds (6 groups of 5 rounds each) for both lots of ammo were shot on the same target. New target put up in as close to the same exact place as possible for the 2nd 30 rounds. RR was shot first.

All shooting was completed within 2 hours (couldn’t shoot any faster).
Each shot’s velocity was recorded and the Shot String’s Standard Deviation (SD), Extreme Spread (ES), High and Low velocity along with the Average velocity were recorded.

After the 2nd group of LSM I had problems seeing 6 o’clock and the groups starting rising in the target.

LSM had an overall higher velocity but RR had a lower ES and SD.

Both lubes leaded the last 1.5+ inches of the barrel. Upon cleaning the barrel it was noted RR had about twice the leading then LSM did. That was apparent by the amount of lead dust/specs on the cloth that was under the Ruger while cleaning it. I took pictures of both, but they are hard to see when I dropped the resolution so they are not posted below.

All Leading was removed before LSM was shot.

Rooster Red (RR)
Group 1 2 3 4 5 6 Avg
Shot 1, 1040, 1057, 1088, 1052, 1030, 1057, 1054
Shot 2, 1061, 1056, 1057, 1030, 1070, 1042, 1053
Shot 3, 1033, 1029, 1054, 1052, 1053, 1050, 1045
Shot 4, 1056, 1043, 1062, 1056, 1096, 1050, 1061
Shot 5, 1070, 1059, 1067, 1072, 1052, 1061, 1064
ES 37 30 34 42 66 19 38
SD 15 12 13 15 24 7 14
High, 1070, 1059, 1088, 1072, 1096, 1061, 1074
Low, 1033, 1029, 1054, 1030, 1030, 1042, 1036
Avg, 1052, 1048, 1065, 1052, 1060, 1052, 1055

Lyman Super Moly (LSM)
Group , 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, Avg
Shot 1, 1085, 1072, 1053, 1062, 1064, 1077, 1069
Shot 2, 1063, 1058, 1058, 1042, 1050, 1047, 1053
Shot 3, 1045, 1079, 1081, 1048, 1048, 1065, 1061
Shot 4, 1078, 1085, 1053, 1101, 1072, 1090, 1080
Shot 5, 1081, 1043, 1044, 1080, 1040, 1059, 1058
ES, 40, 42, 37, 59, 32, 43, 42
SD, 16, 16, 13, 24, 12, 16, 16
High, 1085, 1085, 1081, 1101, 1072, 1090, 1086
Low, 1045, 1043, 1044, 1042, 1040, 1047, 1044
Avg, 1070, 1067, 1057, 1066, 1054, 1067, 1064


RR, LSM
Shot 1, 1054, 1069
Shot 2, 1053, 1053
Shot 3, 1045, 1061
Shot 4, 1061, 1080
Shot 5, 1064, 1058
ES 38, 42
SD 14, 16
High, 1074, 1086
Low, 1036, 1044
Avg, 1055, 1064

[44man]

From what I can judge, it looks like the final group is better then 8" or 9". From a SBH at 30 yds, I would sure scrap the load, the lubes and maybe the boolit. If I couldn't cut that by more then half at 100 yd's I would sell the gun too. From what I see. you have not proven anything about the lubes. How about an accurate measurement of the target size and group sizes. I am guessing the rings are 1" apart. But the holes look almost as wide as the ring distance so they might be 1/2", hard to tell with the type target that shows the hits.

[pdgraham]

Looks like Lyman Super Moly may be the way to go.. both in accuracy and velocity... at least instead of Read Rooster... maybe by a nose...

I guess the groups are ok for iron sights on a 44.. At 30 yards..

Was one more smokey than the other? I was using Lyman Super Moly today and I thought it was kind of "smokey"...

In looking at Group 5, RR.. Does one of the holes look like a "tumbler"? 4th group RR also.. Is there a tumbler in there.. or have I been smoking too much Moly?

Next.. How About Lyman Super Moly against Jake's Moly Ceresin..??.. Room temp Moly against High Temp Moly..

[MGySgt]

From what I can judge, it looks like the final group is better then 8" or 9". From a SBH at 30 yds, I would sure scrap the load, the lubes and maybe the boolit. If I couldn't cut that by more then half at 100 yd's I would sell the gun too. From what I see. you have not proven anything about the lubes. How about an accurate measurement of the target size and group sizes. I am guessing the rings are 1" apart. But the holes look almost as wide as the ring distance so they might be 1/2", hard to tell with the type target that shows the hits.

Looks like you use a scope, this is iron sights on a 4 5/8's in barrel with old eyes.

The Lyman Super Moly over all group is 4.5 in for 30 rounds. I started loosing 6 o'clock after the 2nd group. Did I fluff some shots with both? Probably!

That load is normally sub 3 in. for 25 shots.

Rooster Red - I did not have a problem holding on 6 o'clock.

The test was consistantcy of the Lube - Rooster Red states lead free - not so in this gun.

Does the load need more work? Probably.

Drew

[MGySgt]

Looks like Lyman Super Moly may be the way to go.. both in accuracy and velocity... at least instead of Read Rooster... maybe by a nose...

I guess the groups are ok for iron sights on a 44.. At 30 yards..

Was one more smokey than the other? I was using Lyman Super Moly today and I thought it was kind of "smokey"...

In looking at Group 5, RR.. Does one of the holes look like a "tumbler"? 4th group RR also.. Is there a tumbler in there.. or have I been smoking too much Moly?

Next.. How About Lyman Super Moly against Jake's Moly Ceresin..??.. Room temp Moly against High Temp Moly..

Accuracy - Super Moly beats it. At least in this gun.

Super Moly is smokey and dirty compared to Rooster Red, but the Super Moly cleans off real easy, the Rooster Red is a little tacky.

I just looked at the target again - I don't think there are any that tumbled. All holes look round.

My Testing of lubes is done for awhile.

Drew

[44man]

OK, 4.5" is a whole lot better. I can understand about eyes, I am 68 and can't see them either anymore. When I could, my SBH could hit pop cans at 100 yd's every shot with open sights, from the Creedmore position. (No sandbags.) Knowing what the gun can do makes me question large close range groups.
I use nothing but Felix lube and I get zero leading. Of course the gun has maybe 50,000 heavy jacketed bullet rounds through it from when I shot IHMSA. I have somewhere around 7,000 cast through it too. This gun will still hold way under an inch at 50 yd's with an XTP and close to an inch with cast. I have to use a red dot now because I hunt with my revolvers. The dot covers a lot of target and at times it is harder to shoot groups with it. I actually shot smaller groups with open sights. That dot at 100 yd's takes a very large target to aim at.
I use nothing but 296 in my Rugers and BFR's for heavy loads. I never got 2400 to group and it is filthy powder. Shoot the stuff from the side of your leg and the whole gun and your hand will be black. I think the fouling promotes leading too. Your lube might be working but does it continue to work once the bore is full of crud?
Here are two five groups shot with my BFR .475 at 50 and 100 yd's, the 50 yd group is 5/8", shot with a red dot that covers the whole center of the target.

[44man]

Those groups were shot with a 411 gr WFN boolit from a double cavity, home made mould, 26 gr's of 296 and Felix lube.