hard cast vs jhp performance on game

[theangrydangler]

this may be a noob question as I have never hunted with hard cast. however I have recently heard that they do a good job on deer sized game especially if they have a wide flat nose. I currently hunt with a 357 mag and I usually run buffalo bore 158 gr jhp's and they do a good enough job however I noticed theh tend to break apart. would a nice hard cast in the 180+ grain weight leave enough of a wound cavity to bring down deer as quickly and ethically as aforementioned hollowpoint?

[jreidthompson1]

Should be good information here.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?url=http%3A%2F%2Fcastboolits%2Egunloads% 2Ecom%2Fforumdisplay%2Ephp%3Ff%3D22&share_sfid=22&share_fid=9688&share_type=sf

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[rintinglen]

A hard-cast boolit will typically shoot through a critter, leaving a blood trail from both entrance and exit wounds. A JHP often will stop inside the animal leaving only one hole to bleed from. When they work as advertised, J-clads do more tissue damage inside as they pass through.

[waksupi]

I'm not sure if it was Veral or someone else, but it was stated that a wound channel under 1 1/2" kills faster. The smaller wound encourages fast bleeding to cleanse the wound. A larger trauma wound will contract itself to help seal the wound. I've had no problem with deer and elk with a hard cast bullet. Small wounds, quick kill. Full penetration and retained mass is your friend. I would go with the heavier weight in cast. They will kill faster.

Read my tag line.

[mdi]

I don't hunt any more but I don't think deer have evolved to a sturdier/harder to kill animal. With jacketed bullets one relies on bullet deformation (expansion) for tissue damage. More often than not cast bullet users depend on bullet shape for effectiveness. I have used a plain old 429421 cast from "normal" BHN in my 44s for many years, in my belief that a SWC will penetrate straighter, deeper and do a lot of tissue damage because of its traveled distance. Ranch Dog designed a cast bullet for hunting which is a round nose flat pint, and from reports, works quite well without expansion.

If I were to use a 357 Magnum for deer I would probably use a 158-160 gr SWC or RNFP and I'd guess they would pass through the animal, and if not a DRT, there would be a good blood trail for tracking. I would use an upper load to get a good workable velocity, upwards of 1,200 fps. And as always, bullet placement is extremely important.

Just a thought about "hard cast". I cast bullets for over 20 years before this term became "chic/cool". I believe it came about from newer casters thinking "harder is better" and the commercial casters started giving them what they want (hard bullets survive shipping better). Now it seems like all cast bullets are called "hard cast" (what BHN is the official point where a cast bullet becomes "hard"?). Before my start, casting bullet alloy was described as the lead to tin ratio ratio (in the beginning I used 16-1 and 20-1), then it seemed "names" were added (like Lyman #2 and wheel weight alloy) and BHN. For many years I have used bullets running between 10-13 BHN and some 9mm and rifle bullets running 15-16 BHN. At Magnum velocities I get minimal/no leading (mostly 357 and 44 Magnums). To me, "hard cast" means nothing more than a cast bullet and it is probably harder than necessary...

jes my dos centavos...

[kingrj]

I cannot answer your question directly because I have no experience in killing deer with a hard cast SWC in .357 caliber..However I have killed over 3 dozen deer with various handguns and bullet types and I can tell you that in my experience with handguns of at least .44 caliber that a hardcast SWC bullet kills deer just as efficiently as a JHP in that caliber. In addition it gives more opportunities for shot placement such as a quartering away shot when penetration becomes very important. The only deer I have killed with .357 caliber have been with 158 JPH's in either the .357 max or the .357 Herrett in broad side shots only. With the hard cast .44 SWC's I have shot deer and had end to end penetration.

[ole_270]

Hard cast is a pretty general term. For my uses I use wheel weight as the upper limit in hardness, and tend to go softer for most everything. I worked up a load for the 308 this year using the NOE clone of the #315 Saeco mold with an alloy tested at 2.94% Sb, 1.4% Sn, so just under WW with 1% tin added. Bullet is a truncated cone, with a medium flat point, tapered body, 180 gr in my alloy gas checked and powder coated. Ran them at 2200 fps, powder coated, water dropped out of the curing oven. I dropped 3 whitetail does at 80-100 yards with them and got complete penetration with heavy damage on entrance. The largest doe was hit in the chest facing me, the bullet exited the ham for full length penetration. I may try air dropping some and use them next time to see how much difference it makes.

[megasupermagnum]

A hard cast bullet, one that shows minimal or no expansion, is certainly effective with a very wide flat nose. I do not know if you have interest in reloading or not, but since you mentioned Buffalo Bore, they do make a 180 grain WFN round that would work well. Another option is the plain jane Remington 158 grain soft point (not hollow point), and has provided many deer for us over the years. Unfortunately most 357 magnum ammo is weaker than it once was. They work very well reduced, however, if you want full power ammo, you will have to buy from company's like Buffalo bore, Double tap, etc. Or you can load your own.