starting to cast

[weeple2000]

I couldn't find exactly the right sub for this so I posted it here. Mods - if there was a better place let me know.

I bought the following items to start casting:

Lee HG 68 clone 45 acp mold (6 cavity) & handles
Lee C309-200-R mold
Lee 420 pot
Lee ladle

40 lbs linotype from eBay

used coleman camp stove
lodge cast iron pan
lodge cornbread pan (2 - the corn cob type)
Stainless ladle, spoon and spatula (set for cooking)

Face shield
Welding apron, gloves, and arm covers

I picked up range lead from my club on two occasions. I got 22.2 lbs the first trip, and 44.8 lbs the second trip.

Before I started the real activities tonight, I cleaned my molds. I used 70% alcohol in the cavities. I then lubed the molds with antiseize. I also smoked them with a bic lighter. I did not use them however. I intended to cast ingots with the range lead. I am thinking that I will add linotype to the range lead to increase the tin when I am casting the bullets. For the rifle, I am thinking that I will probably cast an alloy 50% range lead 50% linotype for hunting. I might do another alloy with a different load for plinking. For my 45 bullseye loads, I think it would be best to keep the bullets as soft as possible but have them still cast well. Should I use the linotype for this? Or should I pick up some pewter? I did buy some Alox for tumble lubing. I also have a convection oven specifically for casting. I am not sure if I will powder coat or tumble lube.

I have been avoiding doing this, probably fearing the unknown a bit. I wasn't sure how much time I needed to invest. Tonight I bit the bullet. I didn't want to bite off more than I could chew, so all I did was cast the ingots. It took me about an hour. I went through almost all of the 22.2 lbs from my first trip to the range. I wound up with 11.6 lbs of ingots. I didn't get all of the lead out of my pan. I figured it was OK to leave it in there, next time I thought it might cut down on my melting time. Am I right about that?

I did this in my garage, with the door open. A guy at my club told me I might be alright without a fan. I did not use a fan, but I think I will need one for next time. I am wondering if I have a headache from fumes. I wasn't sure when to flux. The bottom of my pan was liquid after everything melted. The top never melted. As I saw the pile of solids reduce, I was using my ladle to add more solids to the top of it. I wanted to have enough liquid when I was done that I would be able to fill both of my corn bread pans. I filled one entirely, and half of the second. I used my spatula to get the solids off of the top. I had seen FortuneCookie45LC do this in his video. When I got the solids out, I am wondering how much unmelted lead I took with it. I used an old candle for flux. I cut a bit off of it 3 separate times. The first 2 times I added it to the top of the solids. The last time the pan had mainly liquid in it. I did stir a bit when I fluxed, but it was difficult when the solids were in the pan. I wish I had taken some photos of what I was doing while I was doing it. But I was a little concerned about the safety at the time having not done this before.

I have a question for those of you that are concerned about lead exposure. There are a number of guys at my club that get their lead levels checked. A lot of them have been high. From what I understand, the risk is due to inhaling the lead while you are shooting. The primer contains lead, and it becomes a cloud of dust when you shoot. I have been showering after shooting. If I shoot indoors, I immediately take my clothes off when I come home, and shower. I have a one year old daughter. If I shoot outdoors, I am slightly less concerned about it. But either way, I will shower, and not wear the clothes again unless I am shooting. The lead contaminated clothes are washed separate from the rest of my laundry. If you are the type to check your lead levels - do you take any precautions when casting? If so, what are they?

They say a picture is worth a thousand words, so I'll include the ones I took. If anyone has any tips for me I'm all ears. I did read From Ingot to Target a while ago. I have also read a fair amount online and watched a number of videos on youtube, prior to their new TOS.

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229780
229781

[Oily]

IMHO you are not getting a good flux with the candle wax. I use sawdust or pine shavings for pet bedding. I used to use chainsaw shavings from my native blackjack trees on my property but alas I can't run a chainsaw anymore. The carbon from the wood will get you a good flux and float the debris to the top as you stir it in. You don't need any lino for your 45 ACP range scrap is fine as long as you have the boolits sized 1 to 2 thousands over bore size. If they will fit that big in your chamber. Load up a dummy round and see if it will plunck into your barrel. You may have to taper crimp to get a good consistent round.

