Winchester 1892 questions before buying...

[Kev18]

Ok so I went to a local gun store and the man had a Winchester 1892 for sale. Im not too familiar with this model but I noticed a few uncommon details that I'd need info on.

1. The rifle has Numrich Arms on the barrel. Instead of Winchester...?

2. On the receiver there is alot of markings next to the saddle ring. A bunch of letters and some type of number 0137. I thought it was the serial number at first or maybe it even looked like some type of military designation. I dont think these rifles were issued though, maybe they were.

3. Has a leather sling attached to the barrel band and on a sling mount on the side of the rear stock.

4. The serial number on the lower tang looks like it was engraved by a dremel or something. They put it horizontally across the tang instead of length wise like it should be. If I remember correctly it was 81XXX. Eighty one thousand something...

Keep in mind the rifle looks well used, the wood is appropriate to the rifle. Doesnt seem like it has been refurbished any time soon. The only thing thats interesting to me is the weird serial number and the markings on the receiver. I haven't seen that before. Hopefully someone knows what I mean.

[Nobade]

I wouldn't touch it unless it's nearly free and I was looking for a rifle project.

[Kev18]

I wouldn't touch it unless it's nearly free and I was looking for a rifle project.

Why. What happened to it?

[Shawlerbrook]

Sounds like a rebarreled gun at some point as Numrich is gun parts Corp. Mike Puzo who goes by twobit on various forums is an expert on 1892’s and has cataloged over 11,000 for his book. I would run this by him.
https://winchestercollector.org/forum/winchester-research-surveys/winchester-model-1892-all-rifle-survey/

[Nobade]

Why. What happened to it?Numrich barrels could be made by anybody and usually not so great. Serial number altered. That's enough to let you know it's a project rather than a rifle to buy and use.

[missionary5155]

Good evening
What caliber ? Some off brands made 30 years back were OK. Santa Fe was a brand I have seen and they worked. We have a Santa Fe 1873 and many of the parts (all the springs) interchange with a real Winchester.
What was the price ? We have minimal $$$'s in our Santa Fe and it shoots as good as most our 1873's in 44 WCF with a real tang sight and better front sight.

[Kev18]

Good evening
What caliber ? Some off brands made 30 years back were OK. Santa Fe was a brand I have seen and they worked. We have a Santa Fe 1873 and many of the parts (all the springs) interchange with a real Winchester.
What was the price ? We have minimal $$$'s in our Santa Fe and it shoots as good as most our 1873's in 44 WCF with a real tang sight and better front sight.

Its in 44-40. And I dont know the price. The gunsmith is gone hunting so He said i need to wait two or three weeks before he gets back. From what people are saying it seems like a project gun.

[Greg S]

I believe those Winchesters were imported by Numerich. Originally they were from a prison in South America and were issued to the guards. That is an older model, 1st gen I believe so the metal is pretty soft. Not a good candidate for a caliber swap.

[bob208]

there were a bunch of 92's came in for s.a. I saw a table full of them they were used hard.in the 60's numerich had replacement barrels for old Winchesters. they even had conversions of 92's in .38-40 and .44-40 to .44 mag.

I would not pay more it then a rossi

[OnHoPr]

92s were issued in Britain in the depots during WWI and/or WWII. A few of them may have seen Cuba.

[Kev18]

Im sure the guy will ask a ridiculous price for it. He said he would call after he had the gunsmith check them. Only issue is that the gunsmith left on a hunting trip. So I need to wait 2 weeks.

He put my name down for this rifle and a mossberg bolt action .410. I dont have really a use for one but if it is cheap enough il buy it. My dad and grandfather(his dad) used one for awhile. It has the adjustable choke on it. Thought it would just be a nice piece to have.

[Buckshot]

.............Some M92 Clones were foreign made and called 'El Tigre'. Quality varied. Google search: www.google.com/search q=winchester+1892+el+tigre&rlz=1C1CHWA_enUS631US631&oq=Winchester+1892+El+&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0.11584j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

..............Buckshot

[Texas by God]

Shouldn't the real serial number be on the bottom front of the action?

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[bob208]

yes it should. but that is a high wear area because it is the balance point. many of the s.a. reimports had worn numbers and they were restamped on the lower tang.

the more coming out about this rifle the less I would pay for it. some think just because it has Winchester on it is a gold bar rather then brass bar it is.

[KCSO]

The altered serial number is a felony stay clear of this one!!!!

[bob208]

if it was one of the English models. it would be stamped notenglishmade in one line.

[Kev18]

yes it should. but that is a high wear area because it is the balance point. many of the s.a. reimports had worn numbers and they were restamped on the lower tang.

the more coming out about this rifle the less I would pay for it. some think just because it has Winchester on it is a gold bar rather then brass bar it is.

The serial number was on the lower tang. Clearly done with some type of bad engraving tool.

[Nobade]

And the lower tang can be swapped out.

[indian joe]

And the lower tang can be swapped out.

yup! number on the lower tang means NOTHING
In our country a restramp is legal so long as it is done by a registered dealer and properly documented

[pietro]

I believe those Winchesters were imported by Numrich.

Originally they were from a prison in South America and were issued to the guards.

That is an older model, 1st gen I believe so the metal is pretty soft.

Not a good candidate for a caliber swap.





Please allow me to expand upon why this rifle shouldn't be touched with w 10" pole.

