Rest after the cast.

[thumbs]

Actually a couple of questions.

I just got done casting a bunch of bullets. I plan to powder coat these bullets and size them. Is there a necessary time to allow the bullets to "rest" after the casting before they can be powder coated and sized. Is the reason for the "resting" stage to allow the bullets to harden a bit? I water quenched these bullets.

Is there a cheap easy way to test the bullets for hardness? These are wheel weights and again quenched. I know Lee makes a hardness tester for about 60 bucks but that's a bit steep for me.

thanks

[jcren]

I powder coat and then size as soon after casting as I can. Powder sticks best to fresh cast bullets and bullets get harder to size as they age harden. For hardness estimates, look for pencil hardness test in the sticky's or use the search bar at the top right of this page.

[cwlongshot]

i powder coat and then size as soon after casting as i can. Powder sticks best to fresh cast bullets and bullets get harder to size as they age harden. For hardness estimates, look for pencil hardness test in the sticky's or use the search bar at the top right of this page.

agreed!

[bangerjim]

As soon as they are cool & dry (water dropping to cool), I PC them! Why wait?

Pencils are a very looooooooooooooow cost way to obtain a very rough estimate of hardness. I use a Cabine-style tester for all my tests. Get the pencil chart on here. I compared the pencil test to the Cabine results and pencils are good enough for "gubment" work.

banger

[tazman]

Unless you quench them again after powder coating them, they will be the same as air dropped boolits.
The baking process for the powder coat removes all the hardness from quenching them.
To get it back, you would need to quench/heat trerat them after powder coating.

[Time Killer]

Cast, Powder Coat, and Size. Not an issue with most boolits but understand that large bullets can grow after sizing depending on the composition of the lead mix. The larger the boolit the more of an issue this is. Not something normally noticed as much in 358 caliber and less but becomes an issue in 45 and larger. Most noticeable in 300 + grain bullets. If you are loading large bullets you may want to let them age and possibly size them again before loading if they will be sitting awhile before you will be shooting them. Don't ask how I learned this, lets just say the hard way.

[thumbs]

Thanks guys. Hey its been a while since I did my last pc session. I forgot the method I used to get the powder to stick to the bullets. If I remember correctly I set the oven to 150 and put the bullets in for 4 minutes to get them warm. Then into the powder and shake like the devil to coat the bullets then back into the oven set to 400deg for 20 minutes. When I put the bullets into the oven this time to warm them when I put them into the powder they all clumped together. Not sure if its my procedure of the temp is too high. Any suggestions?
thanks

[RED BEAR]

Cast, Powder Coat, and Size. Not an issue with most boolits but understand that large bullets can grow after sizing depending on the composition of the lead mix. The larger the boolit the more of an issue this is. Not something normally noticed as much in 358 caliber and less but becomes an issue in 45 and larger. Most noticeable in 300 + grain bullets. If you are loading large bullets you may want to let them age and possibly size them again before loading if they will be sitting awhile before you will be shooting them. Don't ask how I learned this, lets just say the hard way.

I really never thought about resizing i do use 44 cal 310 gr bullets i will go back and check them as its been a good 6 months since i cast and sized them. I don't pc but don't think that would have anything to do with them growing would it.

[cwlongshot]

Thanks guys. Hey its been a while since I did my last pc session. I forgot the method I used to get the powder to stick to the bullets. If I remember correctly I set the oven to 150 and put the bullets in for 4 minutes to get them warm. Then into the powder and shake like the devil to coat the bullets then back into the oven set to 400deg for 20 minutes. When I put the bullets into the oven this time to warm them when I put them into the powder they all clumped together. Not sure if its my procedure of the temp is too high. Any suggestions?
thanks

Thats too hot! If you feel you need to warm them just put on top of the oven when warming. But its usually not needed unless really humid conditions. Spotlessly clean & unfondled is more important.

CW

[kungfustyle]

Rifle leads its a good idea to wait for about two weeks before sizing them. They need to harden or they may deform during the sizing.

[thumbs]

Thanks again guys. When I try to pc them without warming them the powder will not stick at all. If I can get the temp right the heat allows the pc to stick just enough to coat the boolits well. I am using Harbor freight red. It may be old. Anyway Eastwood is about 20 miles from me. I may head over and pick up a pound of their stuff. The stuff I have should work I apparently don't have the temp right. Idono.