[GregLaROCHE]

First due you know how hot you are getting your lead. From the looks and and what you are saying, it may not be hot enough. You need to flux more. Sawdust works well, but a lot of other stuff too. Make certain whatever you use, it’s 100% dry. Stir in well to the bottom and all around. I flux range scrap twice with sawdust, when making ingots and once with sawdust and then once with wax for casting boolits. I prefer bee’s wax.

Are you melting your lead inside or outside? I would never melt inside, especially if I had a young child. I know some people do on their kitchen stove, if they have an exhaust fan. Outside is a lot safer. If there is a breeze, you won’t need a fan, as long as you stay up wind. If there isn’t breeze a fan is recommended. A lot of people use a respirator to be exta safe. I do because I have had problems with lead. Don’t eat, drink or smoke while working with melted lead or handling lead boolits.

The risk of lead poisoning from primers is usually associated with ranges where there is a high number of shots fired at the same time. This is much worse in indoor ranges where the ventilation is often not adequate. Get your lead levels checked regularly.

Good luck.

[GregLaROCHE]

I just reread your post. Pure lead is the best for hunting, because it mushrooms the best. Tin (what’s in pewter) helps the mold fill better and can increase hardness a little to a point. Antimony (found in linotype) is what makes the boolit hard. Water quenching will also harden boolits.

Hardness is needed when you want to make the boolit go faster. I suggest you start with your range scrap first, see how well your boolits turn out and start researching about hardness and boolit velocities.

You will need to know what the hardness of your range scrap is. Most is less than 12 BHN, but mine turned out being 16, because I Collected range scrap from a 25 yard range where most shot pistols with hard lead boolits. There are a lot of hardness testers for sale. To start out there is a simple test using different pencil lead hardness. Search for it in the search box on the homepage.

Using a skillet is not the easiest way to melt and pour lead. A Dutch oven with a bail, makes it a lot easier to pickup and pour the heavy lead. However, you can clip a pair of vise grips on the opposite side of the handle and it makes it a lot easier to handle.

[tazman]

For the 45acp, the range scrap by itself should be hard enough to shoot well. It is for me. If it doesn't work as well for you, you can "sweeten" it using a little of your linotype. Maybe 1-2 pounds in the 4-20 pot per each pot full of range scrap.
You could also drop the boolits directly from the mold into a container of water. This will harden the boolits and sometimes makes them work better in a particular gun. I do this with all the boolits I cast as a regular thing.
For the rifle, you need to red other posts. I have no experience casting for rifles at this point.
I try to always melt my range scrap down(smelting) into ingots outdoors because of the fumes. I do my casting indoors with a small fan blowing a very gentle breeze(just enough for some air movement, not a wind) across the top of my pot and work area to keep the fumes if any away from me. I do this in a location where any small children will not be playing or messing around.
As long as there is air movement across the top of the pot in a direction away from you you should have no problems.

[WHITETAIL]

Good going!
I have always smelted in the garage.
All I do is add a box fan at the other end of the
garage.
That is just enough to blow the smoke+ all else
out the door and away from me smelting.:castmine:

[WHITETAIL]

:pAlso welcome to the world of smelting.
And may all your boolets shoot in the same hole.

[farmbif]

welcome to the world of casting, a great rewarding hobby

here is some of the best info available

http://www.lasc.us/ArticleIndex.htm

[RU shooter]

A candle will work fine for fluxing really all I ever used ,heck lots of stuff can and has been used can't say any one is better than the others . Next time you smelt skim off most of the floating crud with a big slotted spoon so the alloy can drain out of the crud your skimming off some . Throw in your flux of choice and use a paint stir stick and scrape the bottom and sides well and more crud will float , skim and repeat

[lightman]

Welcome to Cast Boolits and to casting!
It sounds like you are off to a good start. Your range scrap should work fine in a 45. If not, you could add a small amount of your linotype. I would stay with the pistol caliber until you get comfortable with the process before starting with the rifle.

I cast and smelt in my shop. When smelting I run the exhaust fan and work up wind of the smelting pot. I don't run the fan when casting but I do have both the overhead and walk in doors open. I'm careful not to rub my eyes, lips, and such after handling lead. I also don't smoke or eat while casting or smelting. I don't have small children anymore but I would keep them away from my casting and smelting area. You may be a little overkill with your clothing and such but caution is always good.

