700x

[1Shirt]

Have never loaded 700X for cast in rifles, but have noticed that a fair number seem to load it for lite loads. Was interested in what johnch and beagle wrote recently. Will try some of their recommendations for 223 with 700X. That said, would also be interested in cast recommendations for this powder with 30-30, 300S, 308, 6.5x55, 7.5x55, 243, 7x57, based on experiance with this powder and any of these ctgs. Noted that beagle used dacron fill with his 223 loads. I usually use dacron with small charges of fast powder, and would appreciate it if those who respond list a yea or nay on fillers with their loads. As always, thanks in advance to those who respond. By the way, have been bringing in the brass monkey for the last few nights in Ne. Warm spell today forcast, into the low 20's. Sure limits time at the range.
1Shirt :coffeecom

[The Nyack Kid]

little bit on the cool side huh? Ive been holed up and haven't seen much news , but i did see were West Yellowstone MT had 45 bellow zero a couple of days ago . heck though our Alasken and Canaden freinds would think that is T-shirt weather. aint freetrade great we send them our hot air out of washington and they send us cold air out of the artic.

[1Shirt]

You got that right Kid! Wish I had never left Ak. It is a whole lot more civilized and has a whole lot more common sense than states in the lower 48.
1Shirt!

[26Charlie]

One of my favorite 100 yd. target loads in the .30-06 is the Lyman 311241 150 gr. RNPB with 8.0 gr. of 700-X. Velocity is about 1250 f/s, recoil and noise are low, and accuracy in my Springfield is 1 1/2" at 100 yd.
Its also a great load for teaching a youngster or new shooter, once they graduate from the .22, because they don't get hurt and they love to hit things with the big cartridge.
No wads used with fast pistol powders; not needed and can be cause of a ringed chamber according to reports I have read.

[1Shirt]

26Charlie, That load sounds good, and something that I could work on with my 12 yr. old grand daughter. I enjoy accurate loads in the 1200-1600 fps level for reasons: 1. Minimal recoil 2. Minimal report 3. cheap to shoot
4. To work with kids without them becoming recoil sensitive. Appreciate the reply. Thanks!
1Shirt :coffeecom

[26Charlie]

That will work well for a 12 yr. old. If only shooting at 50 yd., the following will be of interest.

Another load I used many years ago was the Lyman 31133 hollow point with 5.5 gr. 700-X, Red Dot, or Bullseye. All seemed to shoot very accurately at short range up to 50 or 75 yards. In college I lived in an apartment in a two story house, and pigeons roosted above the front porch and crapped down on the front stoop. I went out about 6 AM one morning - the offending pigeon flew to the roof line of the next house over. I glanced about to see no one was in sight, raised the .30-06 Springfield with 26" Ace target barrel and Lyman aperture sights, and dumped the pigeon. Slid the rifle behind me and eased back inside. I don't think anyone even heard the shot. This was in a heavily populated New Orleans neighborhood.

I recently ran a series of targets with different Moisin Nagant rifles, looking for a good small game load. The 5.5gr. load of 700-X and of WW231 with a 115 gr. flat-point cast bullet shot nice 1" or a little larger groups at 50 yd. with the sight setting for the 200 gr. load at 100 yds. These were commercial cast bullets like 3118, but I had bought a couple of boxes of 500 because they were really a good price. 3118, 31133, and other similar designs would work the same, I'm certain. Velocity on these was around 1190 f/s.

[The Nyack Kid]

1shirt
In case you didn't know ,the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook is full of reloading data with 700X.

[1Shirt]

Thanks Kid, Know that, and have the book, but have always liked to back up what the books have listed with actual experiance from those who have shot the loads. The Lyman book doesn't list some of the lighter loads that I have seen in response to this thread. Just loaded a few 06 based on 26Charlie's recommendation, and as soon as the weather cooperates and gets to the range will be anxious to try them.
1Shirt :coffeecom

[The Nyack Kid]

question
I have a old 8# tin of 700X given to me it has about a a pound of powder left in it. what is it soposed to sell like when it is still good . does it have that "sweet" IMR smell or the "acidic" smell of AA2495 ? how else can i tell if this powder is still good ?

