light .243 lead load anyone?

[BigFatKen]

I have been told I can't safely load light lead bullet loads, yet I see cowboy action shooters talking about 170 gr lead bullets over 5 gr 700X in their lever actions, .30-30, 38-55 whatever. I have a modern bolt. All I want to do is shoot this #$@% squirell that gets in through my cabin's chiminey. I don't want to lug in a .22 rifle and as high as he is, I don't want to try it with a handgun.

I hear about all kinds of problems. The biggest seems the percentage of error factor. e.g. a 0.5 gr over charge is 10%, while it is ok in a 55 gr .30-06 load.
This can be solved by weighing all charges. I only need a box. Is there a detonation problem?

Any thoughts?

[BruceB]

Ken, howdy, glad you made it over here.

Some members have extensive successful experience with the.243 and cast bullets. I'll suggest they come down to this forum for consultations, but you may also want to post your question on the "Cast Boolits" forum up above, which gets much more traffic than this one.

As with any properly-done handloading, you won't have to worry about detonation or other nasty surprises.

[9.3X62AL]

Ken--

I have been shooting the RCBS 95 grain spitzer-shaped castings from my Rem 788 x 243 for almost three years now, and they DO IN rats with finality. My load has been 12.0 grains of Alliant 2400, and although I haven't chronographed these loads--I estimate they are running about 1600 FPS. These are not sub-sonic at 1600 FPS, so there's the hyper-sonic crack--if that is a problem in your environment. The loads are quite accurate, and can shade an inch at 100 yards if I do my part.

Thanks to Carpetman--The Cat Adoring USAF NCO--for the intro to this boolit. :-)

[Maven]

BFK, I too shoot cast bullets in the .243Win., but my Ruger #1 doesn't care for the RCBS or Lyman flat-points at all. However, I have had excellent results with Lyman #245496, a Loverin design, with 14gr. H/IMR 4198 and 13-15gr. WC 820. The latter is a military surplus powder (ball) which can be thrown with a pistol powder measure, i.e., once you establish the charge a given rotor throws. Btw, Lee collet dies (neck size only) with cast bullets in the .243 and other cals.

[carpetman]

I use the RCBS 95 grainer in.243 and it shoots very good and that's around 2900fps---doesn't work on deer.

[versifier]

BFK, As one who has put a few unintended holes in the roof from time to time, may I suggest, for inside work, that you take a shotshell, open the top, dump out the shot, and replace it with uncooked rice. I've dealt with more than a few tree rats of the red, gray, and flying varieties over the years, and seeing them inside the temptation to use whatever's handy has been too great several times. (When it don't rain, the roof don't leak, when it does, it's cause Tom grabbed the .22....) :violin:
Or, you could live and let live...

Kids asleep;
in the attic
squirrels f***.

Maybe not. :roll:

[9.3X62AL]

C-man.....

2900 FPS? Wow.

I have "stair-stepped" 2400 from the established 12.0 grains to 15.0 grains in 50-round lots to see where accuracy fails in that 788. Now, if the farking range would re-open I could get somewhere with the project.

[carpetman]

Dep Al I dont have a chronograph,but did use another guys on my .243. He said it was accurate and his loads were reading normal. I tried some other loads and got what I expected. The 2900 was a bit higher than what the book had said.

[BigFatKen]

That is some good news. At least it will work. I think I will avoid the 2900 fps 'tho. A throuth and through is a certainty and that speed might go for miles. Well a half mile anyway. A bullet landing 800 to 815 yards away on this line of sight will land on a little traveled road, but always a chance someone is there.

Noise is not a problem. Well, at least if I warn my wife. I like the rice idea, thank you.

I have 8 oz of 700X left. I am hoping to use it. Hornady #10 book says load 20 gr 4198 for about 1900 fps with Honady jacketed of course. I always heard NEVER underload 4198 or 4350. But there it is.

At least a start. I mean, I CAN live with it. I just wish he paid rent. 10 MOA is good enough at this range so if a rifle not liking means <10 MOA, its OK.

Anyone ever try #3 or 4 buckshot. Might open the 10MOA limit 'tho.

[Bret4207]

Ken- Welcome to the board. For tree rats I've had real good luck with a slice of apple in a Victor rat trap. I can almost guarentee the roof will be safe.

[BigFatKen]

So, I put the rat trap out and then the 'coons eat the dead squirel. If I wire down the trap, will they eat the possibly bloody wood trap?

I may need 10 traps. I'm saying I can't recognize the exact TR. Maybe predudice, I can't tell them greys apart.

Really, we have this black faced kind of squirrel also. My wife put it's photo on our Christmas cards. Rare, hate to kill one.

[Bucks Owin]

I dug up this old thread in a search for "Loverin bullet design" in a Yahoo internet search and thought it kinda cool that I ended up here. Shoulda know huh? :-D

I'm thinking of widening my cast boolit endeavors to rifle fodder. Up 'til now, I've only cast for frontstuffers and handguns. But since results have been good, what the heck!

