Hand Loading for the 454 Casull - Wow, what a minefield

[BigSky!]

Well, I have read a lot here and learned a lot, this is my first post. I'm sorry it is a long one.

I have been reloading for decades. I am now delving into reloading for pistols for the first time. I am having a difficult time finding consistent information with respect to reloading for the 454 Casull. Heck, I've even come up with sources where, for the same bullet, the starting load is a higher power charge than another sources maximum charge. One printed source lists H110 @ 28.5 max for a specific bullet while another lists 31.5 as starting and 36.5 as max. That's a heck of a difference and keep in mind H110 often carries the "do not start below minimum" admonition. I see similar variations with Winchester 296, which is the same as H110. But, I also see some loads of H110 that are much different than WW296. They should be similar/identical, with the same bullets.

I'm going to be using H110, at least to start with, and I know it has a narrow operating weight range. So, I'm not happy when I come across such discrepancies. As of now I intend to only use cast/hard cast bullets. I will be using 340 grain Beartooth to start. Most of my standard manuals for rifles, which also contain handgun bullets are all about jacketed bullets. I will continue my online search. I'm just hoping some other 454 guys can provide their best or favorite resources, whether that be manufacturer sites, other websites or printed manuals. As with everything else reloading, I like multiple resources.

For additional information, I will be loading for a Ruger Toklat and plan to shoot 340 grain and 360 grain hard cast bullets. This is for grizzlies, mountain lions and wolves, all of which I have had nervous encounters with in the past here in Montana.

It's just interesting there is a larger amount of conflicting information for the 454 than there is for any other round for which I have ever loaded. I like the Lyman 4th edition, even though it is now a decade old. I do like powder manufacturers' websites; but, I am amazed at the limited number of bullets for which they have load information. I guess one needs to weed through it and just make determinations of "similar bullets" and then be cautious. In addition to hand loading for the 454 being new to me, loading cast bullets is also new to me. It's a good thing I like being educated.

I will also tell you that through my reading here and on other similar sites, I am convinced that, for my intended purposes, these bullet weights (340 and 360) are best driven a speeds around 1200 fps +/- 50 or so fps.

Oh, before anybody goes there, yes, I have searched this forum (and others), quite thoroughly, regarding this topic. Direct input regarding my articulated questions and concerns is what I seek. I, unlike many other ignorant people, acknowledge and recognize my ignorance. Thanks in advance for any and all input and guidance you can provide when it comes to loading for the 454 Casull.

[megasupermagnum]

Different bullets, and the resulting differing seating depths can cause a large variation in pressure in straight wall cartridges that you do not get from a large bottle necked rifle cartridge. This is likely what you are seeing. It's really the in case volume that is important, and even .020" makes quite a difference on a relatively small case such as this. While there is a warning not to download H110/W296 10%, the world is not going to end if you are slightly below that. Some guys even get away with standard primers, but I can only recommend magnums for H110.

I do not load for 454 casull, however, I do trust Hodgdon's load data. They say for a 360 grain LFN bullet, an OAL 1.760", start 21 grains, max 24 grains. That is with both H110 and W296, which are the same powder. Slight variations in data is the result of different powder lots. I also notice the Hodgdon max loads are only 43,400 CUP. That doesn't seem like a lot to me, as the 454 Casull can be loaded to 65,000 psi. This might account for some of the other variations you are seeing. Some "max" loads might only be 43,000 CUP, and some might be all the way to 65,000 PSI. There is no direct comparison of CUP to PSI, but I do not think 43k CUP is anywhere near 65k PSI.

[calm seas]

A lot of the reloading data is geared to the smallest common denominator - in this case, Taurus pistols. Bought some bullets from a commercial caster who said he pushed them to 100,000 psi without gas-checks in a Ruger and Freedom Arms - scattered a Taurus. I personally use 24.0 gr of H110 or W296 under a 360 gr WFNGC, and got 3 pass-throughs with 3 shots from a Ruger Alaskan to finish a 6.5 ft grizz last year. That commercial caster told me that 24 gr was a 'starting point' for their 340 gr loads. I have no desire to see if either of my Rugers can withstand 100,00 psi. In my SRH, my loads will pass through a 6 inch spruce tree - took 53 to cut the tree down.
Some data here:
http://www.reloadammo.com/454casull.htm

[fredj338]

If you have been reloading for decades, rifle or handgun, you would know that the variation from one source to the other is full of variables. Each gun is diff, virtually all testing conditions are diff. Bullets are NOT plug & play, all tend to make the final loads specs vary. GO with average middle data & work up matching vel with the book loads & watching for pressure issues. The only diff loading for the 454CAS vs other handgun rounds is it loads at rifle pressures.

[BigSky!]