Yeah this is the first time I cast for rifle. Thanks for the tip

[Time Killer]

Red Bear I would just mike them first to see if they were still acceptable. That is what I do now. Does not matter if they are PC or lubed. 6 month is plenty of time for them to have hardened and grown if it is going to happen.

[RED BEAR]

Red Bear I would just mike them first to see if they were still acceptable. That is what I do now. Does not matter if they are PC or lubed. 6 month is plenty of time for them to have hardened and grown if it is going to happen.

Yea i will check em before i resize. I try to cast what i will need in winter.

[mdi]

I started casting pre-web, before I heard about "aging" my bullets. I have a small shop and not enough room to leave all my equipment out, so I have to get out/set up my casting stuff. I'll then cast bullets until I get tired and normally put them in a container (after they air cool of course) and lube/size at some later date, I started with wheel weight alloy and cannot/could not see any difference in my 6 month old bullets from my 6 hour old bullets.

I think new casters are lead to believe they need to use the same advanced methods long time, much experienced casters incorporate in their casting, often adding to the "confusion and frustration" of starting a new adventure. My first casting was with a SS pan, Coleman stove, some wheel weights and scrap sinkers, split shot and junk lead, a Lee Ladle and a Lee mold. I kept my 629 shooting good cast bullets for nearly a year before I got more sophisticated and got an electric bottom pour pot and better ($$$) molds...

I've seen it many times; "the only way to learn to cast bullets, is to cast bullets"... K.I.S.S.

[murf205]

Thumbs, how are you trying to coat the boolits? What is your process? PC'ing should not involve preheating under normal conditions. The HF powder is probably one glitch, I had issues with it when I used it. As far as waiting to size, try it both ways. Size immediately after they cool and save some for a period of time to size then. For velocity above 1500fps, I used a mix of clip on wheel weight and 2% tin and I coat the day after I cast, usually. I just measured some .452 45 Colt and some .460 boolits that I sized over a year ago and they are spot on what they were when I cast them. I have since backed that 1500fps threshold down quite a bit and my shoulder thanks me for it!

[thumbs]

Thumbs, how are you trying to coat the boolits? What is your process? PC'ing should not involve preheating under normal conditions. The HF powder is probably one glitch, I had issues with it when I used it. As far as waiting to size, try it both ways. Size immediately after they cool and save some for a period of time to size then. For velocity above 1500fps, I used a mix of clip on wheel weight and 2% tin and I coat the day after I cast, usually. I just measured some .452 45 Colt and some .460 boolits that I sized over a year ago and they are spot on what they were when I cast them. I have since backed that 1500fps threshold down quite a bit and my shoulder thanks me for it!

I am having a problem getting the pc to stick to the bullets. I can shake the devil out of them in the pc but they still won't coat. I watch a video by Elvis Ammo where the used his method of 4@140. That is 4 minutes at 140* then put them in the pc shake and back into the oven at 400* for 20 minutes. Last night I tried to PC the bullets and had no luck getting the PC to stick to the bullets. Not sure my thermometer is right in the oven so am going to try my infrared gun and see if my temps are close.
I only live a few miles from Eastwood powder coating so I went over today and got a lb of there stuff. It is supposed to elminate the preheating used in the HF process.

[cwlongshot]

Dont read me wrong. I am not saying pre heating is wrong or bad. Just that 150 degree heating is TOO MUCH!! If you cannot touch the bullets they are too hot. Its WARMING not cooking.

CW

[eveready]

Thumbs, what kind of container are you using to coat your boolets? Make sure it is a number 5 recycle container. I use a margarine bucket and have no problems at all with Harbor Freight powder.

[cwlongshot]

BLK airsoft BB’s can also help to create more static. (Thats why the #5 bucket too) Thats likely why they dont coat well.

Good luck

CW

[mdi]

I don't know why OP's not getting good coverage, but I just took some clean bullets, no lube or grease, and tumbled them in HF red. Worked OK. Tried HF black and didn't get good results. Tried a few colors from Smoke, all worked well. I tried air soft BBs and different containers and all worked OK. I even put a square container in my rotary tumbler drum and tumbled for 15-20 minutes, worked pretty good. I tried spraying also, and that was enlightening (OK to good coverage, but Powder Coating powder gets every where!). I only did about 1,000 but haven't done any lately because my nekkid cast bullets don't lead my guns and are accurate. I don't mind a bit of lube on my fingers now and then...