The easiest way to learn this hobby is to have a mentor. The next best way is like you are doing. Start by reading, like you have done. Then start small and see what works and what doesn't. Feel free to ask questions.

[reddog81]

I would smelt outside. I cast in my garage but smelting is too dirty to do in an enclosed space. Leaving 5 to the 10 pounds in your smelting pot is a good idea. Leaving a couple of pounds in the Lee 20 pound furnace is also a good idea.

I would recommend adding a pound or 2 of Linotype to the range scrap when casting 45 ACP bullets. If you aren't getting good fill out you might also have to get some tin/pewter and throw a couple of ounces of that in.

Using a paint stir stick or something similar to stir the smelting lead will help seperate out all the crud. If the lead mix is somewhat solid you need more heat. Using a lid will help retain heat in the pot.

[GuyKickinit]

Does the wind effect your temps? I was thinking of doing it just at the entrance of the garage. Getting some sustained breezes up to 17 mph. My burner has a wind shroud, but it will be no taller than the dutch oven.

[weeple2000]

I just reread your post. Pure lead is the best for hunting, because it mushrooms the best. Tin (what’s in pewter) helps the mold fill better and can increase hardness a little to a point. Antimony (found in linotype) is what makes the boolit hard. Water quenching will also harden boolits.

Hardness is needed when you want to make the boolit go faster. I suggest you start with your range scrap first, see how well your boolits turn out and start researching about hardness and boolit velocities.

You will need to know what the hardness of your range scrap is. Most is less than 12 BHN, but mine turned out being 16, because I Collected range scrap from a 25 yard range where most shot pistols with hard lead boolits. There are a lot of hardness testers for sale. To start out there is a simple test using different pencil lead hardness. Search for it in the search box on the homepage.

Using a skillet is not the easiest way to melt and pour lead. A Dutch oven with a bail, makes it a lot easier to pickup and pour the heavy lead. However, you can clip a pair of vise grips on the opposite side of the handle and it makes it a lot easier to handle.

I did pick up a set of staedtler pencils. I tried two ingots that I made. I think they might be slightly different hardness. They are on the softer side though, I think what you would expect from typical range scrap. My club is shooting a centerfire league right now. I am hoping I can make it there a couple times to grab the scrap before the league ends. I suspect there will be a greater volume of scrap until the league ends in a couple weeks..

<edit> I tested all of the ingots. I believe that 5 of them are BHN 9 and the other 6 are BHN 10. They scratched with the 4B and 3B pencils. I also tried to scratch my linotype. I wasn't able to scratch it with any of my pencils, even up to 4H. </edit>

[weeple2000]

Good going!
I have always smelted in the garage.
All I do is add a box fan at the other end of the
garage.
That is just enough to blow the smoke+ all else
out the door and away from me smelting.:castmine:

I am going to try this first. I like the idea of having something over my head besides the sky in case it rains.

[weeple2000]

welcome to the world of casting, a great rewarding hobby

here is some of the best info available

http://www.lasc.us/ArticleIndex.htm

I did grab Ingot to Target from that page, I will have to check out the rest of it. Any other suggestions as to what to read next?

[tazman]

Does the wind effect your temps? I was thinking of doing it just at the entrance of the garage. Getting some sustained breezes up to 17 mph. My burner has a wind shroud, but it will be no taller than the dutch oven.

Winds that high will effect everything. You need to block that wind as much as possible. All you want is a light breeze(3-5 mph if you can manage.
In windy conditions, I smelt in the doorway of my garage. The heavy breezes dpn't effect much that way.

[weeple2000]

I would smelt outside. I cast in my garage but smelting is too dirty to do in an enclosed space. Leaving 5 to the 10 pounds in your smelting pot is a good idea. Leaving a couple of pounds in the Lee 20 pound furnace is also a good idea.

I would recommend adding a pound or 2 of Linotype to the range scrap when casting 45 ACP bullets. If you aren't getting good fill out you might also have to get some tin/pewter and throw a couple of ounces of that in.

Using a paint stir stick or something similar to stir the smelting lead will help seperate out all the crud. If the lead mix is somewhat solid you need more heat. Using a lid will help retain heat in the pot.

Just the top was solid. I used a slotted spatula to grab the stuff off of the top. I know there were a lot of jackets in it. But I am wondering how much unmelted lead came off with it. You can see the material on the cookie sheet here. That is everything that came out of the 22 lbs that I did.

