Crap...I put the wrong primers in

[Stopsign32v]

Well I loaded up all of my 50-70 cases with 4.0cc of FFG black powder and put my 500gr on top. Everything looks good and pretty but it dawned on me today to call Starline...

Yesterday I looked at the brass before I started loading them and they appeared to be large pistol. (guys bear with me, I'm new to reloading 50-70 and finding any type of information isn't near as easy as 45 Colt or 45-70)

I loaded a large pistol primer and noticed it sat a good bit deeper than usual so I found that to be odd. I placed it in my Sharps to see if it would pop and it did with a loud pop and sparks out the end, so I thought everything was fine and loaded up my rounds.

Today I called Starline because I was curious and when I asked I was told they use large RIFLE primers. Crap...

So should I disassemble them, loose some black powder, have to re-pan lube, and reload? Or will they work with large pistol primers?

[Outpost75]

Black powder pressure should not be a problem so far as puncturing the pistol primers.

Depending upon the driven protrusion of your Sharp's firing pin, the thinner primer cup and deep-seated primer might result in a pinhole leak at the firing pin indent, due to a ductile fracture mechanism. The weaker pistol primer might also result in erratic ignition and velocity if the charge is not well settled and compressed, which could affect accuracy.

I would try just a few shots. Examine the fired cases carefully. If there is no apparent primer cup puncture or gas leakage around the primer, go ahead and try shooting them up. But if anything doesn't look right, it is safer to pull them.

[725]

What Outpost75 said.

[Stopsign32v]

I did a measurement of compression of the loads and I would say the 4.0cc FFG will be about 3/16 or a little more of compression.

[am44mag]

I made the same mistake when loading 41 Swiss. I used LP instead of LR. Luckily, it was a small batch, maybe 20 rounds at most. Most seemed to work fine, but probably about 25% had punctures.

[Toymaker]

Are these for competition? Redo them or save them for play time.
Are these for play time? No problems. The pistol primers seat deeper because they're not as tall (obvious). The pressure upon ignition will push the primer back against the bolt/block/face. IF your firing pin is long it MIGHT penetrate the primer. When this happens the bullet will have rapidly moved up the bore, or even have left the bore, relieving the pressure through a much bigger hole. Result, the front of the bolt/block/face may be dirtier than usual.
Sometimes, usually with the falling block actions like the high wall or low wall, the block won't want to move down. This is because the firing pin has gotten stuck in the primer indent (this will even happen with rifle primers). Just cock it and squeeze the trigger dropping the hammer on the firing pin again and it'll loosen.

[Stopsign32v]

Thank you guys! I swear, this is my favorite forum hands down.


Are these for competition? Redo them or save them for play time.
Are these for play time? No problems. The pistol primers seat deeper because they're not as tall (obvious). The pressure upon ignition will push the primer back against the bolt/block/face. IF your firing pin is long it MIGHT penetrate the primer. When this happens the bullet will have rapidly moved up the bore, or even have left the bore, relieving the pressure through a much bigger hole. Result, the front of the bolt/block/face may be dirtier than usual.
Sometimes, usually with the falling block actions like the high wall or low wall, the block won't want to move down. This is because the firing pin has gotten stuck in the primer indent (this will even happen with rifle primers). Just cock it and squeeze the trigger dropping the hammer on the firing pin again and it'll loosen.

Perfect! This is just for stupid plinking and I doubt I'll even be able to hit the target out at 100. I don't even know where these rounds are going to land and I only have 28 made up.

500gr 50/70....WOW talk about a resource depleter! I don't think I will be shooting this gun regularly, sadly. 60gr of powder and 500gr of lead! Sheesh

[fredj338]

I agree, with BP pressures are not an issue. As long as you get good ignition, should be fine. When I was shooting 45-120 with BP, I liked mag primers for extra flame to ignite the large powder charge. In rifle cases, I always use rifle primers.

[mehavey]

Actually . . . not a mistake at all.

Large Pistol primers for BP-Filled Cartridges are (IMHO) the norm.

https://i.postimg.cc/4xt95tyL/45-90-Bodine-Paul-Jones.jpg

[TNsailorman]

I think they are safe but maybe as Outpost said, the ignition might not be all that great. also, the primer might back up just a bit and maybe flatten but should not pose a problem. My opinion anyway. Just try 4 or 5 and see, at black powder pressure you unlikely to damage anything. james

[tomme boy]

I run large pistol in all my cast loads for 7.62x54. They work great. And I have an extra 6K of them that have no pistols that take them anymore. You might find they are more accurate. Mine are.

[15meter]

:hijack:

For 50-70, check with Accurate, there are pressure tested loads for 5744 and at least one other Accurate powder. I've used 5744 under the Lee 450 grain boolit cast using range lead plus just enough tin for good mold fill. Boolits are sized .515, lube last time around was Lenox saw lube(had it, tried it, worked, just too soft).

These get shot out of an 1870 Trapdoor Springfield.

[15meter]

:hijack:, Again!

In the original post there was a comment about difficulty in finding good 50-70 load data, I came across this years ago:
245887

245888

245889

Hope this helps even though it's a hijack....

[Stopsign32v]

All shot fine and accurate

[mehavey]

Glad things proved out. :mrgreen:
As recommended before, pistol primers are standard fare in BP-powered cartridges.

[Baja_Traveler]

Large Pistol primers are indeed the norm for BP loads.

[sharps4590]

I have a couple Schuetzen rifles that have very light hammer springs and I shoot large pistol in them all the time, behind smokeless. They probably don't generate any more pressure than BP so I've never had the first problem. Evidently you shot them, I would have as well.

[MT Chambers]

I agree with others, LP primers would be my first choice for BP loads even in the 50/90 Sharps. Black powder, even 100 grains is very easy to ignite, hotter primers can get things moving prematurely.