Is There an Electrician in The House?

[Hickory]

Friday I turned the light on in the bedroom it came on, dimmed and fayed to a very dim glow. I spent most of Friday and part of yesterday trying to figure this out. Not having a schematic on what breaker or other outlets connected to the bedroom light I pulled every breaker, outlet & light switch in the house and checked the screws to make sure they were tight.
This morning I went in the attic and under the house to check junction boxes for loose wires, all is good.
I just got out of the shower and am perplexed.

Anyone have an idea or suggestions?

[dangitgriff]

Could have been an alien abduction. You lose any time you can’t account for? You might not get through airport security screening if you’ve been chipped and probed. Or am I thinking that’s the TSA’s job? [emoji848][emoji51]

•••

Just kidding. You need to get an electrician over to your place and see if he can figure it out before your house burns down. See if he knows how a Megger works and tell him to check that wire run with it. Sounds like either a short in the neutral line or the power company fiddling around with their switching gear.

[PbHurler]

"Shrugging"

Maybe the internals of that particular switch have given up the ghost....

I'd swap out the switch with a new one (or one that is working correctly) Just a thought to test that theory....

[Hickory]

"Shrugging"

Maybe the internals of that particular switch have given up the ghost....

I'd swap out the switch with a new one (or one that is working correctly) Just a thought to test that theory....

I changed all switches and outlets in the affected area.

[Hickory]

New thought.
Could the breaker be bad?

[retread]

Got any rodents? Rats love to chew on wires.

[Hickory]

No mice, rats or squirrels have breached the fortifications of my home in years.

[Scrounge]

Friday I turned the light on in the bedroom it came on, dimmed and fayed to a very dim glow. I spent most of Friday and part of yesterday trying to figure this out. Not having a schematic on what breaker or other outlets connected to the bedroom light I pulled every breaker, outlet & light switch in the house and checked the screws to make sure they were tight.
This morning I went in the attic and under the house to check junction boxes for loose wires, all is good.
I just got out of the shower and am perplexed.

Anyone have an idea or suggestions?

Do you have a multimeter, DVM, or any other sort of tool for measuring voltage? Or a spare light bulb? Meter should show about 110-120VAC, and a filament lamp will light up appropriate to the voltage you have at the socket. LED bulbs use diodes to rectify the AC current to DC current. If the some but not all of the diodes in the lamp go out, you get less brightness because not all of the voltage going in the lamp makes it to the LED. A filament lamp gets hot and glows a white bright light at full voltage. They're dimmer and redder the less power they get. If you've got wire nuts connecting the lamp base to your wiring, you may want to take them off, and check the wiring in the wire nuts. Make sure the power's off to the whole house before you do that! You can scrape off any corrosion, which will likely be black. Though you may want to cut off an inch or so of the wiring and strip it back to reconnect, instead. If you still have the problem, you might want to swap a circuit breaker from another location in the panel to where your bedroom light is connected. Could be the breaker is burning up or corroded. That is more likely if your house is old.

Not actually an electrician, but I've been doing auto, aircraft, home, satellite communications, and industrial maintenance for much of the past 50 years.

[Elroy]

If it hasn't done it since then it may just be a coincidence that you had what we call a power surge about the time you turned on your lights. Every light in the house may have dimmed..Then new style light bulbs can act weird as well. I have had some ones in ceiling fan light were all were burning fine,but one is dim,and when I go to change them they often get bright as soon as I touch them,but are usually completely burnt out the next day.

[Hickory]

Everything else in the house is working fine.
The light bulb in question (and is still working elseware) is a LED type bulb. After several times of turning the switch on & off it quite working altogether.

[bangerjim]

That is the problem with CFL's and LED's the die in weird ways. I had several CFL's in the past that flickered and when I came back in the room, it was dark, except for a faint glimmer from the lamp. like a candle flame. The electronics had failed and caught the plastic housing on fire! And it was just sitting there quietly burning.

Now that I have switched most bulbs to LED's I have found they DO not last nearly as long as touted on the packages!!!!! 2y ears max is what I have seen for even high-end brand LED's. And they fail just like you described above.