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[tazman]

When I smelt range scrap, I get approximately 65-75% good alloy with the rest being dirt and jackets. It always looks like there is some lead in the scrap but it would be very difficult to reclaim.
I many ways, my smelting setup mirrors yours. I use a gas camp stove burner and a slotted spoon. The only real difference is I use a steel pan instead of a skillet.
I have used the pan so much that I finally burned the handle off it. I have to use a big set of channel locks to move it now.

[GregLaROCHE]

I did grab Ingot to Target from that page, I will have to check out the rest of it. Any other suggestions as to what to read next?

Get a copy of Lyman’s Cast Bullet Hadbook. There’s lots of good basic stuff in it.

Also think about getting your work area up to table top height. It will make things a lot easier.

[RED BEAR]

sounds like you are set-up pretty well. i don't smelt until completely melted. wax is not for smelting!! you smelt with something like sawdust . sawdust removes impurities and wax combines your alloy back to geather. i only have one pot so i smelt and use sawdust clean the pot and use wax for casting. i used my garage for years with the door open. now have a dedicated spot with fan in window behind pot to suck fumes out. as far as being worried about lead poisoning i think the danger is hyped way to much. it is my understanding that lead almost has to boil to give off fumes. i did have a high level reading after smelting over 1000 pounds of scrap lead and i drank coffe ate snacks and basically took no precautions . had to leave it alone or a month before levels came back to normal. had a brother that really did have lead poisoning got a month and a half stay in hospital he was a industrial painter. i like lee equipment it has preformed good for me over the years.

[mjwcaster]

Looking good.
Yes winds that strong will screw up your temps.
If you have enough burner it might still smelt but will really mess with casting.
I found that out when I used to cast outside on a 2 burner Coleman.
Casting at below freezing wasn’t bad on a still day, but 60 and breezy could be very hard to maintain temperatures.

I now cast in the garage on the same stove.
A fan blowing at the casting pot really messes with temperatures.

I still smelt outside, just too much nasty smoke, but my range scrap still has dirt after washing and lots of little clay pieces.

While I use a cast iron Dutch oven to smelt I was never comfortable with that much weight on the stove, too easy to get too much weight.
If you get a larger pot look into reinforcing the stove.
Depending on what model stove you have, the burner will handle a large pot, if you have patience.

I would also try casting the range scrap by itself, unless the cases size the bullets down just lube shoot and enjoy.

I have only been at this a few years, have reclaimed and cast 4-500lbs of range scrap, mostly in 45acp.
Just ran into a batch that is too soft for me, bullets size down in the case under .450.
It still worked fine in 380, and might even bump up, I haven’t tried shooting any yet, gave them a couple of months to make sure they wouldn’t age harden.

I plan on sweeting some with some harder lead I have, I have 80-90lbs to use up.

I think 45 is a great caliber to start with, much easier than 9mm.

Have fun and be safe.


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[Petander]

Welcome to the club,you have a nice setup there.

I started with a one cavity Lee 45-70 mold,just out of curiosity. "Can I really make shootable bullets by myself"? Outside on open fire with a ladle."Big savings", I thought. Made 1000 bullets right away.

" Big savings" can change if you get hooked like many do. You'll end up buying interesting moulds and guns just to cast for them. :)

Casting is a great hobby,keep it relaxed,good luck!

[weeple2000]

When I smelt range scrap, I get approximately 65-75% good alloy with the rest being dirt and jackets. It always looks like there is some lead in the scrap but it would be very difficult to reclaim.
I many ways, my smelting setup mirrors yours. I use a gas camp stove burner and a slotted spoon. The only real difference is I use a steel pan instead of a skillet.
I have used the pan so much that I finally burned the handle off it. I have to use a big set of channel locks to move it now.

Can you sell the jackets to a recycler? I thought I read somewhere that the jackets you clean out of your range scrap will more than pay for your fuel. But with all the **** that came out of the scrap alongside the jackets, it's hard to tell that there's anything of value there. I do know that there were a ton of jackets though because I saw them throughout the whole process. They just don't look as clean now as they did when they went into the pan.

[weeple2000]

Get a copy of Lyman’s Cast Bullet Hadbook. There’s lots of good basic stuff in it.