Some data here:
http://www.reloadammo.com/454casull.htm

Thanks for the link. It has lots of good info.


If you have been reloading for decades, rifle or handgun, you would know that the variation from one source to the other is full of variables. Each gun is diff, virtually all testing conditions are diff. Bullets are NOT plug & play, all tend to make the final loads specs vary. GO with average middle data & work up matching vel with the book loads & watching for pressure issues. The only diff loading for the 454CAS vs other handgun rounds is it loads at rifle pressures.

All true and understood. I am and have always been sort of a "middle data" guy. Well, with the exception of a 7mm WSM I had; but, then, I just couldn't help myself. With rifles I always chased accuracy and let it tell me what velocities I needed. I certainly am not looking for inaccuracy with the pistols; but, I have no intention of hunting with them either; so, I'm more concerned with performance/penetration inside of 30 yards. Don't get me wrong, I'm not an idiot, I do want accuracy too, just not longer range. Thanks for the input so far guys. I do greatly appreciate the input.

[adcoch1]

If beartooth bullets is what you plan on shooting maybe email or call them to ask about load data. H110 is so common in 454 I am sure they have load data available.

[BigSky!]

Good suggestion adcoch1. I have e-mailed them three times in the last ten days and will continue to do so.

[Boolseye]

I load the Lee 452-300 RF and the NOE 454-350 RF for the cassul (same gun, a Toklat).
I think I read that the Toklat cylinder is rated at 92,000 psi. I load 26 gr. 296/H110 under the 300, 21.7 gr of same under the 350. I know that neither are max. These are both from book data, it's out there. I don't recall which sources I used offhand.

I recall reading some very unscientific information (taken secondhand) claiming to come from Dick Cassull as regards H110 and his namesake cartridge. I won't repeat it here other than to say there was no measuring involved other than visually with the case and the bullet used (i believe they worked a lot with 250 and 300 grain slugs). I think that speaks more to the nature of the round rather than any specific loading practices.

[hpdrifter]

A lot of the reloading data is geared to the smallest common denominator - in this case, Taurus pistols. Bought some bullets from a commercial caster who said he pushed them to 100,000 psi without gas-checks in a Ruger and Freedom Arms - scattered a Taurus. I personally use 24.0 gr of H110 or W296 under a 360 gr WFNGC, and got 3 pass-throughs with 3 shots from a Ruger Alaskan to finish a 6.5 ft grizz last year. That commercial caster told me that 24 gr was a 'starting point' for their 340 gr loads. I have no desire to see if either of my Rugers can withstand 100,00 psi. In my SRH, my loads will pass through a 6 inch spruce tree - took 53 to cut the tree down.
Some data here:
http://www.reloadammo.com/454casull.htm

a chainsaw was probably cheaper! :)

[Iwsbull]

I load the Lee 452-300 RF and the NOE 454-350 RF for the cassul (same gun, a Toklat).
I think I read that the Toklat cylinder is rated at 92,000 psi. I load 26 gr. 296/H110 under the 300, 21.7 gr of same under the 350. I know that neither are max. These are both from book data, it's out there. I don't recall which sources I used offhand.

I recall reading some very unscientific information (taken secondhand) claiming to come from Dick Cassull as regards H110 and his namesake cartridge. I won't repeat it here other than to say there was no measuring involved other than visually with the case and the bullet used (i believe they worked a lot with 250 and 300 grain slugs). I think that speaks more to the nature of the round rather than any specific loading practices.
You might be referring to American Handgunner July/August 1987 all I can say is hot loads for sure.

[BigSky!]

It is interesting that when researching 454 handloading for cast bullets that the lion's share of the information seems to be people who wish to hotrod lighter bullets. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing wrong with that and it appears that was Mr. Casull's original intent, a powerful and relatively long range, flat shooting, hunting handgun.

Anyway, my goal, as alluded to above is to be able to shoot heavies (340+ grains) in a potentially defensive situation. Mr. Stanton did me the courtesy of a phone call last night. I thought I owed it to the forum to at least share his recommended data for the Beartooth 340 grain LFNGC at or around 1200 fps.

His suggestions:
18 grains of 2400 which should be around 1150 fps in my Toklat, to
20 grains of 2400 which should be around 1250 fps in my Toklat.

He also suggested, as an alternative, to get to my desired results, to start with 9 grains of Unique and go from there. I post this in hopes that it could help others similarly situated looking for similar loads.

If anybody can provide load information for bullets and powder combinations which work with 325, 340 and 360 grain bullets at or around the 1100 to 1300 fps mark, I know I and I assume others would appreciate it.

Every load suggestion I received, including those from bullet manufacturers are checked by me against as close as possible published data out there, including cross referencing multiple online sources such as this forum.