New rifle/carbine needed but not being made by anyone.

[MOA]

A 357/38 semi-auto tube feed carbine/rifle.
I've been looking and there just is no animal out there that fills this slot. What a fun shooter it would be, and ammo is sold everywhere. I mean with the crazy's on one hand wanting to do away with all detachable magazines I think someone like Savage, Mossberg, or maybe even Ruger could come up with a simple design that incorporates a blow back design that would be similar to the old Savage Model 87A with a tubular magazine. They would just need to beef up the action and barrel a bit. Being a rimmed case it would fit in perfect with a tubular magazine and mostly flat points are utilized in revolver boolits also. Just need to offer one in rifle and one in carbine lengths. I know I'd be pre-ordering one for sure.

Cast in 158 grain to even lighter loads would be the perfect cast boolit platform for launching these cast loads at paper or even small game. I would think that most casters have molds that are in 38 or 357 design.

[SvenLindquist]

Blow back semi autos have a narrow range of loads. One that works with mild 38 loads would come apart with full house 357s.

How about an AR in 350 Legend with an adjustable gas block ? You could shoot different power loads in that.

[Bazoo]

It's a neat idea, till you get to the picking up brass part. I surely would like a marlin 1894c in 357 though.

[Cherokee]

Would be a neat idea, but I hate picking up brass from my lever actions, a semi would make it even worse. Not sure how much market there would be for a semi.

[SvenLindquist]

You can buy a brass catcher for an AR. They work great.

[Bazoo]

Maybe if it was bottum eject it's be better. My wife would love one, even if it wasn't able to digest different loads just magnums.

[RED BEAR]

You can always buy a nut pick up people use them at my range i would get one but they wouldn't pick up 25 acp or any 32.

[GhostHawk]

I for one agree with the OP. And if the price was semi reasonable I'd buy one.

For now I think most end up going the lever action route for that purpose.

I have to admit I'd buy a Hipoint Carbine in .38s/.357 in a heartbeat. Ugly or not.

[jimkim]

I for one agree with the OP. And if the price was semi reasonable I'd buy one.

For now I think most end up going the lever action route for that purpose.

I have to admit I'd buy a Hipoint Carbine in .38s/.357 in a heartbeat. Ugly or not.How about one in 357 Sig?

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[gwpercle]

Watch a few episodes of an old TV series called "The Rifleman " with Chuck Conners , then tell me you could shoot a semi-auto faster than Lucas McCain can shoot that lever action.

I'll take a lever operated 38 special/357 magnum rifle over a semi any day .

Did you know his given first name is Kevin .
With a handle like Kevin Joseph Aloysius Conners ...it's no wonder he went by "Chuck" !

More useless information,
Gary

[psweigle]

Well, my 2 cents is this. Mech tech upper and a coonan lower. Mech tech womt make the upper, i asked. If i had access to the tooling, im betting it could be made. I would sell off a bunch of stuff to buy it.

[Texas by God]

A scaled down Remington 1100 in pistol calibers or even 45-70 would be very high on the cool factor with ergonomics to boot IMO. I like your idea.

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[Froogal]

Watch a few episodes of an old TV series called "The Rifleman " with Chuck Conners , then tell me you could shoot a semi-auto faster than Lucas McCain can shoot that lever action.

I'll take a lever operated 38 special/357 magnum rifle over a semi any day .

Did you know his given first name is Kevin .
With a handle like Kevin Joseph Aloysius Conners ...it's no wonder he went by "Chuck" !

More useless information,
Gary

I was going to mention "The Rifleman" also, but you beat me to it. At one of our CAS meets, one of the events called for loading just 6 rounds in the lever action rifle and then shooting from the hip. I had never done that before. I actually hit the target 5 out of 6 shots.

[brewer12345]

Heh, I'd like a rifle of any sort in 9MM Makarov. Not holding my breath.