Also think about getting your work area up to table top height. It will make things a lot easier.

I intended to use a folding table when I'm casting the actual bullets. Depending on how that goes, I might use it for the scrap as well. I am just a bit worried that the table won't be as stable as the ground when I'm cleaning the range scrap.

Life is full of compromises. My work area is where my wife parks her car in the garage. I have to back her car out. I left her car out last night but cleaned up the area tonight when I was done. I cleaned the rest of the scrap I had. I wound up with a total 48 lbs of clean ingots from an original 67 lbs of scrap. That worked out to be about 72% of the original weight.

[weeple2000]

sounds like you are set-up pretty well. i don't smelt until completely melted. wax is not for smelting!! you smelt with something like sawdust . sawdust removes impurities and wax combines your alloy back to geather. i only have one pot so i smelt and use sawdust clean the pot and use wax for casting. i used my garage for years with the door open. now have a dedicated spot with fan in window behind pot to suck fumes out. as far as being worried about lead poisoning i think the danger is hyped way to much. it is my understanding that lead almost has to boil to give off fumes. i did have a high level reading after smelting over 1000 pounds of scrap lead and i drank coffe ate snacks and basically took no precautions . had to leave it alone or a month before levels came back to normal. had a brother that really did have lead poisoning got a month and a half stay in hospital he was a industrial painter. i like lee equipment it has preformed good for me over the years.

I am not sure about the dangers with casting. I know that the danger isn't related to inhaling the fumes, because the lead doesn't get hot enough to be fumes. However the bucket of range scrap had a lot of dust, so that could contaminate my work area, clothes and such. As far as shooting, our indoor range doesn't have good ventilation. I know we have had shooters with very high lead levels just from shooting at our range. I got my lead levels checked about a year ago. I am going to do it again in a couple months.

[weeple2000]

Looking good.
Yes winds that strong will screw up your temps.
If you have enough burner it might still smelt but will really mess with casting.
I found that out when I used to cast outside on a 2 burner Coleman.
Casting at below freezing wasn’t bad on a still day, but 60 and breezy could be very hard to maintain temperatures.

I now cast in the garage on the same stove.
A fan blowing at the casting pot really messes with temperatures.

I still smelt outside, just too much nasty smoke, but my range scrap still has dirt after washing and lots of little clay pieces.

While I use a cast iron Dutch oven to smelt I was never comfortable with that much weight on the stove, too easy to get too much weight.
If you get a larger pot look into reinforcing the stove.
Depending on what model stove you have, the burner will handle a large pot, if you have patience.

I would also try casting the range scrap by itself, unless the cases size the bullets down just lube shoot and enjoy.

I have only been at this a few years, have reclaimed and cast 4-500lbs of range scrap, mostly in 45acp.
Just ran into a batch that is too soft for me, bullets size down in the case under .450.
It still worked fine in 380, and might even bump up, I haven’t tried shooting any yet, gave them a couple of months to make sure they wouldn’t age harden.

I plan on sweeting some with some harder lead I have, I have 80-90lbs to use up.

I think 45 is a great caliber to start with, much easier than 9mm.

Have fun and be safe.


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I shoot bullseye competitively, so that's why I am casting 45's. I hate to say it but if I'm not shooting in a league I'm pretty much not shooting. Hopefully that will change now that I'm casting. I am wanting to get back to my range to grab more scrap. I need to show up an hour before close, shoot until it's closed, then grab the scrap before I leave.

[weeple2000]

I have one other question. I'd like as many people to weigh in on this as possible as I suspect there might be differing opinions. When you're adding to your pot, either when cleaning for ingots or casting bullets, do you turn off your heat so that your lead becomes solid? From what I understand, moisture is a big problem. The only way to be 100% safe about it would be to start out from solid every time you introduce new material, wouldn't it?

[Dusty Bannister]

I will address only one of the two topics you mentioned. When casting, you are adding clean ingots. Since you are in the colder areas, you should make it a practice to start with a cold pot and put in whatever ingots you need to fill the pot, and then bring the pot up to casting temperature. That will give you plenty of time for any moisture to evaporate before the alloy becomes liquid.

