Cast .223 Bullets tumbling and leading barrel!!!

[ivanfern]

Hello
I recently started casting bullets for my AR15. I am using a 55grain lee mold and powder coating them with eastwood powder. After I powder coat them I size them down to .224 which I have verified with calipers. For the powder charge I am using Hodgdon H335 running 22 grains of powder which is the lower end of the charge. Went to the range and shot them and the first thing I noticed was that it smokes like a muzzle loader. The ammo was feeding and cycling just fine and about 50rounds in I had an issue. After every few shots I was felling something hit my face. After later inspection I noticed that small amounts of lead was being spit out threw my gas port and hitting me in the face. The barrel itself looked clean but the gas block has lead debris around it. I was not shooting at a target to see the hits at the moment. I decided to set up a paper target and noticed that almost every other round was tumbling and made impact on the paper sideways. I continued to shoot until the bolt would not lock. Took the bolt out and the bolt lugs were stuck in place (my guess is due to lead buildup from the gas tube). The rifle I was shooting these in is a 10.5inch barrel with a 1-8 twist rate. I am scrambling to figure this out and would greatly appreciate the advice! Thanks

[Conditor22]

Welcome to cast Boolits ivanfern
were you using gas checks?

How hard was the lead you were using?

were you using a toaster oven or a convection oven?

did you test the temperature setting to see if the oven was actually at 400° most countertop ovens are way off due to the design and location of the thermostat (put an oven thermometer in the middle of the shelf your baking on and set the oven dial until the thermometer reads 400° unless your oven is controlled by a PID you'll need to re-check the oven every time the surrounding temperature changes ( also due to the design and location of the thermostat ]

Which Eastwood powder and How long did you bake the PC'd boolits? (Eastwood states that you need to bake the PC XX minutes AFTER the boolits reach XXX degrees

Did they pass the smash test?

I push the same boolit (boolit = lead bullet :)) PC'd, 16BHN with a gas check over 3200 fps in my mini 14 with no leading or tumbling

[sureYnot]

PC not fully cured or boolits too small. You might be pushing them a little fast as well. I think I was using about 19gns of h335 with that boolit. Maybe even 18...1:7 twist.

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[sigep1764]

If boolits are tumbling, that is usually a tell tale sign of too small a boolit. How are you expanding the case necks? Can the boolits be sized .225? That is where I had to go for sizing with my AR's.

[gnostic]

Are you using an M die in loading? Pull a loaded bullet and measure it, .224 is probably too small....

[ivanfern]

So I was not using a gas check, didn't think I needed one, and I had left the oven get to temp of 400 and I left the bullets cooking for 10 minutes, any longer and they cooked. They did pass the smash test as the powder coat did not come off of the bullets.

[ivanfern]

the sizing die that I purchased is sizing down to .224, don't have the ablility to size to .225, I am thinking I was probably pushing them too hot.

[ivanfern]

I did not use a gas check because I saw that reloaders online and on youtube where not using them.

[gwpercle]

I did not use a gas check because I saw that reloaders online and on youtube where not using them.
Give gas checks a try ....can't hurt.
I've never, in 50+ years of reloading , have had the installation of a gas check make groups worse, usually that little cup made things better.
Gary

[sureYnot]

I did not use a gas check because I saw that reloaders online and on youtube where not using them.I shot plenty of that boolit without gas checks. Just barely enough powder to reliably cycle the action. Any more than that and I could barely stay on a notebook paper at 25 yards. Could push a little faster with a check.
.224 was also too small. I sanded out my sizer .0005 and tested until I reached .2265, which my rifle likes. Seems like most folks get away with .225ish.
With my rifle's fast twist, I get better results with a 62gn pill. You might too.
I also heat treat mine after PC, so the brass doesn't swage them down. Although I ordered a .226 expander and hope for some improvement there. It made a difference with my blackout.

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[ivanfern]

Hey brother really appreciate the advice. What charge are you running for your loads?

[Conditor22]

A correctly PC'd boolit of the proper size in relation to the barrel and hardness can be pushed 1800 to possibly 2000 FPS without a GC depending on the powder, twist and length of the barrel