Indoor range scrap lead

[Venti30]

Soon, I’ll be able to get a load of a few, up to 5 buckets of indoor range lead scrap. This will be my first batch of lead recovery/ingot making.

Are there any special considerations relating to range recovery lead?

Seems from my research, there are fewer and fewer sources of lead available. This is my home range, owned by some great folks. It won’t be free, but it won’t be retail either.

My motivation for getting into casting is:

I’m a generally curious person
I like tinkering hobbies
I think I’d be able to make really good projectiles
I’d like to have a personal stockpile of lead, just in case
Ingot making will be phase 1, casting bullets later once I have a decent supply.

So, really for now just curious if indoor range scrap for melting lead presents any unique challenges?

Thanks in advance

[Jack Stanley]

No real problems you can't fix , though if the lead is mixed with shredded tires it's going to stink a bit . The lead tends to be on the soft side normally but it will work for just about anything up to fifteen hundred feet per second or so . Flux it several times and keep the heat low just in case someone shot a bit of zinc into the traps .

I got several buckets a few years ago and it's worked out real well . My pal that got the lead for me gets supplied with bullets and I have all I can use .

Jack

[skeettx]

FIRST WELCOME on your first posting :)

Yes and no!
If it is jacketed range scrap, it will be slow to melt, so I usually put
some ingots or lead sheets in the bottom of the pot to help in the melt.
You will need a strainer to remove all the slag and jackets.
Insure you do not have a live 22 in the buckets of scrap.

What will you be using for ingot molds?

Again, WELCOME

Mike

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Venti30,
Welcome to the forum.

First and foremost, Be sure to practice all the safety procedures when handling Lead, especially if there is some content that is powdery dust, which I suspect there would be, with Indoor Range lead. I would avoid breathing in any of that powdery dust, if it becomes airborne (ie, when dumping out your buckets).

As to smelting:
If there is other junk in the mix, like rubber or dirt/rocks/concrete, I would try to separate the non-metal content, as it takes a lot of fuel to melt the metal if it's full of non-metal junk.

Other than those two issues, I can't think of any other "special considerations" beyond the typical smelting any scrap lead of other sources.
Good Luck.

[Venti30]

Hi, thanks for the welcome.

I’m not sure yet on what molds I’d use. I’d like them to be rectangular though I think, as opposed to muffins, for easy storage and for easy entry to the bullet casting pot when that time comes.

I see this being the kind of thing that I spend a day at a time doing, drag all of what I’ve got out, and melt as much as I can in one session. I have to admit that I like some of the pictures I’ve seen of people stacking all their one pound bricks up like the lead Fort Knox, but I’d probably rather do something like 3 to 5 pound ingots, just to speed the process up on scrap melt days. Something like mini loaf pans perhaps?

[kevin c]

Welcome!

Just a reminder that the basic equipment for melting lead scrap includes the right PPE. I'd strongly recommend head to toe full body coverage to protect against spatters, heavily insulated gloves like welder's, a face shield and/or a respirator (it's true that clean lead doesn't vaporize significantly at the temperatures we use, but the smoke from the many contaminants in the scrap and in the wax and sawdust used to clean the metal can carry enough lead out of the melt to be a problem - this I learned from a professional in lead toxicity and abatement). There are plenty more things to consider when working with pots of 700+ degree molten metal, and I'm sure others will add to my suggestions or you can find the information on this site. The right equipment plus healthy doses of caution and common sense will get you started more safely.

Have fun and be safe!

[kevin c]

Hah, I type too slowly.

Mini loaf pans work well for bulk storage, and have the advantage of being fairly cheap. I personally have used sizes that make ingots of three and nine pounds. They stack well if you take a little care to cast them all close to the same weight, and that the pans are as close to level as possible. If stacked snug and alternating up and down, they can interlock to a degree to make a compact and stable pile.

But it's worth noting that the bigger ones won't fit in most casting pots and the smaller ones at a bit over three pounds might fit but will tend to cool the melt a lot, sometimes to the point of freezing the pot for a while. For me the mini loaf pans are mainly for bulk storage of raw alloy that I'll remelt, reformulate and recast into smaller ingots later.

Oh, if you use a loaf or muffin tin, make sure it isn't tin plated. The plating will weld your ingot right to the pan. If it has a nonstick coating, the ingots will have a bubbled surface until the coating burns off completely (the alloy is still fine). If you burn off the Teflon with a torch, the ingots will be smooth from the first pour, but don't breathe the fumes as you do the burn off.

[40-82 hiker]

Insure you do not have a live 22 in the buckets of scrap.

Mike

^^^^ THIS ^^^^

I found quite a few live rounds with primer strikes when smelting OUTDOOR range scrap. Be careful, but have fun!