I have two old M-70s in .243 and .270 and a M-54 in .270 that I'll be casting for. These rifles have seen a lot of use over the years and all have suffered some throat erosion to some extent and my hope is to extend their useful lives without rebarreling by using cast bullets and milder, cooler loads than the usual full tilt H-4831 type stuff. Think this idea will work? I'd be happy with sub 2" groups with cast boolits. BTW, although these rifles have lost their "gilt edge" they are by no means "shot out". Both of the M-70s will still group close to MOA and the M-54 about 1.5" at 100 yds...

I have a chance to buy a couple of .243 moulds, a Loverin design 245497 and a 245498 and would like some info as to load recipes and what kind of accuracy I might expect, velocities etc...

I'm not looking for blazing speed, just accuracy....

How are your .243 loads progressing guys?

Dennis

[Bucks Owin]

Hmmmm...

Guess no one's playing with their .243s anymore? [smilie=1:

Anyway, I got a Lyman 245497 95 gr mowld. Casts beautiful uniform 95.6 gr boolits. Problem is that the boolits are dropping at around .248 or 9". Seems kinda big to size down. The alloy is reclaimed range boolit with about 10% lino and seems pretty hard, although I'd say not as hard as my usual 50/50 WW and lino mix. (Gotta get a hardness tester "one of these days")

Is the problem in the alloy or is this mowld just a little fat?

What choo tink?

Dennis

[Bret4207]

Re- diameter, got me, try sizing them to .002 over bore if they'll chamber. FWIW, Jim Carmichael of Outdoor Life fame used to be a real good writer. Years ago he did extensive testing in the 243 and 6mm with cast. His conclusion was that the 245498 was just too long and wouldn't shoot well. The one you got he had too and got 1" groups. I think the articel is in "The Art of Casting Bullets" from Wolfe, now out of print but on Ebay occasionally.

[Bucks Owin]

Re- diameter, got me, try sizing them to .002 over bore if they'll chamber. FWIW, Jim Carmichael of Outdoor Life fame used to be a real good writer. Years ago he did extensive testing in the 243 and 6mm with cast. His conclusion was that the 245498 was just too long and wouldn't shoot well. The one you got he had too and got 1" groups. I think the articel is in "The Art of Casting Bullets" from Wolfe, now out of print but on Ebay occasionally.

Thanks pal, That's encouraging and I have great respect for Carmichel's savvy...
You wouldn't happen to remember if he was using SR 4759 for the MOA groups would you? :D

Dennis

[Maven]

Dennis, The diameter of Lyman molds of similar design & caliber can vary quite widely. E.g., I have #245496 which drops from the mold @ .2445", but its HP version was at least .246". Then again, their 95gr. FP was at least that. As for powders, yes, you can use SR4579, but also take a look at my earlier post. Btw, Carmichael got the same results when he seated the CB's deeply into the case (OAL was 2.29") as when he seated them into the rifling. Last point: Buckshot & I (independently) learned that if you first fill the lube grooves with bullet lube (what else?), you can size bullets down quite a bit, e.g., from .326" -> .314" with no loss of accuracy. However, this must be done (sized) concentrically and in a something with a strong linkage: We used Lee push through dies, which you can easily modify to fit your rifle's requirements.

[Bucks Owin]

Do the numbers 496, 497 and 498 signify the shape of the nose? My 245497 has a round nose for instance...

Thanks for the advice guys,

Dennis

[floodgate]

Do the numbers 496, 497 and 498 signify the shape of the nose? My 245497 has a round nose for instance...

Thanks for the advice guys,

Dennis\

Dennis:

No, these "cherry numbers" were assigned by Lyman just in the order they were added to the mould list. #245496 and -497 were multi-groove RN GC Loverin designs weighing (nominally, in #2 alloy) 84 and 93 grains respectively, and are just two different lengths, with the same nose profile; #245498 is a 99-gr. GC with a long, ogival nose (maybe a bore-rider); its designer is not identified in any of the cast bullet handbooks. It's only chance that these three are in order of weight. All the cherry numbers tell you is approximately when these designs were adopted - in this case, 1954-56.

Doug

[Bucks Owin]

\

Dennis:

No, these "cherry numbers" were assigned by Lyman just in the order they were added to the mould list. #245496 and -497 were multi-groove RN GC Loverin designs weighing (nominally, in #2 alloy) 84 and 93 grains respectively, and are just two different lengths, with the same nose profile; #245498 is a 99-gr. GC with a long, ogival nose (maybe a bore-rider); its designer is not identified in any of the cast bullet handbooks. It's only chance that these three are in order of weight. All the cherry numbers tell you is approximately when these designs were adopted - in this case, 1954-56.

Doug

Thanks Doug, you da man when it comes to things Lyman! So I guess my 497 mold is dropping boolits of 95.6 grs because it's a little on the "fat" said (.249+")? My alloy has some lino in it which "should" make it on the lighter end of the silver spectrum right?

Dennis

[floodgate]

Bucks:

Once again, the "rule" on Lyman / Ideal moulds is, "What it casts is what'cha got".

Happy to help.

Doug