Bator .223 Pics, anyone?...

[Just Call Me...G]

Howdy All!

So I have been casting now for about 4 months and all is really going well.

I have casted for my .30 cal guns the Lee C312-155-2R & the Lyman 311041 (I know it was designed for a .30-30, but what a great boolit for .308 & .30-06!).

I have casted the Lee 401-175-TC for my .40 S&W/10mm pistols.
I have casted the Lee TL452-230-TC & Lyman 452374 for my .45s.
I have a Lee 356-120-TC on order so that I can start throwing lead for my 9mms.

Just recently I have been reading quite a great deal on here and castpics.com regarding casting for .22 CF, specifically (for me) feeding my ARs, Encore. 223 & a Remington bolt gun.

I have read quite a great deal on the Lee "Bator" bullet and today I put a mould on backorder through MidSouth. I realize that it will take some time and I am good with that. I intend to purchase the RCBS 22-055-SP mould as well (Midway has them in stock).

My question is...does anyone have an actual pic of the Lee Bator bullet? Preferably a pic of the cast boolit and a pic of an actual .223 round loaded with same.

I am just curious as to what it would look like. If you have any experiences or advice I'd appreciate that too :-)

I will be plinking, paper-punching and maybe doing some vermin extermination with these once I dial all the factors in. I'll be using 80/20 mix with a heaping tablespoon of magnum shot & water quenching. Looking for ~2500 fps out of a 55gr. GC boolit and good accuracy, probably using primarily H4895 (my go-to powder for .223/5.56).

Any info, pics, etc. you guys could provide would be greatly appreciated.


Seeya,


Giovanni

[felix]

You'd be better off using a powder which will deliver a consistent 35K-40K cup, lit by a pistol primer, to make 2400-2500 fps with the Bator, which weighs about 51-53 dressed. ... felix

[Just Call Me...G]

Hi felix,

which powder would you recommend?

thanks,

G

[JIMinPHX]

The man asked for a picture. This one should be fairly useful. I find that if I seat the Bator down far enough to cover both lube grooves, I get lousy accuracy. If I seat it out just far enough to cover the second groove & leave the first one exposed, then the nose just touches my lands in my barrel & accuracy is much better. The recovered boolits were going about 2400fps & shot into crumb rubber. This is pretty close to the same expansion that I see from hitting something like a coyote. As you can see, the Bator makes a nice big clean hole in paper.

[sundog]

Felix, may have a few other ideas, but powder in the 2400 to 4198 range should work. Just have to find which one works best in your gun. A chrono will sure help, if for nothing else than watching SD. Speed is speed, and the gun and load will determine what it likes best for each change in powder and charge. If I remember correctly from last year when Felix and I were playing around with this N120 did a pretty good job. I finally threw in the towel on the .223, from we figured, maybe it just needed a whole lot more jacketed through it first to really smooth things out -- still working on that and putting a lot of jacketed rounds down range (very accurately). I mention this so that if you do not get good results from the git go, don't be hasty in blaming the boolit.

[Charlie Sometimes]

Every time I search Mid-South's site for the 22 Bator, I don't get anything. How are you finding it?
I would like to try it in my 22 Hornet, and the RCBS 22-55-SP, also. I currently have the Lyman 225415. Has anyone noticed an improvement using the Bator over the Lyman? I have read the posts/articles on tests conducted between other Hornet bulets, but the Bator was not included, IIRC.

[garandsrus]

Charlie,

Here is the link at MidSouth. (http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0000622BATOR)...

John

[OLPDon]

Just:
Welcome to the World of Casting. Them little pills are IMOHO are the holy grail of casting and when it comes to shooting there sure is much to take instride. It's a marithon one works for to get some sort of medal. Now that you want to start casting those little demons jump over to the Group Buy we all have been working on a nice 224 for all. Its been in the making oh about or close to 3 yrs (3 yrs not a typo).
Felix has some of the of the best advise on the little pill, and when it comes to lubes. Well just look at the sticky above. He almost always has the last word to a question asked on the forum. There is a adendment to the above statment, he's not always the first to answer which by intent or not works out well it gives me with limited knowledge a chance to think out the problem and increase my ability to adapt to a stumbling block.

So anyway welcome to CB and Felix I hope I didn't blow too much smoke in your direction.
Don

[mainiac]

Ive only shot the bator in to .22,s so far... a stevens 22 hornet,and a rem700 in .222. In both guns the bator boolit has to be seated very deep. With the boolit jammed in the lands,all lube grooves are inside the neck. Jury is still out on if the bator can out shoot the 225438,but seems to shoot better than the 225415,in either gun.

[ChuckS1]

This is an interesting thread, mainly because I just tried my first cast loads in my CZ 527 with its 1:12 twist barrel. I'm using the RCBS 22-55-SP with Unique. Seems from what I've read that maybe a slower powder and pistol primers are called for. Any thoughts?

[Chunky Monkey]

Every time I search Mid-South's site for the 22 Bator, I don't get anything. How are you finding it?
I would like to try it in my 22 Hornet, and the RCBS 22-55-SP, also. I currently have the Lyman 225415. Has anyone noticed an improvement using the Bator over the Lyman? I have read the posts/articles on tests conducted between other Hornet bulets, but the Bator was not included, IIRC.

Charlie how do you like the 225415? What are you shooting it out of?

[compass will]

Once it gets warm again I will get back to my 22-250 with the bator. I was not having any luck but it turned out to be a bad scope. I also bought a 308 around the same time and started casting for that (with great luck). But then it got cold :(

I got a batch of them waiting to size and press gas checks on, but I kept bending them. So I set them aside to harden some (at the time they were less then 24 hours old). Then I bought the 30-30 molds and been playing with that gun. to many guns, not enough time.