[Hossfly]

Amen to the ppe, winter time you prolly pretty much covered, but summer diff set of clothes. I use light pair of tig gloves but have old thick welder gloves close by, in case have to move something really hot. That lead that splatters on skin, instantly sticks and burns till it cools.

[Dusty Bannister]

Smelting range scrap is a very common topic. Here is the URL for a search on this topic:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/google.php?cx=partner-pub-6216953551359885%3A1942134700&cof=FORID%3A9&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=smelting+range+scrap&sa.x=5&sa.y=11&siteurl=castboolits.gunloads.com%2Fforumdisplay.ph p%3F57-Lead-and-Lead-Alloys&ref=castboolits.gunloads.com%2Fforum.php&ss=3550j940126j20

You do not need to read them all, but you would be better informed to at least scan through many of them to see what kinds of equipment and molds they use, the PPE and of course safety issues. And you would do well to search and review methods and materials to flux and reduce the alloy after you remove the jacket material and other scrap. Some jacketed bullets will squirt hot alloy when heated in a melter. Better to read about how to avoid that before it happens.

Word of caution. Use a burner heavy enough to be considered over engineered. Quit when you are getting tired and before you make a mistake. Do not push beyond a point when you think you should stop. Accidents happen, and no sense putting yourself in that position. Thin ingots melt quicker than thick ones, and they cool quicker too. Both stack just as well, if they are all evenly poured. You will have a big job ahead of you. Take your time and do it safely. Dusty

[LenH]

I was able to get a bucket of indoor range lead several years ago. The range setup was a steel backer plate and bullet stop at the top. Any jacketed bullets were flattened and the jacket
pealed and easy to separate. As others have said be on the look out for a live .22 round, I don't know how that made it's way behind the backer plate but I found at least 2.
Any bullet that hit the backer was flat and melted pretty quick. It was fairly soft lead and I treated it as nearly pure.

[murf205]

Welcome brother. If you like tinkering hobbies, you have struck it rich! As far as ingot molds, I have used cast iron corn stick molds that I bought at an Old Time Pottery store. Flea markets are full of them too. I use a pair of vise grips to handle them when hot and the sticks fit in a casting furnace very easily. Drop them straight in and they don't make a "plop" that usually results in a splash from the tinsel fairy. Don't forget the gloves and glasses and above all don't hesitate to ask questions. There are some really great people on this site who are willing to share what they know.

[lightman]

Welcome Aboard! I can't add much to what has already been said. Do watch for loaded ammo, it just has a way of getting to the backstop! Smelting goes faster and easier if you have a shooting buddy to help. Invest in a set of steel stamps to permanently mark your ingots before you get so many that you can't do it! Read the stickies, ask questions, be safe and have fun!

[Venti30]

Welcome Aboard! I can't add much to what has already been said. Do watch for loaded ammo, it just has a way of getting to the backstop! Smelting goes faster and easier if you have a shooting buddy to help. Invest in a set of steel stamps to permanently mark your ingots before you get so many that you can't do it! Read the stickies, ask questions, be safe and have fun!

Would you stamp dates, hardness, source?

[Wis Tom]

Welcome to a wealth of great info. All I can say is never rush anything, and check your lead casing well,. I have found 22's in mine, and I'm the one that screened them in the first place. Protect everything you don't want burnt, as you have not seen anything that you could imagine, until that first tinsel fairy visit. Stay safe, read as many as these posts, as you can, and have fun shooting.

[William Yanda]

"Would you stamp dates, hardness, source?" If you read far enough back you will come on the question: "I bought this stuff marked such and such, what does it mean?"
Dates are specific but don't convey info about source and resulting inferences about alloy. Hardness is obvious, well semi-obvious. Source, not using obscure abbreviations is probably best, i.e., RANGE is better than RL.
I think it was here that I saw a holder for 1/4 inch stamps that would work, and the stamps are available at Harbor Freight or online.
Good luck, be careful and you may or may not be successful in scrapping the jackets for copper price.

[redhawk0]

Would you stamp dates, hardness, source?

I've done 400 lbs of indoor range lead. I have a pot that I can melt 200lbs at a time...so I melted two pots worth poured into ingots...and each pot got its own number stamped on it. When I am ready to alloy for casting, I mix equal weights from each of those 200# melts. This way all my alloy is consistent.

Anyway...you can stamp as much or as little as you like. I use PB for pure lead, RL for Range Lead, WW for Wheel Weights, L for Linotype...etc.

When I mix for an alloy it then gets stamped with a Lot number that matches the alloy calculator sheet that I made up the batch from. Its really all about record keeping at that point.

