brittle hunting bullets

[milkman]

I am starting to get serious about hunting with cast this year. Can anyone tell me at what point, preferably with a BHN number, boolits start to get too brittle to hold together reliably on game. I will be using .30 and .35 cal guns with Ranch Dog boolits.
My only components are Wheelweights, tin and pure lead and a Lee hardness tester, so fancy alloys are out, but I do heat treat. I just hate to experiment on animals when so much knowledge is availible here.

milkman

[Boerrancher]

If your guns will shot them with out leading up, go for a 50/50 pure and ww blend. I have with my home made gas checks gotten this alloy up to 2500 fps in my 30-06. I don't punch paper much except to work up accurate fur punching loads. The other evening I shot a 'yote at about 75 yds with my 30-30 using a Lee C309-150-RF, made out of the 50/50 alloy, the boolit was sized to 309 dia the 16 thous thick gas check to 311 dia and I was shooting 30 gr of IMR 3031 with a Win LR Primer. I shot him in the middle of the ribs behind the left front shoulder. The entrance hole was about a 35 to 40 cal hole. The exit hole was in his right front shoulder, and I think I could have shoved a 12oz beer can in the exit hole. Needless to say he didn't run. Hope this helps some.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[milkman]

boerrancher
thanks for the info and I will give the 50-50 a try and see how it shoots.
Milkman

[Larry Gibson]

BHN doesn't tell the whole story. In smaller varmints you might want a brittle bullet that will shatter/explode as a jacketed varmint bullet does. On larger varmints and game an expanding bullet is more desireable as in Boerrancher's example. For that you want an alloy that is maleable. Some alloys (high in antimony and none or low in tin) can be hardened for higher velocity yet retain the maleable charactoristic. For instance; If we load a linotype cast bullet of 20+ BHN to 2300+ fps and shoot an animal most often the bullet, if it hits bone or something solid, will shatter. Conversly a bullet cast of magnum shot and WQ'd will have a BHN of 20+. It can be fired upwards of 2300+ fps with very good accuracy and it will expand instead of shatter. At higher velocities the greater the disparity between the two.

Larry Gibson

[leftiye]

BHN doesn't tell the whole story. the antimony/tin percentages are more the issue. Monotype at its high percentages is probly quite brittle, and linotype - some say it will fragment, and others say it isn't brittle. This is all to avoid the issue of velocity. Anything shot hard enough into a hard enough surface (or even shot fast enough into flesh or water)will shatter. Tin and copper increase the toughness of lead, and 50/50 lead/wheelweights is used and expands well at about 2000 fps. Mythbusters shot many rifle bullets into a swimming pool in several of their episodes, and everything, even the 50 cal shattered, and this was jacketed.

[milkman]

Sorry for not replying quicker, Work interferred with what is really important. Thanks for more great info.
Milkman

[missionary5155]

Good morning
My basic plan is to keep the boolit as soft as possible for the fps my firearm must have to get the boolit down the bore and accurately to the target. I lean to HEAVY / Soft . So far I have no regrets. Have not lost any critter to boolit failure, underpenetration, or shattering.
The only exception I might make is shooting Round Ball out of 12 gauge. If I am hunting something that will bite back I would go straight WW... but then at 1550+fps and under 50 yards WW (NOT water dropped) tends to bulge some.

[Lloyd Smale]

start with 5050 ww/pure water dropped and see if it leads. If it does try 25/75 pure/ww. Ive had some problem with water dropped straight ww fractureing. But never if ive added some pure to the mix.

[1Shirt]

I agree with Larry Gibson, but with the price of mag shot right now-eh. Then there is also Paco Kelly's method of nose softening that works for me. And of course there is the 2 part cast with pure lead nose and hard base, but they are a lot of work. Then again, there is no need for great quantities if used just for hunting. Good luck!
1Shirt!:coffee: