45-70

[flhr62]

Hi, I have a Ruger no. 1 in 45-70 on the way, and i need some help choosing a mould. The Lee 457-405f mould which I would guess is supposed to be .457 in diameter. My question is, would .457 be too small? It looks like all the moulds specifically for 45-70 are .458 to .459 Thanks, Mark.

[94Doug]

Most likely you will need 458-459 or larger.

[Scrounger]

A lot of moulds are undersized and require lapping or "Beagling" in order to get bullets large enough in diameter. An easy way out is to buy a Group Buy mold which we have custom ordered from time to time. Just post that you want one. Another easy way to go if you want to keep expenses down is to buy the Lee 405 grain hollow base mold. The gas pressure when you fire a cartridge tends to flare out the bullet base and make it fit your barrel. Many people have had good results with this mold.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

Hi and welcome to the forum. Keep asking questions. To start to answer yours; especially since you have a modern single shot rifle, the number of choices possible is huge. You can choose round noses, flat points or pointy points. Weights can also vary over a wide range from 300 to over 500 grains. I personally prefer 405 grains and use Lyman mold #457124. That weight at least for me seems to be the best all around. Opinions will vary with every shooter. All existing designs nowadays are good ones, be it for target or hunting. As for the brand of choice, Lee molds are the most reasonably priced compared to iron molds. But in choosing aluminum molds one must be aware that they have certain requirements to make their use fully sucessful. They have to be smoked, usually with a wooden match or some other means that does not produce a greasy type soot. Secondly the mold alignment pins have to be kept lubricated in order to avoid damage to the mold. They also have certain advantages that are not shared by iron molds; they are lighter and do not rust. One can never assume what diameter bullet a mold will cast as it also depends on the alloy used. For my three 45-70's I have found .457 to be ideal, cast out of wheelweights. I usually shoot them "as cast"/unsized and lubed with NRA 50/50 alox-Beeswax. Grouping is good from all three rifles at 100 yds. I generally like to load them in the 1200-1300fps range as going to higher velocity, especially if one uses heavier (500gr)weights the recoil becomes more noticeable. That part of the equation is strictly your call. A good loading manual will give you a lot more info in determining what is best for your needs and so will other members of this forum. Slugging your bore to find out what its diameter is would also be helpful; some shooters find that a458 or .459" diameter bullet gives better grouping than .457. That is for you to determine. Be prepared to experiment and with patience. Good shooting. LLS

[Bullshop]

Well Sir it will depend on the alloy hardness, the perssure applied to the boolit base and your barrel groove diameter weather 457" will be big enough. Lots of if's there. Hard undersize boolits at too low pressure will be a no no. Soft undersize boolits at adiquit pressure is no problem. You could shoot soft pure lead boolits at bore diameter, about .450" to .451" given enough pressure to obturate and do some fine shootin.
There is more than one way. There is a relationship between bore diameter, boolit diameter, alloy hardness, and pressure that will dictate weather any combination of these things will work acceptably or not. When you begin to understand how these things work together you will be well on your way to good shooting.
BIC/BS

[Frank46]

Mark, glad to hear you have a ruger #1 in 45/70 on the way. Great rifle and is a classic. Couple suggestions. When you first cast some boolits, take a couple and put them nose to base in a vise with smooth jaws. Squeeze them to fatten them up slightly. Take one boolit and insert nose first into the muzzle. Try and drive it in as far as it will go. Then insert a dowel ( 3/8" diameter from lowe's, home depot) and push out the boolit from the breech towards the muzzle. Try and make sure it landson a towel so it doesn't get dinged up. Repeat the procedure and insert boolit nose first into the chamber and push it into the bbl till the base is about even with the end of the chamber. Push out the boolit with the dowel from the muzzle into the chamber. same thing with the towel. What you just did will give you the dimensions at the muzzle and throat of your barrel. If you don't have a set of dial calipers or a micrometer have someone who does measure the boolits ( I'd suggest marking with felt tip marker muzzle and throat) Now all this may sound confusing but this is what I did on my #1 in 45/70. My ruger has what I refer to as a "carp mouth" throat. BIG. The throat at the end of the chamber measures .459". Some of the throats on the older rugers had a taper and the new ones have a throat that starts just where the chamber ends. Mine is the second type. Hope fully some other fellow shooters will chime in and give their insights for this rifle and in this caliber. regards Frank

[wmitty]

Single most important thing to do (imho) is measuring groove diameter by driving
a soft lead boolet or sinker thru the barrel. I could have saved much time and energy by doing this. I inherited two .45-70's from my Dad; an '84 Springfield and a straight grip Marlin 95. I tried shooting 457124's from the Springfield and learned the meaning of the term "keyhole". Years later I tried the Lee 340 grain in the Marlin and learned the meaning of the term " microgroove rifling needs larger diameter boolets". ( I think Marlin should stamp the barrels with .46-70).

Your Ruger may shoot great with a .457 dia boolet, but a sure fire, no chance of a screwup boolet is the Ranch Dog 350 grain. Just my .025 (inflation)

[jack19512]

My Marlin 1895 CB shoots the 405 gr. HB boolit very well.

[looseprojectile]

Just like wmitty says.
You could do worse than the Ranch Dog 350. Heck, you probably can't do better.

Life is good

[StrawHat]

Hi, I have a Ruger no. 1 in 45-70 on the way, and i need some help choosing a mould. The Lee 457-405f mould which I would guess is supposed to be .457 in diameter. My question is, would .457 be too small? It looks like all the moulds specifically for 45-70 are .458 to .459 Thanks, Mark.

Hello and Welcome to the forum,

Lee and other mold makers need a way to group the molds so they assign numbers such as 457-xxx. This does not necessarily mean the mold casts a .457" boolit. Sometimes yes, sometimes larger or smaller.

I have an NEI mold marked 450-405 that I use for my 45-70s. I don't have any boolits handy but I know they are NOT .450".

Another good mould to try is the Lee 405 HB (hollow base) mold. Many have good things to say about it.

Enjoy the Ruger #1, is it your only 45-70 or have you experieince with others?

[Wayne Smith]

For what do you plan to use it? Long range shooting? BPCR? Hunting? Paper punching? A lot of issues in bullet choice depends on where the bullet ends up.

[flhr62]

Thanks for all of the replys. I do know about slugging the barrel, I was kind of hoping for a magic answer so I could get the mould before the gun gets here. Yes it is my first 45-70, and I don't know what I got it for, have just always wanted one. Maybe after I get this one, and all of the reloading equipment, I can use that as an excuse to the wife, that I need a guide gun to go with it. Can someone tell me the purpose of the hollow base moulds? Thanks again for all of the help. Mark.

[Boerrancher]

My Sharp's Cavalry Carbine has a 460 dia bore. I cast up a bunch of 457-340-RF, then sized them down to 455, and paper patched them up to 463. I also beagled the mould and some up at 462. Both options seem to be working well for me. Paper patching is a bit slow but it is also kind of fun if you want to give it a try. Other than that, +1 to what every one else has said.

Best wishes from the Boer Ranch,

Joe

[StrawHat]

Can someone tell me the purpose of the hollow base moulds? Thanks again for all of the help. Mark.

Two reasons, the first is that the base obturates (expands) from the explosion of powder and catches the rifling better.

Second, that is how the original Springfield Aromory bullet was built.

Not sure which is correct.

Paper patching is also a good idea.