NEXT AND IMPORTANT, is to preheat ALL of your utensils so that they are hot when you dip into the melt. HOT not just warm or room temp, because you might have moisture condense on the surface of the metal tools. You should preheat your ingots for two reasons. One is to not add such cold ingots so as to cause the alloy to drop too much in temperature. Secondly, to make absolutely certain that no condensed moisture is on the ingot. If you can pick them up with bare hands, it is not hot enough to put in the pot. This will keep the tinsel fairy away. Most times we can get away with adding room temp ingots, but in the cold weather, you are betting and it is very painful to lose that bet. Dry ingots to a fluid casting pot is not going to be a problem. Just be sure there is no moisture in the ingots by preheating them sufficiently. BE SAFE.

[sureYnot]

I add ladles full of scrap to a hot pot. But I'm careful about it. I position the ladle over the pot and then place the blade of my shovel over that and dump it in. The only part of me that could possibly get hit is my leather gloved hand. Every once in a while I hear something "ting" against the shovel blade.

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[weeple2000]

I add ladles full of scrap to a hot pot. But I'm careful about it. I position the ladle over the pot and then place the blade of my shovel over that and dump it in. The only part of me that could possibly get hit is my leather gloved hand. Every once in a while I hear something "ting" against the shovel blade.

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If you look at my setup in the OP, my skillet doesn't have enough room to absorb a ton of scrap. After I put a ladle or two into it, I'd be adding scrap to the top of the pile. I figured that I'd probably be safe if the stuff on the top had moisture because it would dry before it melted. Or am I playing with fire? Here is a thought - what if I preheated my scrap in my toaster oven?

[tazman]

Can you sell the jackets to a recycler? I thought I read somewhere that the jackets you clean out of your range scrap will more than pay for your fuel. But with all the **** that came out of the scrap alongside the jackets, it's hard to tell that there's anything of value there. I do know that there were a ton of jackets though because I saw them throughout the whole process. They just don't look as clean now as they did when they went into the pan.

Probably, but I have never tried so I can't confirm anything about that part.

When I add lead to the pot to cast, I set the ingot on the top edge of the pot until I am sure it is dry. I failed to do that a couple of times and got a visit from the tinsel fairy.
When smelting, I always empty my smelting pot of all liquid metal before starting a new batch. I have had moist range scrap get hostile with me a few times. If I still have a pile sticking up above the liquid metal, I may carefully put some on top of the pile so it can dry while heating up.

[sureYnot]

If you look at my setup in the OP, my skillet doesn't have enough room to absorb a ton of scrap. After I put a ladle or two into it, I'd be adding scrap to the top of the pile. I figured that I'd probably be safe if the stuff on the top had moisture because it would dry before it melted. Or am I playing with fire? Here is a thought - what if I preheated my scrap in my toaster oven?I used to preheat in my oven and figured it would be dry and therefore safe. One day I was processing scrap and, after clearing the junk, added another ladle of material. I stepped to the side for something. Can't remember what for. Almost instantly a stream of lead squirted (presumably from a TMJ?) for about three seconds, right where my face used to be. Moisture isn't the ONLY concern. It's a big one though. When casting, I also preheat my ingots on the edge of the pot until they're hot enough I need a tool to pick them up, as others have stated. Most important thing to take away from my earlier post is not what I'm able to get away with but rather those "tings" against the shovel blade.

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[mjwcaster]

I always try to start from a cold pot, either casting or smelting.
When the lead is low it doesn’t take much time for it to start slushing up and solidify, so I run on the better safe than sorry side of things.
Even if I move to an electric casting pot I will probably premelt on the Coleman.
And definitely watch your utensils.

I haven’t met the tinsel fairy yet but I sure have had some bubbling from cold/moist utensils when I haven’t been thinking.
If I am smart I usually just float the spoon or ladle on the top of the melt for a bit before submerging, and still submerge slowly.

I do add sprues back to the pot, I figure they are dry/warm enough still.

And I like the Dutch oven while smelting because of the top.
As has been mentioned jacketed bullets can shoot a stream of molten lead a long way, further than you would think.
I used to play with the pot a lot while smelting, stirring and using a propane torch to try and speed things up.
Had many bullets start shooting lead.
Now days I just fill it up, put the top on and just let it cook, checking occasionally when I think it might be melted.
I also flux with sawdust a time or two before removing jackets.
The smelting and higher temps / longer soak time make for much cleaner jackets, so more lead for me.

