Star sizer trouble

[1z-bar]

I picked up an older star luber. It already had a .452 die in it and the top punch was made for a semi wad cutter, but I'm feeding them nose down. The die was a 2 grove so I plugged the top set of holes with shot. I also cleaned out all the old lube, put a base heater on it and put in hard lube. I'm sizing Lyman cast {452374} 225 GR RN Quenched in water.
My trouble is I'm deforming the noses when they hit the base of the other bullet to push it through. It's even leaving an indent in the base of the bullet where the nose hits it. It is sizing hard some times, but I'm only taking off .001 if that. I also adjusted the top punch down as far as I could and still put lube in the grove. I tryed to lube the boolits before, but with no results. [smilie=b:
Please help!!!

[scb]

I spray mine with a spray case lube before sizing if they are difficult to run thru

[AzShooter]

You must have cast up some very soft boolets for the nose to be deformed from the previous bullet. I'd add some tin or wheel weights to my mix.

Another thought is that your lube isn't heated up enough and you are exerting more pressure then needed to push the bullets through. Try waiting longer after you turn on your heater before you strt putting boolets through.

Just my .02 cents.

Hard some times? Are you using a solid lube or does it have a hole in the middle for Lyman sizers. The pressure difference from the air pocket could be causing the problem.

[1z-bar]

I tryed lubing the bullets {spray} with no change either way. I had also checked my hardness, it tested as quenched WW {brinell 23}. On the star if the heat isn't high enough the lube won't flow. I have tryed sizing them cold and hot and other than the lube oozing out a little when I left presure on it heating up :roll: I still had dented tips.
Could it be a bad die??

[Dennis Eugene]

have you measured a sized boolit?

[1z-bar]

It's less than .001, but it's not easy it takes some effort to size. Some are easer than others. I checked size before it doesn't very any.

[EDK]

What is the difference between "as cast" and what you're trying to size them to?

You probably know that with the STAR, you want to run a lubed boolit through it every so often to lube the sizer die. You might also need to adjust the pump or the depth that your punch pushes the boolit in the die. I prefer to use soft lube in mine...walk in, turn in the lube handle, and "fire that mother up!" The heater is a PITA to fine tune and with 1000 FPS (or lower) pistol loads, I don't need hard lubes.

There's been a bunch of threads on the STAR lately...I've had one almost 20 years and learn something new about its quirks constantly. If you like to tinker, the STAR is definitely for you.

:cbpour::redneck::Fire:

[testhop]

be careful and dont use too much pressure i broke one of mine by useing too hard lube

[KYCaster]

23 BHN is a pretty hard boolit and not very easy to size even .001...but you've already discovered that, haven't you.

Like EDK said, running a sized/lubed boolit back through will help. Sometimes every other one is necessary. In extreme cases I have used a smaller dia. wadcutter to push the boolit out before sizing the next one.

Getting lube on it sooner sometimes helps a little. Try plugging the bottom row of holes and lubing with the top row.

I have to ask why you want such a hard alloy for that boolit. If you're using it in 45acp, your gun and sizer might be much happier with a softer alloy. Lots of guys (me included) find that 9 to 12 BHN works great.

Jerry

[1z-bar]

Its less than .001 from cast to sized. I have the boolit pushed down as far as I can and still get lube in the grove. I've tryed running a lubed bullet through but it doesn't seem to help. I went to hard lube to eliminate sticky boolits, and .357 . It seems like I exert a lot of pressure for no more than .001 . Even with a cold die the pressure seems a little less than a warm one, but i still dent the tips ruining it through cold. I think I'm going to try to polish the die for lack of anything better to do.[smilie=b:

[1z-bar]

I will try to run some softer ones to see if that helps, I was just water quenching my wheel weights and thats what I got.

[BD]

Sounds to me like you may have a leaded die. I slightly leaded one of mine trying a "no lube" experiment in .45 acp, and it really increased the amount of "omph" required on the handle. If it were me I'd pull it and give it a real good cleaning. The ID should be mirror bright. When sizing WW boolits I general start with a lubed one and re-run a lubed one about every 25 or so. When sizing lino rifle boolits I'll re-run a lubed one about every 5 or so. The diameter and hardness of the star handle was designed to be a protective indicator. If you're bending the handle as you size, something is wrong and needs to be addressed.

When I'm sizing pointy rifle boolits I use a short bit of dowel rod to push each one out so the nose of the next is not deformed. The rod wants to be long enough that the handle never activates the lube pump when you're using the dowel. I've found it hard to keep the very hard lubes off the noses of long boolits. Once you've heated something like LBT blue up enough to get it to pump consistently, it's hard to keep it from dribbling through in between cycles of the pump.

BD

[HeavyMetal]

What is your source of WW metal? BY that I mean did you buy locally and actually melt them yourself or did you buy ingots that you were told was WW metal?

WW usually comes out between BHN11 and BHN14, if your getting BHN23 you got way more than WW metal! And at BHN23 they should not be deforming at all!

So somethings to check: The diameter of the punch to start with! Have on occasion seen to large a punch rub on the side of the die. This add stress to sizing operation.

From what I can gather from previous posts you boolits are dropping at .453 diameter and your sizing down to .452. Even with very hard alloy this should not create a lot of drag or require the amount of force to deform boolits.

Also what hardness tester are you using? Could it be out of calibration?

Bear with us and our questions, trying to diagnose a problem long distance is very difficult!

[EDK]

Check the diameter of your top punch and if it is bent--warped--junk on threads--whatever. Re-install it with the lock nut loose and adjust depth of boolit in sizing die before re-tightening the lock nut...they can tilt just a little.

I've got access to a lathe, etc. at work so I'd polish the top punch a bit to reduce the diameter. AND they have some nifty little ball hones to polish the inside of the sizer die and remove any lead stuck on the sides...I honed my .452 out to .453 for my S&W 625s and removed some minor lead from the die...it doesn't take much to throw you a curve.

Another quirk was that I got a tiny scratch on all my 45 ACP boolits while sizing. Took it out of the machine, looked it over closely and could find the cause. I did this several times...honed it a bit more....still had the problem. Finally got a small punch and pushed it through the open lube holes....had a tiny sliver of lead that would be pushed out by lube pressure and scratch the boolit.

Not to offend, but check your boolit diameter on several before you size them and note the diameter of the "tough ones." At a BH of 23, they would be a couple thousandths larger than the "normal" 12 to 15 range I use. I got a bunch of linotype (monotype?) that was way past my SAECO tester and cast oversize and didn't size worth a d---. At the time I didn't know what it was and traded it for twice their weight in wheel weights. (I need to look and see if I have any of them left and see if I can get a reading. They were harder than woodpecker lips!)

If you have a quantity of this alloy, you can "sweeten" a lot of softer stuff with it...and improve the castability of it in the process.

Keep trying and let us know what you find...Inquiring minds want to know!

:cbpour::redneck::Fire:

[1z-bar]

Thanks to every one.:-D I cleaned it and polished it {I don't think I did any thing to it though}. I ran a dozen lubbed boolits through it and it helped. I figured out most of my problem. :oops:I had been putting a little teflon lubricant on some of the boolits and die. Instead of making it easer, it made it a LOT harder... In response to the lead I'm using wheel weights with a 1/2 stick of 40/60 thrown in for good measure. I am also quenching them. I tested them with a cabine tree tester.