Rcbs 45-405-fn

[Dom]

I have a Marlin XLR 45-70 with the Ballard Deep Grove rifling . Bought it new around 1999 or 2000. Over the years I have had good success using the Saeco 350gr RFN GC ( BHN 11, .459 dia ) bullet. A few months ago I decide I would prefer a 400gr cast bullet. I started out with a used Lee 458 400gr FN PB. I got erratic ( BHN 15, LBT tester, .4583dia ) accuracy ( 1400 fps ) . Some times two bullets close together then one 4" to 5" out. Then shoot my 350gr Saceo & get three shots in 2". Go back to the 400gr PB & scattered 4" to 5" groups. Some times worse. Now I have acquired a used, like new, RCBS 45-405-FN GC mold. It came with a few cast unlubed bullets which I have seated GC's & lubed ( sized .459274271274271 ) . Just been to cold to shoot , but will the first decent day. My powder of choice has been IMR or H 4198. I'm want to shoot at about 1500 fps, no more than that. Since I have over 2000lbs of old WW's that run about BHN 11 that will be my alloy of choice. Was wondering if any of you have used this RCBS mold & your success with it ? I'm 76 & have been casting since I was 19. Not an expert, for sure willing to learn.

[charlie b]

Welcome to the mad house :)

Looks like you might be on the right track and am interested in the results.

Your poor luck with the Lee is interesting. Wonder if it is the difference between PB and GC or if it is a bullet size problem. Lee molds tend to produce bullets a bit smaller than most. Lee had the opinion that you should not need to size his bullets. That creates a problem with a gun that has grooves a bit larger than standard.

Have you tried shooting the Lee's with a wad under the bullet? I used to use poly wads with PB bullets for my .357. They allowed higher velocities without the need for GC's.

[lotech]

I had that RCBS mould years ago and it worked well, but I found the Lyman #457193 plain base worked just as well and eventually sold or traded off the RCBS. I used several powders with the RCBS bullet, but a particularly good one was IMR4198 as you mentioned. 31 grs. = 1260 in a Marlin .45-70, 33 grs. = 1350. Anything heavier kicked too much for me. I used ww alloy bullets sized to .459".

[Don Purcell]

Have used the RCBS 45-405 and it did well out of my Marlin and Ruger #1 .458 Winchester Magnum. I pretty well used 3031 at 48 grains which may be more than you want but have also used 38 grains for an easier load. In the .458 I was able to seat it with a couple of grease grooves out of the case and used 75 grains of 3031 or Hodgens BL-C2 for a stiff load. Got good results in both cartridges. The 38 grains of 3031 puts you right at a factory 45-70 load.

[Dom]

I use a .459 sizer. The Lee PB comes out at .458.3. The RCBS 405 GC.drops from the mold at .460 so when run thru my .459 sizer comes out great. The same as with my Saeco 350 gr GC. I have placed wads under the base of the Lee bullet ( BHN 11 ) but made no difference. I have to assume it just doesn't fit snug enough. Another thought is that I have a Lyman PB 330gr HP. It sizes nicely in my 459 sizer & shoots accurately ( straight WW BHN 11 ) It looks like my rifle likes the 459 dia. It's a bit cold & snowy here right now, but when we get a little warmer day( above 32 ) I'll set up my target & give the RCBS 405's a good go. Will let you know how they fly. Thanks all.

[W.R.Buchanan]

RCBS makes three moulds in this series. 45-300, 45-405 and 45-500. All three boolits have exactly the same shape from the crimp groove forward. So the loaded OAL is the same on all three.
The larger boolits just have more driving bands, and were designed that way specifically for Marlin and Winchester Leverguns.

I use the .45-300 FNGC in my Marlin 1895 CB 26" with 33 gr of 5744. My boolits size at .460 cast from WW's and weigh right at 325 gr. If I needed a heavier boolit it would be the .45-405 mould.

Randy

[Hamish]

Very accurate bullet, all i could ask for, but i’m planning on playing with collar buttons this year.

[Dom]

I'm going with the 405 gr bullet for elk. Just want that extra weight/momentum for penetration. I also have the RCBS 300gr GC bullet mold. Cast from my WW it to comes out at 325gr. Sized .459 it shoots quite well from my Marlin. Expecting good results from my new to me 405gr.

[Winger Ed.]

I use a 2002 issue RCBS 405 with a GC with wheel weights, and a bump of p5/5 solder in my Marlin CB.
I like it, and it does well with IMR 4198 and 3031.
I run the temp up until the boolits frost, then back it off a little, and water drop.
The smokeless ones I lube with Lyman's orange magic, the BP ones have a different Lyman lube just lube for them.

I load them from Lyman's trapdoor data, and its not as punishing to shoot compared to getting it on up with the more modern rifle data.

Something that is pleasant to shoot, and a bit of a novelty is load them up with FF holy black.
The recoil is more of a push rather than the sharp hammer blow that smokeless gives.