[thumbs]

Thanks guys. I appreciate all the suggestions. Yep #5 containers. I think the HF pc may be to old to work. I can't get it to stick no matter what I do. I even hit the boolits with break cleaner still no good. I tried the Eastwood stuff with much better success. No preheating I hit them with break cleaner because I had handled them, put them in the container to pc them they into the oven for 20 minutes. Now the funny part. I have only powder coated handgun boolits in the past. The first batch though the sizer was a bugger. The boolits drop big then with the pc on them it was a real problem getting some of them through the sizer. Quite a few stripped off the pc in the bearing surfaces. Anyway I probably should have done this after the boolits were powder coated but I lubed the next batch with case lube. The all went through without a problem. The handgun boolits had no problem going through the sizer without lube but the rifle bullets need it apparently. Some of the boolits were .0010 to .0020 over size but sized pretty easily using the lube. I lost a good number today in the name of education. LOL

Yeah I don't know why I am having so much problem either. I guess its been close to a year since I powder coated and all when without a hitch. No problems just ran through the motions and coated without even thinking about it. One batch after the other. I never gave coating these boolits a thought. I figured it would go like the last time. On well the only thing I can think of is the powder is old. Idono

[bangerjim]

Thanks guys. Hey its been a while since I did my last pc session. I forgot the method I used to get the powder to stick to the bullets. If I remember correctly I set the oven to 150 and put the bullets in for 4 minutes to get them warm. Then into the powder and shake like the devil to coat the bullets then back into the oven set to 400deg for 20 minutes. When I put the bullets into the oven this time to warm them when I put them into the powder they all clumped together. Not sure if its my procedure of the temp is too high. Any suggestions?
thanks

I have never found ANY reason to heat boolits B4 PC'ing...............unless you in a cave in Alaska in the dead of winter! the powders stick just fine with out any heating. Forget that step and you will be just fine.

And 400F for 10 min after the powder turns shiny is all that is needed for all the many powders I have used.

banger

[thumbs]

Just tried another batch after dinner. Took the boolits from the can put them in the pc shook it for one minute, put them in the oven for 20 minutes, bingo just like the old days. I use the new Eastwood powder. I think my HF powder is too old. Cant find any HF red. Put some case lube on the boolits and sized them perfectly.

[murf205]

Now you're cookin' (pun intended)

[cwlongshot]

I surely hope you mean .001/.002 oversize...

There isnt a bullet sizer made, designed to size down .010 that I can think of!

CW

[thumbs]

Yeah I better go back and change that. LOL Thanks for pointing it out.

[mdi]

I PCed a few hard to size bullets, but I sized them, cleaned then PCed and sized again. Just an extra step for occasional difficult bullets. One good thing about OOPS! is you learn and just used up a bit of time. I have remelted some of my screw ups more than I'll admit...

[thumbs]

I PCed a few hard to size bullets, but I sized them, cleaned then PCed and sized again. Just an extra step for occasional difficult bullets. One good thing about OOPS! is you learn and just used up a bit of time. I have remelted some of my screw ups more than I'll admit...

Actually that was my next step. Fortunately a bit of lube on the PCed boolits allowed them to be sized pretty easily. I was going to recast the oops boolits today but I cast outside and it poured all day. I tested the hardness of the boolits using the pencil method and they were over 28. Quenched wheel weights. I guess that is why they were so hard to size in the beginning.

[David2011]

I surely hope you mean .001/.002 oversize...

There isnt a bullet sizer made, designed to size down .010 that I can think of!

CW

You're right. Nothing DESIGNED to do that. A commercial caster I know got a .429 mixed in with his .401s using an automated air powered Star. The star sized that .429 to .401 but it was way long for loading into a .40 case.

[Super Sneaky Steve]

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/731364/lee-lead-hardness-testing-kit

I use the Lee hardness tester.

[cwlongshot]

You're right. Nothing DESIGNED to do that. A commercial caster I know got a .429 mixed in with his .401s using an automated air powered Star. The star sized that .429 to .401 but it was way long for loading into a .40 case.

I can tell ya first hand.. dont leave 220g 413’s on the bench when you dump a load of 200g .403’s for sizing... ;)

CW