Get a set of letter/number stamps at Harbor Freight...they work great. Never use marker...it just rubs off over time.

redhawk

[Idz]

If this is going to be an ongoing smelting operation I advise you to make a dedicated setup. We use a cutoff propane tank surrounded by an insulated furnace wall. A weed burner fires underneath the pot which is set up on some bricks. Start the melt with a cold load and moisture and missed live rounds won't be a problem. Cover the pot and the target debris will pyrolyze and form a nice reducing atmosphere over the melting lead. When its melted scoop off the floating debris with a ladle strainer. We use 4 sets of Lee molds. Fill two molds and transfer them to a wet towel for cooling while filling the other set. Dump the ingots as soon as they solidify. Cooling is needed to maintain a reasonable production rate and keep the mold handles from burning. Be very careful not to let water drops get into the inside of the molds or you'll have a dramatic steam explosion (only happened once in 3000 ingots due to a careless operator). We wear P100 dust filter masks, safety glasses, leather shoes and gloves, cotton long sleeves and trousers and haven't had any injuries yet. Good Luck

[dwtim]

Don't forget to crush the "total metal jacket" bullets so the core is exposed before smelting.

It's probably good to have a scrap pot just for dirty range lead. The seasoned clerics of the silver stream tend to use large pots with burners, heavy-duty ingot molds, and get it all done at once. Unfortunately, I learned empirically, and I had to replace the crucible on my pot before it sunk in.

[GONRA]

GONRA experience suggests - be as careful as possible to keep SAND and other abrasive stuff out.
(Experts on this site will tell ya'll how to doit...)

LOVE to shoot homemade cast bullets - but only shoot JACKETED in my Ultra Shiny Bore Hammer Forged barrel auto pistols in my Reference Collection...

[lightman]

Would you stamp dates, hardness, source?

I would just make up a code for what alloy it is. Something like PB for soft lead, WW for wheel weights, ect. I try to stick with 2 letters but you can do more. Something like COWW for clip on weights, ect. I do put a tag an the bucket or milk crate with a batch code. I use the date like batch # 4-18-19. Hardness will change and source doesn't mean that much to me for the most part. Everyone has a method and you will soon develop one that works for you.

[kevin c]

Stamping with letter punches makes a permanent record on the ingot of what you want to know about it. It is time consuming, though, especially if you have a lot of ingots, big or small (big, of course, saves some labor per pound of alloy).

Some segregate different alloys by separate, labeled storage. Others use different ingot molds for each type. Some label each ingot. Some do a combination. It depends on how much alloy you have, how important the information is to you, and how much time and effort you're willing to expend.

[Huskerguy]

I don't have much to add to all of this. I too have access to all the indoor range lead I can haul out and melt down. I have several buckets along with some WW's just waiting for the fall to arrive. I have my equipment but not fully set up so I have some work yet to do. What I do know from some trials is the range lead from my range is full of all sorts of garbage. I would advise a big fan blowing things down wind of your pot. There is more foreign material in range lead than you can imagine. Mine has rubber shreds and lots of paper and it makes a lot of smoke you do not want to breath. I have heard of guys putting the scrap in a wheelbarrow filled with water and the light stuff floats to the top and they skim in off. Then they lay the lead and jackets out on the driveway to dry. The problem with this is water can hide in some jackets but it does eliminate a bunch of burning unnecessary stuff.

I mark mine with a black sharpie and have never had one rub off. I stack it in old ammo boxes so it is kept together. I label mine range lead, wheel weights or in one case, I had some lead from a former person I knew who cast some bullets. I also date is just to tell me how long ago it was when I poured the ingots. I also mix my WW lead with range lead so it is not very scientific but my guns have never complained. I both PC and LA my cast.

The PPE was talked about which I fully endorse, especially a good mask. Not a cheap dust mask, one that actually filters things. Cover your head and arms, garbage gets all over from emptying buckets and sorting. Do not have food or drink around. I am not a drinker but lots of guys buddy up and have to have the 12 pack handy when they do this. Plan how you are going to flux the lead and you should be set. Have fun and share some pictures with all of us.

[truckjohn]

Welcome to CB!

Melting range scrap. It's true that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.. And range scrap is very much a case of "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth". It's what's available - so you work with it and don't look back. Don't think about what might have been in a different world.

#1 consideration is that it takes a LOT of fuel. You have a giant pile of jacket material and other trash that will either float or burn off. It is very smoky and it generates a lot of dross you will have to scrape off. In your case - you will be burning chipped tires and have a lot of tire belt steel mixed in on top of the jackets. Have a couple big metal cans you can dump the jacket material and other trash into.

If you have access to free scrap wood or blow down branches - I would recommend doing it outside over a wood fire. Look at a few of the posts here on the subject for the setups people use. This is what I settled on doing after burning through a WHOLE bottle of propane on one single partial pot of range scrap... I just keep stirring and adding wood to the fire till it's all separated and ready to pour into ingots.