[Stephen Cohen]

I have all the RCBS moulds that Randy mentioned and they all shoot well in the 45/70 and my 458 WM. I do prefer the 300gr as it shoots sub MOA in my 458 but the 405 is no slouch I assure you. Regards Stephen

[Maineboy]

My 45-70 is a Marlin 1895 that I've had for over 20 years. I've had the RCBS 405 mold for a lesser time but have shot a lot of them through my rifle and find it is as accurate as anything else I've put through the Marlin. I attach gas checks in a Lee .459 push through sizer and usually pan lube them with Felix lube. The only game I've shot with that bullet was a moose and it was loaded with my hunting load at about 1600 fps. It was perfect for that animal and I suppose it will work very well on Elk as well. My mold drops them weighing about 425 grains from old wheel weights and I've heard that is normal for this mold and should be taken into account when working up loads. I have the Lee 405 FP that I have shot extensively at velocities ranging from mild to wild. I find it just as accurate as the big RCBS but it does lead the barrel a bit when I load it above 1500 fps. and that is why I went to the gas checked RCBS boolit.

[wallacem]

Just to throw my two cents in here, my 45/70's prefer .460 sized cast 405 gr. Wallacem in Ga

[Dom]

Got a chance to shoot these RCBS 405's ( sized .459 pictured in my original post ) thru my Marlin XLR 45-70. 24" Bbl. I used 36 grs of IMR-4198. I didn't use my chrono today ( a bit cold outside ) but believe I should be between 1400 & 1500 fps. I would hope closer to 15 than 14. As for recoil I feel this is about all I want. My absolute max range would be 150yds. Shown is a 3 shot group at 100, 1 1/2 " high. . After a couple minor adjustments to the right I was centered. There were about 2 dozen bullets cast in this mold that came with it. My LBT tester said BHN 19. A bit hard for me but this is what I had to work until I can cast some myself. The ones I will be casting will be from scrap WW with a BHN of about 11. This rifle shoots my RCBS 300gr GC & my Saeco 350gr GC cast from WW very accurately. I'm hoping that when I cast these 405gr bullets from WW they will group well also. I suspect the 405 cast from WW will be a good 40grs heavier. Will see. Here is the first 3 shot group today.274441 Forgot to mention I was using a scope

[Stephen Cohen]

That group is good enough to head shoot a rabbit so a deer would be in the freezer. Regards Stephen

[405grain]

The RCBS 45-405-FN was the first bullet mold that I ever purchased. I got my first deer with it back in 1982 with a replica Sharps. It's accurate and deadly. I use Lyman #2 alloy and load to around 1400fps with Reloader #7.

[Bigslug]

I'm going with the 405 gr bullet for elk. Just want that extra weight/momentum for penetration. I also have the RCBS 300gr GC bullet mold. Cast from my WW it to comes out at 325gr. Sized .459 it shoots quite well from my Marlin. Expecting good results from my new to me 405gr.

Dom, my Dad is the family .45-70 nut and the RCBS 405 is pretty much our bullet for judging accuracy capability in anything that has a correct bore diameter for it. It's sub-MOA out of his early Remlin 1895, and I got to spot for his 2014 deer kill taken with that bullet. That load was cast hard and loaded hot (about 1900fps as I recall).

If your RCBS 300 and 405 grainers are both the same nose as W.R. Buchanan says in post #6, then you should be able to get similar accuracy results with both given equal sizing, lube, GC, alloy, etc...

I've gotten nine milk jugs of penetration (six feet of water) out of a non-expanding 230 grain LFN travelling at the comparatively pokey .45 ACP hardball speed of 830 fps, so I don't think you're going to have issues on elk at short range with either one. Given that you're casting wheelweights, you can either manipulate for some expansion (air cooled) or water-quench for harder, which may get you better accuracy - at least if you push them faster. The 300 grainer going a little quicker will shoot flatter for the same amount of recoil, so you might do a little head scratching along those lines.

[Dom]

I have taken mature mule deer bucks with the RCBS 300gr GC ( 325gr cast from WW ), complete penetration. . I would like to try this 45-70 on elk. Most of my shooting here is around 100yds or less. Lots of trees. I had to cut trees down to give me a 100yd range here at the house, & I'm on 160 acres. It is possible to get a 150yd shot at times. The 36grs load of IMR 4198 is about all I want from this rifle with the 405gr bullet. Recoil is alive & well. I do have the Saeco 350gr GC bullet which when cast of WW's adds about 30 grs to the over all weight. It has a very similar nose shape as the 300grRCBS. I like weight for penetration.

[FarNorth45]

Those bullets shoot awesome out of my 22" Henry.... over a big healthy load of h322 . I need to run it through the chronograph but it's probably around 1800fps , it is all that i want to handle lol . It is probably not really needed , but i live in Alaska and it doesn't feel over powered in front of a Big Coastal Brown Bear Ha!ha
Mine drops out at 424grs using wheel weight alloy .
1 inch groups with peep sights at a 100yrds is no problem with that bullet and H322.

[Dom]

Hey FarNorth. Do you know the BHN of your WW bullets? My WW"s run about 10.5 to 11 on my LBT hardness tester.

[FarNorth45]

Hey FarNorth. Do you know the BHN of your WW bullets? My WW"s run about 10.5 to 11 on my LBT hardness tester.
On my LBT i am getting 14-15 bhn for wheel weights.... water quenched i usually get around 18bhn . I also like to mix in just a tad of tin , but really not necessary ..... but it cast so beautifully lol