[MOA]

I'm sure that if Ruger and the rest of the "black gun" makers were to see the law change where detachable magazines were restricted to 3 or 5 rounds a whole lot of reworked engineering to tubular and the flex tip pointed bullets would be seeing a major ramp up at the ammo makers so they work in a tube. I'm sure that a gas management system of some simplicity could be engineered into the 1960's design of the Deerslayer. Put a nice full length Mannlicher stock to hide and protect the tube magazine and load if from the bottom just like it did the 44's. Just change the bolt face, chamber, cartridge lifter and pretty much in business. I'd incorporate a lever somewhere so you could allow more gas to bleed off for 357 mag, and that way you could shoot both cartridges. Come on........these engineers need to do something for their pay.

[popper]

So that would be a shrunk and rifled 410?

[besk]

The Timberwolf was a mean machine. I wanted an external hammer however.

[Bazoo]

Heck I'd like a deer slayer in 44, but 357 would be the bees knees. Now, a pump in 357 would be sweet too, the timberwolf didn't last long and they ain't cheap now, but one would be neat.

When Bill Ruger was first getting started he turned a savage 99 into a semiauto, showed it to savage and although they didn't want to buy the idea, they were impressed. Why he didn't make the deer slayer in 357 the world will never know.

[Bigslug]

I'm thinking the Maxim/Vickers machine gun's adjustable fuzee spring concept for increasing or decreasing rate of fire would be the ideal place to start for dealing with the change from .38 to .357. Only problem is that all it takes is one retard who doesn't read his manual or doesn't remember to dial in for the appropriate load to end up with chunks of bolt in his forehead to end that party right quick.

I'd be A LOT more interested in an upscaled Winchester 1890 pump gun. . .

[tazman]

I'm thinking the Maxim/Vickers machine gun's adjustable fuzee spring concept for increasing or decreasing rate of fire would be the ideal place to start for dealing with the change from .38 to .357. Only problem is that all it takes is one retard who doesn't read his manual or doesn't remember to dial in for the appropriate load to end up with chunks of bolt in his forehead to end that party right quick.

I'd be A LOT more interested in an upscaled Winchester 1890 pump gun. . .

Now that idea has a lot going for it.

[44Blam]

Seems like a lever gun like a Henry or Marlin would work for OP... Lever guns are semi-auto and you can shoot them pretty fast. I shot my Henry in a rifle comp and got 2nd...
I didn't really care if I won, I just wanted to see the plates bounce around after being hit by a 240 grain boolit going about 1600-1700 fps... ;)

[Baltimoreed]

You could mod a 9mm blowback AR into a pump action. Wouldn’t be that hard. I’ve seen videos of the mod. Use a wood butt and pump forarm so it’s not a ‘scary’ black rifle. They use generic glock mags I think. 9mm is pretty close to a .38 and very available. I’ve built 3 blowback AR.45s, two with forward charging handles. I used the gas tube hole to run my operating rod from my charging handle to the gas key of the bcg.

[MOA]

Seems like a lever gun like a Henry or Marlin would work for OP... Lever guns are semi-auto and you can shoot them pretty fast. I shot my Henry in a rifle comp and got 2nd...
I didn't really care if I won, I just wanted to see the plates bounce around after being hit by a 240 grain boolit going about 1600-1700 fps... ;)


NOPE.....Want a semi-auto tube feed carbine or rifle.

[Gewehr-Guy]

Didn't John Browning make his first automatic out of a 73 Winchester ? That flapper lever contraption on the muzzle kind of spoiled the fine lines of the original rifle though!!! An upscaled 1890 Win design, with the upper end of the magazine tube designed like an M-1 op-rod and gas cylinder might work, but how would you load the magazine ? Oh, and it would need an external spring around the magazine/op rod. And I want mine in .32 S&W :smile:

[gumbo333]

A Hipoint in 10mm would be close, but it's mag fed. Have to cross breed with a Henry to get a tube. A Hihenry. Plus a little Henry good looks would go a long ways on a Hipoint.