Now that Trump is probably gonna bring back good old incandescent bulbs, mabe our eyesight will not get any worse.

Sounds like you solved the problem without paying an arm & leg for an electrician and his helper. Just have a bunch of spare bulbs around like I do. When one acts up, I just replace it and move on.

banger

[Idz]

If a normal old lamp doesn't work you probably have a loose connection somewhere. The loose connection arcs and burns and makes a high resistance. Your voltmeter will likely show 120 VAC because the meter draws almost no current. If you add a load to the circuit the meter voltage will drop. I repaired exactly this problem at the kids house where an electrician didn't tighten the screw on an outlet which fed another bedroom. If you do have a bad connection find it and fix it before it starts a fire!

[Hossfly]

A bad ground will drive you nuts.

[Rattlesnake Charlie]

Does the light work properly with a standard bulb?
If not, it might be the lamp socket itself.

[MaryB]

LEDS draw less current, a bad light fixture can have enough resistance to dim an LED but not an incandescent that draws 10 times the current...

[Hickory]

Does the light work properly with a standard bulb?
If not, it might be the lamp socket itself.

The 4 outlets in the south and west wall are dead. The only ones in the house that are down.

[Hickory]

Does the light work properly with a standard bulb?
If not, it might be the lamp socket itself.

My multimeter says no electricity in these outlets.
Bulb is good.

[Hickory]

LEDS draw less current, a bad light fixture can have enough resistance to dim an LED but not an incandescent that draws 10 times the current...

The lamps are situated on either side of the bed plugged into an outlet that is turned on by a light switch at the door.

[Scrounge]

My multimeter says no electricity in these outlets.
Bulb is good.

Have you physically checked the wiring to the switch, and coming out of the switch? If not, kill the power to the house. It could be the switch is bad, or one or more connections between them. Breaker is likely IF there are other outlets not on that switch that are also out.

Switch the wiring between the one for that circuit, and another like it (same rating, probably 15 or 20 amps), and see if the problem moves. If so, replace the breaker. If not, go back and look at your wiring foot by foot.

[Reverend Al]

https://i.imgur.com/fEdUxoy.jpg

[SSGOldfart]

https://i.imgur.com/fEdUxoy.jpg

Them are some small feet !!!!!!!!!!!

[Scrounge]

Reverend Al,

“Good decisions come from experience, and experience comes from bad decisions.” Rita Mae Brown

Having gained some experience in the past 5 or 6 decades, I can attest to the truth the statement above. You can, however, gain some experience by following the instructions of those who found it the hard way. Wisdom, of course, is learning from the experience of others, without having to make the mistakes yourself.

Bill

[abunaitoo]

I believe LED lights have to be wired correct.
I've never tried switching the wires around to see what it would do, but I would check on that.
If the LED works find in another outlet. it could be the switch or outlet.
I think.

[Hickory]

Well, 3 hours later, I found and fixed the problem.
The breaker was shot. After rechecking everything I could think of, the last test was the breaker. The breaker did not pass the ohm test.
A quick trip into town and back and I'm back in business.
Now, the wife is happy and so am I. [smilie=w:

[abunaitoo]

I didn't think breakers go bad.
They just sit there until something goes wrong.
Good find.

[Hickory]

I didn't think breakers go bad.
They just sit there until something goes wrong.
Good find.

I didn't think they went bad either. That's why I never considered it, it was the last thing anyone would consider or give thought to. I

[lightman]

I didn't think breakers go bad.
They just sit there until something goes wrong.
Good find.

Breakers fail. Its not real common but it happens. Its often related to something like leaving the cover open on an outside panel.

[lightman]

I did think they went bad either. That's why I never considered it, it was the last thing anyone would consider or give thought to. I

Hickory, look behind the breaker and make sure the buss bar is not burned or damaged. Also look at the back of the old breaker for any burned looking places. If you put a new breaker on a burned buss bar it will fail prematurely but it is also a fire hazard.

