38-55 case length question

[TXBRILL]

Does anyone when approximatley the ammo makers started usuns the shorter length brass in 38-55

Thanks

[KCSO]

The first short brass I saw was with the Winnchester Crazy Horse rifle when it came out.

[oneokie]

Not even SAAMI knows when the length was shortened.

[montana_charlie]

Not even SAAMI knows when the length was shortened.
I think there were no 38-55 SAAMI specs at the time when Winchester started making 38-55 ammunition by using the same blank cases used for 30-30. That created the shorter 38-55 case...which was in common use when SAMMI got into the act and created specs for the cartridge.

I don't know when any of those events occurred...

CM

[Pepe Ray]

Well-- I didn't take notes. Didn't know there was gonna be a quiz.
But, being a fan of the great old round for about 50 yrs. I'll try to relate my casual observations.

By the '50's (1950's), The round was 'antique' , contemptible to some. No firearms were chambered or sold and new factory loads were very difficult to find. Those that were made, I have some Remington MT's that were purchased new from Herters in 1962, were still "long". My life got extremely busy about then. The 45th Ed. of the Lyman reloading handbook pub. in 1970, had relegated the 38-55 to a special section in the back for "Obsolete and semi-obsolete cartridges."
About that time, I could find no new brass nor bullets (condoms). I couldn't afford a mold so hoarded/rationed my meager supply of brass and condoms.
By 1975 I was employed by a sporting goods distributor. Still couldn't get supplies. Soon (Late '70's? remember I wasn't taking notes.) Winchester made a commemorative rifle in 38-55 and produced some nickle plated cartridges to go with. That ammo "Legendary Frontiersman" was SHORT. As soon as the boss brought in some brass MT's I bought some, even tho it too was SHORT.
That would have been in 1975 0r 76. During the in between years the cartridge had been removed from the catalogs and old Bob Pomeroy was making a living converting 30-30 cases (stretched) to 38-55's Nice job too.
If you need more precise data , call Winchester.
Pepe Ray

[TXBRILL]

So it would be safe to say that any older ammo except Winchester would be the longer length

[Pepe Ray]

Why are you "excepting Winchester"?
Remington and Winchester both dissapeared about the same time. At this time Starline is the only one making "long" cases.
How am I confusing you?
Pepe Ray

[oneokie]

So it would be safe to say that any older ammo except Winchester would be the longer length

No.

I have some brass from a box of Winchester ammo purchased in 1964-1966 that is headstamped WRA 38-55. After trimming the fired cases to a uniform length they measure 2.122". Which is the suggested trim to length in the Lyman 45th manual as stated by Pepe Ray.

[Pepe Ray]

I'm sorry TXBRILL.
I keep returning here in hopes that someone can read your thoughts or interpret what your asking.
Oneokie may be correct, or not. I fail to see how your words arrive at a clear meaning.
I apologize for confusing you. Maybe we can try again?
Pepe Ray

[oneokie]

I'm sorry TXBRILL.
I keep returning here in hopes that someone can read your thoughts or interpret what your asking.
Oneokie may be correct, or not. I fail to see how your words arrive at a clear meaning.
I apologize for confusing you. Maybe we can try again?
Pepe Ray


Or not?

You state in post #5 that you have been a fan for 50 years???? You never measured cases or checked the headstamps on the ones you may have measured?

[Pepe Ray]

Mr. oneokie;
Please reread TXBRILL's post and then your response.
Pepe Ray

[TXBRILL]

I guess the reason for the confusing post is my confusing thought process I sometimes see cheap old loaded ammo on some auction sites, I recently got a 1904 Winchester '94 in 38-55. I have no brass yet, dies or bullets. So I have to start getting some brass the odds of finding some range pick up is slim.

I can go out and buy 50 or 100 long Starline brass, dies and boolits which eventually I will do. Now it seems to me if I can buy old 38-55 loaded ammo for a buck or so a round in the long length I get the pleasure of shooting now as opposed to saving up for dies boolits and brass. I save the brass which is worth about 50 cents I get to shoot the gun and end up with the correct brass.

This is not a good deal if I start out with the new shorter brass because I end up with brass I don't want thats why I am curious about the brass length date. When you see the boxes in the auctions Its generall pretty easy to tell if they are older than 35 years old hence I assume they are the longer ones

[oneokie]

Pepe Ray, reread both posts. Point taken.

[oneokie]

Curiousity got the best of me and I called Olin. The box of Winchester brass that I have was made in 1963, according to the person I talked to.

When asked about the time frame of when the length was shortened, they stated that "Cartridges of the World" may or may not have information about when the change in length took place.

[TXBRILL]

Thanks for the info...I did score a box of cascade 38-55 for 20.00 yesterday