[Chunky Monkey]

Once it gets warm again I will get back to my 22-250 with the bator. I was not having any luck but it turned out to be a bad scope. I also bought a 308 around the same time and started casting for that (with great luck). But then it got cold :(

I got a batch of them waiting to size and press gas checks on, but I kept bending them. So I set them aside to harden some (at the time they were less then 24 hours old). Then I bought the 30-30 molds and been playing with that gun. to many guns, not enough time.

Same here in south central PA compass! I've gotten out to shoot a little but not very nice to get out with the spotting scope and take your time shooting some groups. Hopefully, it'll start warming up soon, March is almost here.

[Charlie Sometimes]

I'm using a Ruger 77/22 Hornet- I think the twist rate is 1:12 in it, IIRC. Old 22 Hornets were 1:14, I think.

I usually use the Hornady V-Max in it- both 40 gr. and 55 gr. (haven't shot it much over 100 yd. to know which is the better yet- everything has been that close), but want to try cast boolits, too. I've made some 225415's but haven't got GC's to put on them yet, or the sizer kit. Gonna use the Lee sizers, that way I can heat treat if I want before lubing. Will pan lube after seating the GC through the sizer- I like doing it that way better. I'm going to make my own GC's too. The price of them things are outrageous now. I should have done that years ago.

I've also got a hollow pointing idea I want to try out too. If it works out, I'll post pictures under Special Projects. [smilie=1:

I use the rifle for varmints and predators out to 200 yds or so. I also use Lil'Gun powder, and have been using CCI 400 small rifle primers. I am going to try the small pistol primers after reading the post articles about that. I am accuracy and performance nuts. It must shoot consistantly accurate or it ain't worth a hoot to me. 8-)

The weather hasn't been very cooperative this year, but like you said March is coming! The daffodils are up 2 inches in the back yard already, so that is a good indication spring isn't far away. I've got 4 inches of snow in the yard in the last day, so that must go away for the year before I can set up the shooting bench in the back yard. The front porch is covered, but it makes too much noise in the house shooting from there! I could go over to the neighbors 200 range, but his isn't covered either. :lol:

Checked the Mid-South link- Thanks! I finally see what the hulabaloo is about. Not a bad price for a custom mold either. They are showing April delivery time. If I can find some Bators to try before then, I may get one. Probably should anyway the way everything else is going! :o

I have been wondering just how much similarity there is between the Bator and the 225438, and between the 225415 and the 22-55-SP. They seem so close to each other with similar profiles, but yet apparent differences exist. I've got to see for myself. :wink:

I've got a lot of smelting, casting, reloading, and a few odd projects to do this year, so the year should just fly by for me! Next hunting season will be here before we know it, and I am looking forward to it already! :grin:

[Just Call Me...G]

Howdy Again,

Just wanted to thank all of you guys for your input.
Especially wanted to thank "JIMinPHX" for the great pic!

I can certainly imagine what a great challenge it will be working with this little itty-bitty pill and THEN trying to make it functional/accurate...but it sure sounds like fun! :-)

One other question...are any of you fellas shooting the Bator out of any AR-15 type platform?

I have an ArmaLite 20" flat-top/scoped, set up for coyote shooting, a Colt carbine & a BushMaster carbine...all are 1-in-9" twist, all are DI...just wondering.

Once again, gents, MANY thanks...great site. great info and greatest bunch of members on the web.


Kind Regards,

Giovanni

[Chunky Monkey]

Howdy Again,

Just wanted to thank all of you guys for your input.
Especially wanted to thank "JIMinPHX" for the great pic!

I can certainly imagine what a great challenge it will be working with this little itty-bitty pill and THEN trying to make it functional/accurate...but it sure sounds like fun! :-)

One other question...are any of you fellas shooting the Bator out of any AR-15 type platform?

I have an ArmaLite 20" flat-top/scoped, set up for coyote shooting, a Colt carbine & a BushMaster carbine...all are 1-in-9" twist, all are DI...just wondering.

Once again, gents, MANY thanks...great site. great info and greatest bunch of members on the web.


Kind Regards,

Giovanni

Giovanni, I'm not shooting the Bator but have been shooting the 22-55-SP out of my Colt AR. It has a 20" HBAR with 1/9 twist. Haven't had any leading and once it get warm I hope to get out and work up the most accurate load.

[Just Call Me...G]

Thanks Chunky...actually your post at the beginning of the year, the one with the pics, was among the influences that got me started thinking about loading boolits for my ARs...

Some really great info both here and at castpics.net
Reloading the .22 CF boolits is in the development/research stage right now...probably will purchase the Lyman 225646 within the month, since I already have a few Lyman handles.
Plus I have a Bator mould on backorder with MidSouth...should be available sometime in the summer per them.

The RCBS boolit does intrigue me, though.

For now, I am busy casting as many .30 cal, .45, .40/10mm & 9mm boolits as I can while the weather is chilly.


Seeya,


G

[JIMinPHX]

This picture shows a little more of what you can expect from terminal performance. The ones that I posted in the first picture above were roughly 12BNH @ 2400fps. The ones below are labeled.

[NHlever]

This is an interesting thread, mainly because I just tried my first cast loads in my CZ 527 with its 1:12 twist barrel. I'm using the RCBS 22-55-SP with Unique. Seems from what I've read that maybe a slower powder and pistol primers are called for. Any thoughts?

I shot my best group so far yesterday with my CZ 527 .223 using the Lyman 22596 which weighs 50 grains, and is a shape similar to the RCBS that you have. The best group was with 9.5 grains of 2400. Lyman lists that powder up to 15+ grains in the .222 with a 55 grain boolit so I'm going to load some more working upwards from 9.5, and shoot some more of the 9.5 load to see how consistant it is. My group was just under 3/4" at 50 yards for 5 shots.