[Biggin]

Hickory, look behind the breaker and make sure the buss bar is not burned or damaged. Also look at the back of the old breaker for any burned looking places. If you put a new breaker on a burned buss bar it will fail prematurely but it is also a fire hazard.
I was hoping that you would chime in.

[Mr_Sheesh]

Also make sure all connections to your breakers are tight [Please, power off FIRST.] I had a circuit which, when I turned my computer room's lights on, or powered up some of the heavier computer loads, was throwing a lot of sparks - Some out of the panel, which was in that room. The breaker was pretty sick from the output (they usually have a screw holding the wire down) being loose and massively overheating, so I got a new breaker, cut the wire back a few inches, and made the place a LOT safer. I don't like electric sparks of that sort, much :p

[Hickory]

Also make sure all connections to your breakers are tight [Please, power off FIRST.

Read Op.

[Mr_Sheesh]

I did - But I figure a reminder is always good! Not everyone's an EE type :) I helped a blind home owner I know do her own electrical work once, we all know folks' experience and capabilities vary, I think of this like reminding a new shooter "Don't aim your firearm at anything you don't want to shoot.", a good habit - Not trying to offend, sorry if it came across that way. Mainly I was pretty annoyed at my breaker panel blowing sparks into my spare winter clothing stash, as some of that stuff's sorta flammable...

[Iron369]

I did - But I figure a reminder is always good! Not everyone's an EE type :) I helped a blind home owner I know do her own electrical work once, we all know folks' experience and capabilities vary, I think of this like reminding a new shooter "Don't aim your firearm at anything you don't want to shoot.", a good habit - Not trying to offend, sorry if it came across that way. Mainly I was pretty annoyed at my breaker panel blowing sparks into my spare winter clothing stash, as some of that stuff's sorta flammable...

Some of us are ME’s.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Hickory, Glad you found the problem. I've never seen a circuit breaker fail either...But that could be due to this old duplex house having fuse boxes, instead of CB panels, LOL.


Some of us are ME’s.
Some of us are ET's

[Hossfly]

I lost 3 low voltage transformers a couple weeks ago because of loose ground wire. Lucky I don’t throw any thing away, had plenty in my shop from other panels and such to steal from.

Had a small house trailer we lived in while relocating here. The lights started flickering after about a year. Got out the Fluke multi meter and determined the problem was coming from the electric meter. Got power co out to pull meter while I was at work. They left note about it was my problem.

Yep it was the neutral wire corroded and burnt looking at base of meter. Cut back and reinstalled, called and they came back and reinstalled meter, alls well now.

REA came thru here in 1938 and set poles and wires I think I still have some of those poles and original wires here on grand pas place dated back to that era. Wires very thin and look like copper with some steel included.

[gwpercle]

I didn't think breakers go bad.
They just sit there until something goes wrong.
Good find.

They go bad ... I had to replace one , the first clue is everything on the entire circuit stopped working . If all the breakers are about the same age and / or some off brand ...just replace all of them with Square D breakers . Mine were 15-20 years old and NOT Square D made . Junk from China isn't worth doodly squat .
I was going to suggest the breaker ... but Hickory beat me to the answer .
Don't replace them with junk breakers .... after replacing the bad one I started buying and replacing 4 to 6 at a time until all 24 were replaced . Watch your electrical contractor...don't let him use sub grade components ... The breaker box was a 200 amp Square D ..Good but the freaking breakers were made in China... and I didn't think to look at them .
I will admit they did last 15 years ...but still , good ones should last forever .
Gary

[jsizemore]

Do you have a clamp on/inductive ohm meter? If so check the current draw on that circuit. Could be it's drawing at the circuits limit or close to it. Older houses weren't wired for the number of modern conveniences. Folks will fill up every outlet and wonder why it doesn't work. If I pull a cover and see the white insulation on the neutral wire is tan or brown, I'm pretty sure there's too much stuff on the circuit. The suggestion to check the buss bar that the breaker connects to is also a good indicator. I usually put a little antioxidant grease on when installing a new breaker. A little goes a long way.

I've seen breakers that were lumpy on the side and the handle was hard to reset from being burnt internally.