[country gent]

The colt lightning is close to what your looking for other than the semi auto. The 351 win sl would be close though.

[beagle]

You want something like the .351 self loading with a tube magazine. No reason one of these could be made easily enough. .358 re-barrel and a little tinkering with the bolt face on a stock .351 and you're there. Many will function with .357 mag cases as is as the extractors are worn. I used .357 Mag dies to load mine so they chamber fine.

The cases are a concern. My .351 threw them about 20 feet but this could be overcome.

Tube magazine. Now, that's a problem.

While we're wishing, I'm still waiting for my Remington slide action .223 that takes AR mags.

Think Remington made 10 of these for the Army's MTU back when the Running Boar was big in the Olympics without the AR mag feature. What a cast plinker/varmint buster that would be./beagle

[Traffer]

My vote is for the model 1890 Pump chambered in 357. Waaaaaaay Waaaaaaay more fun than a semi auto.

[MOA]

Well, I just sent a note to the new CEO of Ruger re my post and thoughts, will be interesting to how it is taken. Will post anything interesting re any reply.

[zymguy]

The Timberwolf was a mean machine. I wanted an external hammer however.

I saved for a long time to get mine , and I do love it . I often single feed it and slowly open the slide so I’m not chasing brass . A bolt or some falling/rolling block would probably actually suit me better .

I can usually best my lever action carbine buddies on the dueling tree , I like 38 spec with the lee 125 grain


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[facetious]

How about a scaled down Ram. 760 pump ,

[Three44s]

In pump form?

The Remington 141 in 35 Remington? Or in auto, the models 8 & 81?

Three44s

[MOA]

The colt lightning is close to what your looking for other than the semi auto. The 351 win sl would be close though.

Now that's an interesting thought. Except no tube mag so not to be subject to the laws coming down the road on detatchable magazines and any rechambering and possible bolt face work along with a new barrel. Nope, the closest thing out there to convert that I see is still the early Ruger 44 auto carbine of the 60's.

[cwlongshot]

The Timberwolf was my first thought as well, but of coarse its a pump not a auto. (My preference is the pump)

I have seen a few M1 Carbines converted to 357. This would be my thought. If you are handi and able to do some of the work yourself it would better facilitate this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ETyYyjUsJ4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_M9rxjcyAj0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEFTwt_Fcf0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAOFiTm1sLM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouzzWVDBc6A

Fun project on a great caliber!

CW

[dverna]

Until they ban HC magazines, I do not see a market for such a rifle. A product must appeal to a lot of people before it has a chance to succeed. Most people getting a pistol semi-auto carbine want quick reloads rather than dinking around loading a tube. And many want magazine compatibility with their semi-auto handgun(s). In this caliber range, these are going to be plinking and SD guns with no hunting market.

BTW, as others have said, a Marlin 94 or clone 73, is extremely fast if you do a bit of practice. Under 8 seconds to empty a tube full of cartridges. We have three and do a lot of plinking with them. I love the .38/.357, and have seven guns in that caliber, but would not buy a semi-auto to add to the herd. It makes more sense for me to add a 9mm carbine with Glock magazines, but even that is hard to rationalize when the pistol caliber lever actions do such a good job with everything from plinkers to heavy SD loadings.



I have stocked up on HC magazines in the hope they get grandfathered.

[one-eyed fat man]

I have rifles on both sides of .38/.357. In my opinion, those boys had it pretty much right a hundred some years ago when they made their 'pistol caliber' carbines by chambering carbine cartridges in revolvers. The WCF family of cartridges, in particular, feed more reliably than straight wall pistol cartridges like .357 or .45 Colt.

This hand me down from 1913 is as slick now as it was when the Canadians shipped to England for the Great War. This one is in .44-40, but was also available in .38-40. The Remington Model 25 came in .25-20 and .32-20. If the family resemblance to the .22 caliber Model 12 is not clue enough, John Pedersen designed them all.

https://www.milsurps.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=83374&d=1493321082