[35remington]

It should smell sharp, like solvent. Time may have muted that somewhat. If it's acidic, you won't forget the odor, because it's a bit like some of the solutions you were told not to smell in Chem. lab in high school, which are painful (literally) to the nasal passages. Acidic = deteriorated. Unless it was stored in adverse conditions it should still be good.

A load that works with very good accuracy in the .30-06 using 700X is the Lee 113F and 9.0 grains for 1550 fps. Very accurate. Use a half grain to a grain less in the .308. Usually the shotgun flake powders show better accuracy with light weight cast bullets if they are backed down from the usual recommendations of 13-14 grains of powder. Same charge weights work well using Red Dot, Green Dot or W231.

I don't have a problem using dacron with shotgun flake powders, but as long as a gaschecked bullet is used the powders (700X, etc. ) ignite so easily that velocity variations are minor. Dacron would be mostly for plainbase bullet protection in this case. The loads mentioned here don't need it. Unless maybe you're in the habit of shooting straight down a lot.

[Bullshop]

question
I have a old 8# tin of 700X given to me it has about a a pound of powder left in it. what is it soposed to sell like when it is still good . does it have that "sweet" IMR smell or the "acidic" smell of AA2495 ? how else can i tell if this powder is still good ?
I think a good test is to shoot it.
As I understand when powder does begin to break down the nitrogen begins to sepperate and absorbe moister forming a nitric accid. This accid begins to attack whatever it touches. That is why powder that has begun to break down stored in metal cans will cause the can to rust badly inside. If shaken the container will emit a red dust. I had some very old Hodgdens powder in the paper cans with metal bottom in which the nitric accid had atacked the can and it could be completely crumbled in one hand.
I have shot plenty of powder that was well into this process. It gave good results with no apparent problems. One caution here would be that volume for volume it will weigh less than fresh powder so max published loads are a no no.
Another caution is to never load ammo and let it sit at all, but shoot it right now so the accid doesnt have time to work on the brass. I burned a case of old 4895 this way. If I was going to shoot 200 rounds on saterday I would load them on saterday.
Another thing I do after aquiring such powder is to screen it and repack it into plastic containers. By screening it I mean I use a screen that will catch the powder but let the red dust go through. I do it outside in a slight brease and pour from as high as I can and keep the powder on the screen, about a couple feet. This lets the bease blow most of it sepperate befor it reaches the screen.
I have read powder in this condition can be dangerous and should be discarded. I am limited as to funding and am unable to make myself toss powder so that is how I handle it.
I think in this way the dangers have been delt with. I know little of the chemistry involved so wont say this is safe but just that in this way I have without incident been able to use a lot of powder that had been discarded by others as unsafe.
BIC/BS

[felix]

1970's 700X has 25 percent nitroglycerin, while the 1980's and on up have 30 percent. This amount of nitro tends to hold the powder stable for many years, even in high humidity air. However, high heat, like stored in an attic, can destroy it. Single base powders are much more likely to go down hill rapidly. ... felix

[1Shirt]

Shot the recommended 223 load this afternoon (43 degrees in Dec. in Ne-won't get many days like this), and had range to myself. Load was 5.5gr. new 700x, Win Brass, Rem Pr, 225415, .225GC, no fill, 50 yds. Two groups went 1.15" and 1" for 5 shots each, and 4 or the 5 on the 1" group went into .525. Bullets were water dropped ww, and Lee alox lubed. Tried the same wt. of pdr. under 225646, and looked like a 410 pattern with #4 buck at 10 yds. Suspect that you have to push 225646 above 2000fps. Now on the next decent day above 30 degrees will shoot a batch of Charlie26's recommended 06 loads. Days like today make me wonder what the poor folks do for fun.
1Shirt :coffeecom

[grumble]

1 Shirt-- "Days like today make me wonder what the poor folks do for fun."

Ever notice how many poor folks there are? Al would call that a "clue." <GGG>