[Drm50]

The 30amp breakers for dryers in the low end makes are the ones that usually go bad. Other than that usually only have breaker trouble if panel is in damp location. I buy Siemens Panels and breakers and have had very little trouble in 40yrs. The only replacements I’ve made are customers upgrading to 200amps.

[bangerjim]

I didn't think breakers go bad.
They just sit there until something goes wrong.
Good find.

YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They can an do go bad...............just sitting there!!!!!! The 1st thing I check when having whole circuit problems ( not just a single outlet or lamp) is the breaker. I have replaced at least 5 mag breakers in the 4 houses I have lived in over the years. They (the internal mechanical trip mechanism) become weak and can slowly arc the contacts inside and create resistance in those contacts that will cause light dimming and erratic behavior in the ENTIRE circuit. Dirt invasion will also have detrimental effects on breakers.

Always flip and check the breaker FIRST. Will save you time and headaches in the future. And if you are "out of town", as it sounds,buy a couple spares for those dark and stormy night when the SHTF moments. I am only 2 miles from a Lowe's and 5 miles from a Home Despot. And I STILL have spares in the shop stores.

Glad you fingered it out!!!!

banger

[roadie]

Hickory, Glad you found the problem. I've never seen a circuit breaker fail either...But that could be due to this old duplex house having fuse boxes, instead of CB panels, LOL.


Some of us are ET's

Yep, I've had circuit breakers die for no apparent reason I could see.......never seen one die in a fuse box.....haven't seen a fuse box in about 30 years.

EE's.......ME's......ET's........

I'm just happy to be able to get outa bed in every morning.

[abunaitoo]

I almost sure most of the breakers in the box have not been changed.
Must be over 60 years old.
I know we did change the box out once to have more breakers.
That was about 30 years ago.
I filled up the last three open spaces around 10 years ago.
Maybe I should have them checked.

Anyone still see those glass fuses?????

[bangerjim]

I almost sure most of the breakers in the box have not been changed.
Must be over 60 years old.
I know we did change the box out once to have more breakers.
That was about 30 years ago.
I filled up the last three open spaces around 10 years ago.
Maybe I should have them checked.

Anyone still see those glass fuses?????

You do NOT want to go back to screw-in glass fuses. Magnetic breakers are so far superior there is no comparison. Sure, you may have to change a breaker out ever 10-15 years, no big deal. Glass fuses, even the "slo-blo" kind, are so easy to pop. and with today's appliances that love to draw 1800-2500+ watts each, you could easily be popping glass ones on a daily basis. They are NOT forgiving to surges like breakers are.

Just go out ever 2 years or so and cycle each of your breakers off for 10-15 seconds and then back on. That gives anything on that circuit a break from you fast cycling the power. You will have to reset all your DVR's/ovens/clocks in the house, but no big whoop..That re-seats the contacts in the breakers and will show up any weakened ones.

I got rid of all glass fuses 30+ years ago when I helped my Dad rewire his "fuse" box to a modern "breaker" box. Not too bad. his old house only had 8 circuits. Our current home has 28 circuits......all breakers, of course!

banger

[popper]

Yes, breakers do go bad and with the lousy China ones, more so. They have both thermal and magnetic break actions.

[Elroy]

Yea,but them old glass fuses had the great advantage of being able to be screwed in on top of a penny...Just kidding .I figure a lot of homes burnt down,and people have even died because of that bonehead decision.

[Scrounge]

I believe LED lights have to be wired correct.
I've never tried switching the wires around to see what it would do, but I would check on that.
If the LED works find in another outlet. it could be the switch or outlet.
I think.

You only have to worry about correct polarity on the LED's if you buy the components, and wire the light yourself. If you buy an LED "light bulb" it's already done. Bought a pack of these the other day, we'd run out and had a bunch of bad CFL's to replace. https://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-60-Watt-Equivalent-A19-Non-Dimmable-LED-Light-Bulb-Soft-White-8-Pack-B7A19A60WUL18/303574541 Something like this, if you're making a custom lamp, you'd need to wire it correctly. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/OSRAM-Opto-Semiconductors/GH-CSSRM324-V5V7-1-1-700-R33?qs=sGAEpiMZZMu4Prknbu83y46Vt3EUeCYoPw2m5aUTVcN nSmQQWddQIQ%3D%3D and it takes DC power, so you have to provide a source of that in the correct voltage and current.