IF (and that's a big "if") it's a genuine Winchester 1892, AND the SN is as described, then whether it's the original serial numbers or not, the original SN's been altered - which is against US Federal Law to buy, sell, own or possess.


If it wasn't made by Winchester, and it came from S.A., it might have originally been an "El Tigre" (google it) Model 1892, which have a history of iffy quality .

.

[Texas by God]

The serial # must be on the FRAME in the U.S.A. If it is not, it is not a Winchester. Perhaps the Spanish El Tigre. Unless it is very inexpensive, I'd pass on it as well.

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[Kev18]

The upper tang had the WInchester 1892 stamp. Looks like a real one. Its just that the receiver had so many writings on it. I didnt mention it I think, but the rifle is a saddle ring carbine. Thats why I thought it could have been military related. The upper tang had Win model stamp but the barrel Had Numerich stamped.

[indian joe]

The upper tang had the WInchester 1892 stamp. Looks like a real one. Its just that the receiver had so many writings on it. I didnt mention it I think, but the rifle is a saddle ring carbine. Thats why I thought it could have been military related. The upper tang had Win model stamp but the barrel Had Numerich stamped.

proper serial number will be on the bottom of the action underneath the area where magazine is drilled through - its right at the carry point so is subject to wear .

[FergusonTO35]

If the rifle is a foreign clone, then the crude serial number on the tang might be the only one it has. Long guns in the USA weren't required to have the serial number on the receiver proper until 1968. My 1967 Marlin Glenfield 30 has it on the lower tang from the factory.

[indian joe]

If the rifle is a foreign clone, then the crude serial number on the tang might be the only one it has. Long guns in the USA weren't required to have the serial number on the receiver proper until 1968. My 1967 Marlin Glenfield 30 has it on the lower tang from the factory.

May not be "required" but Winchester stamped all the 92's I ever saw on the reciever bottom up front - right where they balance for carry - I have a couple of 5 digit early ones and also later versions same place - clones different? likely yes - but hes tellin us it has a clear Winchester stamp on the uppper tang so that part is correct - I have seen a couple with the numbers rubbed that faint they could barely be read - quite likely if it was a prison guard gun (carried eight or ten hours a day!)

[Kev18]

May not be "required" but Winchester stamped all the 92's I ever saw on the reciever bottom up front - right where they balance for carry - I have a couple of 5 digit early ones and also later versions same place - clones different? likely yes - but hes tellin us it has a clear Winchester stamp on the uppper tang so that part is correct - I have seen a couple with the numbers rubbed that faint they could barely be read - quite likely if it was a prison guard gun (carried eight or ten hours a day!)

Keep in mind the only winchester marking is on that tang... All other ones are non-present.

[indian joe]

Keep in mind the only winchester marking is on that tang... All other ones are non-present.

Kev
My 92's dont have anything else on the reciever
just the serial number underneath up front and the marking on the upper tang - that is in three lines 1-model 1892
2- Winchester 3 Patent blurb - ......barrel has calibre marking eg 32 WCF and then the Winchester barrel marking running longwise
If there is an issue with legality of serial number I would likely pass and spend the money on a Rossi at some point - but I think you like resurrecting originals?

[Texas by God]

The dealer will enter whatever # he finds on the 4473 form. Look hard at the normal serial# location- no evidence of grinding/sanding? I don't believe handling wear could completely remove the deep factory stamping. Go back and take lots of pics for us curious types.


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[Kev18]

The dealer will enter whatever # he finds on the 4473 form. Look hard at the normal serial# location- no evidence of grinding/sanding? I don't believe handling wear could completely remove the deep factory stamping. Go back and take lots of pics for us curious types.


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Il ask for pics if possible. People have different opinions on pictures. Especially at gun shows. I dont know what can happen when I take a picture but people are quite reluctant sometimes. Il also look for the serial number on the receiver.

[jonp]

I wouldn't touch it unless it's nearly free and I was looking for a rifle project.

Nobade for the win. Might be an interesting shooter but your spidey sense was correct that something was off. Buy if it you get a good price but remember you are getting what you pay for.

I've bought a couple of these. Some shot really good, some not so much but none I would consider worth a great deal.

[Thin Man]

It sounds like everyone has decided this rifle falls into the "shooter" class rather than the "collector" class. While waiting for the gunsmith to return, ask the seller if he would go with you to a range where you can cycle a few rounds through the rifle to determine that it will fire and function properly. Just that information should be determined before you have any serious intentions about buying it.

[Kev18]

It sounds like everyone has decided this rifle falls into the "shooter" class rather than the "collector" class. While waiting for the gunsmith to return, ask the seller if he would go with you to a range where you can cycle a few rounds through the rifle to determine that it will fire and function properly. Just that information should be determined before you have any serious intentions about buying it.

I shoot everything I have. I own a few expensive rifles, and I shoot all of them. I wont own anything I wont shoot. I was interested in the rifle because it was a saddle ring carbine. It looked cool from far. Once it got in my hands though I had a change of thought.

And I wish I could go to a range but thats not possible. None in my area. And I dont think anyone around here or in this country even does that. That's more of an American thing I feel like ;) No gun stores have ranges in proximity, not in my area atleast.

In the mean time Im shooting what I have!
https://i.imgur.com/nJ10NpK.jpg