If not - a turkey fryer burner. Just be prepared to burn a LOT of gas in the process. There is a very good chance you go through over a full bottle of propane on your first melt.

#2 is that it takes a LONG time. It's hours of cooking this stuff to get all the lead melted and separated out of the jackets. Plan a whole saturday for your first go at it.

If you don't have ingot molds - scratch some grooves into the dirt and line them with tin foil. Pour the lead into these. Let it cool and shake out your ingots.

Absolutely be sure you have a quality pair of welding gloves and a face shield. This stuff can splatter, squirt, or pop - and believe me... Molten lead on your face is no fun.

Good luck and welcome aboard.

[Rcmaveric]

Welcome aboard. I use a lot of range scrap lead. Its my go too base alloy. Just be weary of a live a round.

Depending on how many jackets you have left over you might be able to scrap them for a decent penny.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[lightman]

I have seen several post mentioning range lead being slow to melt. I have not really noticed this, but I have a pretty big burner. The slowest thing I remember melting was reclaimed shot. The graphite and the oxidation insulated it and it melted slow. Real slow! My thermometer showed nearly 1000º on the lower part of the melt and the top was still slushy.

The next slowest thing I melted was lead from pole top pins. There simply was not much of the material in contact with the surface of the pot. I did put the whole bolt in the pot vs cutting the lead part off.

[Wild Bill 7]

I have a lot of range scrap to melt and I try to get all the extra stuff out of the scrap first. I pour the scrap in my shaker first and try to get as much sand, clay birds, wood scraps and other assorted trash out first. Makes for faster melting for me. Don't get in a hurry and have fun because that's what it is all about. Have one or two extra tanks on hand that helps also. JMTCW.

[lightman]

I have a lot of range scrap to melt and I try to get all the extra stuff out of the scrap first. I pour the scrap in my shaker first and try to get as much sand, clay birds, wood scraps and other assorted trash out first. Makes for faster melting for me. Don't get in a hurry and have fun because that's what it is all about. Have one or two extra tanks on hand that helps also. JMTCW.

Thats right! If you have the time, cleaner is defiantly better.

[redhawk0]

And don't forget to flux it....A LOT. Range scrap is REAL dirty. Use multiple fluxings of sawdust. 3-5 times...plus some wax fluxings. You will know when its truly clean. When you can stir and scrape the pot and have very little dross left....you're about there.

redhawk

[Venti30]

Thanks to all for taking the time to discuss indoor range scrap. I really appreciate it.

Someone posted above to search old posts, which I did but found many that were years old, and with advances in ammunition production etc, I thought it'd be relevant to get a fresh set of opinions. Thanks again to those taking the time.

Many great safety tips provided, and I'm grateful. Can't remind each other enough of how fast something can happen, and the best ways to keep safe.

Im travelling for a week or so, plan to discuss the timing of their next clean out with my home range, I suspect it'll be within the next month or so. At that point I'll start building out the melting gear.

Thank you all again for sharing your thoughts and expertise.

[tazman]

I had access to range scrap for several years but my source went away. While I was doing that, I smelted outside, using a smaller size stainless steel cooking pot/sauce pan on top of a camp stove that used the short, fat bottles of propane that you can buy from many different stores. It took a little longer but I had time and didn't need to buy anything new to make it work.

I would get around 75lb of good alloy out of a 100lb bucket of range scrap. Take that into consideration when you pay for it.

[Martin Luber]

Ours contains a lot of wood chips, paper, arrow fragments, and you name it. Very messy to melt and a bad smell to boot. Very high in oxides since most of it is splattered fragments.

I found easier sources than indoor range lead.

Good luck

[David2011]

Thanks to all for taking the time to discuss indoor range scrap. I really appreciate it.

Someone posted above to search old posts, which I did but found many that were years old, and with advances in ammunition production etc, I thought it'd be relevant to get a fresh set of opinions. Thanks again to those taking the time.

Many great safety tips provided, and I'm grateful. Can't remind each other enough of how fast something can happen, and the best ways to keep safe.

Im travelling for a week or so, plan to discuss the timing of their next clean out with my home range, I suspect it'll be within the next month or so. At that point I'll start building out the melting gear.

Thank you all again for sharing your thoughts and expertise.

Venti,

You’ll probably find that very little has changed with regard to cast boolits over the years. The old posts will still be valid. Sure, there are some newer powders. Trail Boss comes to mind but the old standbys like Bullseye, Unique and 2400 are still great choices. The only real change is powder coating. Casting, alloying, sizing and lubricating haven’t changed much in the past 100 years. Lubes are probably better but not that different. Someone will surely point out things I’m forgetting but that’s OK. I just got in from a 650 mile drive.