For household lighting, you don't need to build your own lamps anymore. Unless you want to. Some guys do for things like a spindle light on a small milling machine, or a ring light for a macro lens on a camera, maybe a DIY bore light. Haven't seen one of those online yet, but I have seen several of the spindle and camera lights.

[Scrounge]

Yes, breakers do go bad and with the lousy China ones, more so. They have both thermal and magnetic break actions.

They sure do! I've had 3-phase breakers loose just one phase of a breaker in equipment I've worked on three times. Gets interesting troubleshooting those, too. ;) Back when I first started working on such things, lock out/tag out wasn't a thing yet. It could take a while to realize that only some parts of the equipment were getting power.

[Drm50]

There is nothing wrong with a good fuse box that is the proper size for the dwelling. Trouble is most of them in older homes are overloaded and spidered out to other fuse boxes. Some all electric homes built in late 50s had some modern fuse boxes built to handle modern appliances and electric heat. If fuse box is in good repair it is safe as breakers.

[375RUGER]

I have not read through this 3 pages.

Do you have arc fault circuit breakers in the system? they will cause outages on circuits where there is no fault.

[jonp]

Did you pull the outlet and check the box and the switch plus the lights?

The two outlets behind the washer kept kicking off for some reason. I reset them a few times and yesterday I finally pulled the plate off. It was full of ants. They were in the outlets and the nest kept tripping them. I pulled both, threw them and sprayed the box and behind it replacing both with new ones.

[jonp]

I almost sure most of the breakers in the box have not been changed.
Must be over 60 years old.
I know we did change the box out once to have more breakers.
That was about 30 years ago.
I filled up the last three open spaces around 10 years ago.
Maybe I should have them checked.

Anyone still see those glass fuses?????

I was just looking at some in Lowes the other day. They work fine as long as the wiring is good but breakers are better I think.
LED's do have to be wired right and in the correct order to work. I was in a tire shop years ago in North Bay, ON and a guy was putting LED chicken lights all over his log truck and trailer. Was having a time of it until I pointed out he wasn't wiring them quite right as I had just read about them for an off the grid solar system. He ended up giving me a couple of pounds of caribou jerky as thanks for helping him

[MaryB]

You only have to worry about correct polarity on the LED's if you buy the components, and wire the light yourself. If you buy an LED "light bulb" it's already done. Bought a pack of these the other day, we'd run out and had a bunch of bad CFL's to replace. https://www.homedepot.com/p/EcoSmart-60-Watt-Equivalent-A19-Non-Dimmable-LED-Light-Bulb-Soft-White-8-Pack-B7A19A60WUL18/303574541 Something like this, if you're making a custom lamp, you'd need to wire it correctly. https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/OSRAM-Opto-Semiconductors/GH-CSSRM324-V5V7-1-1-700-R33?qs=sGAEpiMZZMu4Prknbu83y46Vt3EUeCYoPw2m5aUTVcN nSmQQWddQIQ%3D%3D and it takes DC power, so you have to provide a source of that in the correct voltage and current.

For household lighting, you don't need to build your own lamps anymore. Unless you want to. Some guys do for things like a spindle light on a small milling machine, or a ring light for a macro lens on a camera, maybe a DIY bore light. Haven't seen one of those online yet, but I have seen several of the spindle and camera lights.

If you want to play around building your own LED lights these are fun to play with, equivalent to a 40 watt incandescent bulb. Need a DC supply, thermal epoxy, and a hefty heatsink to keep them cool(heat is the enemy of LED's). I use surplus computer heatsinks that I get cheap off ebay https://www.mpja.com/400-Lumen-5-Watt-Super-Bright-Warm-White-LED/productinfo/32076+OP/ a pair of these on a heatsink will light a room up. And draw very little energy in the process!