Some of the bullets will still be intact, full of lead.
You can beat them into submission after they cool down with a big freaking hammer or sledge.
I don’t really bother with them any more, too much like work, easier to just grab another shovel full of scrap.
But most of mine smelt fine, they get crushed enough in the berm, so I am loosing a tiny amount.
And I can just return the solid ones to the berm to get shot up some more to be harvested next time.



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[Traffer]

From the pictures...if you do it in the garage make sure the door is open and you do it right in front of the open door. Your tools are too big. I use a cheap chrome clip rail from 3/8" sockets to both stir and skim. That may be a bit small but those big spoons are just too big.
Other than that, You are way over prepared. This is not rocket science. Melt lead > pour in mold > open mold> shake out boolits...Repeat. The rest will come to you. It is like a baby learning to walk. "it will come to you" You don't have to study the physics of sprinting to learn to walk.
And Welcome to Castboolits.

[Wayne Smith]

Couple of issues - and you have a good start.
1) go to your thrift store and get a 1QT stainless steel pot - doesn't even have to have a handle, you will eventually burn it off. This gives you some depth of melt to work with. DO NOT get an aluminum pot, they will leak.
2) There is a difference between cleaning lead and returning the tin oxide back to the melt. Sawdust does a good job of cleaning the lead. Once it is clean the tin oxidizes first and floats to the top. Wax is good for reducing this back into the melt, you don't want to lose it.
3) If you are planning to use this setup for casting as well you definitely need a deeper pot. Either a Lyman or RCBS ladle is the other major thing you need - forget the Lee ladle.
4) Ingots should be clean alloy. When casting you only need to reduce the tin, and using wax causes smoke and a stink unless you light it and let it burn off.

[lightman]

I have one other question. I'd like as many people to weigh in on this as possible as I suspect there might be differing opinions. When you're adding to your pot, either when cleaning for ingots or casting bullets, do you turn off your heat so that your lead becomes solid? From what I understand, moisture is a big problem. The only way to be 100% safe about it would be to start out from solid every time you introduce new material, wouldn't it?

I never add material to molten lead when I'm smelting. I'll turn the flame down until the lead hardens and dump the new material on top. I'll skim the wheel weight clips or bullet jackets off with a slotted skimmer before adding material. It does not have to be cold, you just don't want the new material to be able to sink below the surface. Moisture will evaporate before the new material melts.

I will add new material to molten lead when I'm casting. But, I'm careful! I preheat the ingots either on the edge of my pot or on a hot plate. They will be hot enough that I'll have to use a tool to handle them. I also add them slowly and I make it a point to not be facing the pot.

Dusty makes a good point. Moisture can be present on your tools also. Spoons and ladles seem to be worse than flat tools but you should preheat your tools also.

I don't use very much range scrap but when I did I used a pot with a cover. I always worried about a FMJ bullet having moisture in it or a fully enclosed jacket exploding. I have often found live rounds or duds in range scrap!

When I smelt wheel weights I'll over fill the pot where they are really heaped up. After they are melted I'll turn the heat down and stir them around and then skim off the clips. After the molten lead hardens I'll add more weights. After I skim the clips from this batch I'll flux with sawdust and then with wax. You may not need to reload the pot with range scrap but wheel weight are bulky and I do it this way to get a full pot of molten lead.

[GuyKickinit]

The total metal jackets were a question I had as well. I was cutting them open to expose the lead. Is this necessary? or do most just toss as scrap floating? Is it worth the work?

[sureYnot]

The total metal jackets were a question I had as well. I was cutting them open to expose the lead. Is this necessary? or do most just toss as scrap floating? Is it worth the work?I find it easier to smash with a hammer than to cut them.

Sent from my XT1710-02 using Tapatalk

[WRideout]

A candle will work fine for fluxing really all I ever used ,heck lots of stuff can and has been used can't say any one is better than the others . Next time you smelt skim off most of the floating crud with a big slotted spoon so the alloy can drain out of the crud your skimming off some . Throw in your flux of choice and use a paint stir stick and scrape the bottom and sides well and more crud will float , skim and repeat

One of the best things I ever used for flux was rancid vegetable oil I salvaged from the kitchen. Any more, I flux with used motor oil. It seems like oil helps the lead release from the copper jackets; just my observation.

When I smelt range scrap, I use a dollar store slotted spoon to skim the jackets and crud off the top of the melt. When it's cooled down, I will hand sort to pick out the "clean" jackets to go in a separate coffee can. The ones with lead still in them go into a remelt pile, and the ones that are fully jacketed I cut open with a hammer and chisel before I put them in the remelt. A coffee can full of discard brass and jackets goes for about $5.00 at the scrap yard here, so don't throw them away.

Wayne

[Chainsaw.]

You are doing it right. Someday you may consider a bigger burner, but its not necessary at the moment being you are getting stuff done.

My biggest concern is your kiddo, lead in the adult body at low levels is pretty benign, for a kid a small amount can really screw up their brain and nervous system. For her sake I would do this outside, the farther away from where she might olay some day the better. And clean up, thoroughly.

[WHITETAIL]

when I smelt a new dirty batch of lead.
I go through it and if there are any FMJ in the
batch all I do is put them in my vice and squeeze.
with them being half in and half out it realy breaks
the jacket and no problem with a lead squirt:holysheep

[fredj338]

Just the top was solid. I used a slotted spatula to grab the stuff off of the top. I know there were a lot of jackets in it. But I am wondering how much unmelted lead came off with it. You can see the material on the cookie sheet here. That is everything that came out of the 22 lbs that I did.

229798

Flux like crazy when smelting. This will return most of the lead that wants to stick to the jackets. I use plain sawdust, seems to work best & doesn't catch fire like petro products.
For most handgun, range scrap works just fine. For rifle, straight lino or 2-1 lino/scrap & water drop.
Any open base fmj scrap will melt just fine. plated bullets I tend to smash a bit to make them easier to melt. I have had them pop if left whole. A lid or just foil on top of the melting pot helps heat things up & any splatter from something popping will stay put.

[weeple2000]

An update. I got my pot and mold out tonight. I didn't have much time but wanted to at least try to cast a couple bullets. I don't think I was at it long enough to heat my mold to the proper temperature. I melted 11 corn bread ingots into my 420 pot. I cast a handful of bullets, here is a pic. Am I correct that I need to get my mold hotter? Should I dump all of these back into the pot?

I filled the first couple cavities first, then the first 3, then 4, then 5, then all 6. I understand that is a good way to heat up your mold. I didn't expect to actually produce anything tonight, it was a learning experience.

230055

[tazman]

You are correct. The mold needs to be hotter and perhaps the alloy as well.
Way too many wrinkles.

[fredj338]

I cast about 700deg, about 8 on your Lee, range scrap. Just get the mold up to temp. If you do not have a hot plate, setting on top of the pot while the lead melts will get you close. Then start casting as you did, the Lee handle is pretty weak & you can snap them off trying to get all 6cavs open on a cold that isn't up to temp. You are headed in the right direction though.[smilie=w:

[weeple2000]

I might look for a hotplate then. I took another attempt today, I think I got some keepers. I wanted to try out my C309-200-R. I thought it would be a good idea to have a few soft bullets. I figured I can do some gallery loads. I also wanted a soft one to slug my rifle barrel. I watched a video of FortuneCookie45LC giving some tips. I learned to read the sprue temp, that it should cool in about 4 seconds.

230139

[David2011]

There was a comment earlier about the temperature at which lead boils/vaporizes. Lead starts giving off vapors at around 1100 F depending on the alloy but the boiling point is well above 3700 F. — like it matters if it’s a little or a lot over 3700 degrees. That’s well above the melting point of steel.

[Walks]

You guys have a lot more time & patience then I do. I gave up on range lead more then 25yrs ago. I just didn't have time to melt down range lead and clean it up enough to mix into shootable alloy. And there has been no available wheel weights around here in about 20yrs. I just buy it, here and other places. Mix what alloys I need in a Dutch oven over a old turkey burner.

I put an inverted ingot mold over the top of my bottom pour pot after I've fluxed. It keeps the heat in, some of the oxidation out. I put ingots on top to warm up. I also turn down my hot plate that heats up my molds and rest ingots on that to heat up. Drop them in the 3/4 empty pot with channel locks. From the side, I lean back far too. Experience counts, learned the hard way.

I flux my casting pot with cheap candles from the dollar store, sprinkle the top heavy with sawdust.

My alloy mixing pot gets no hotter then 725degrees. That mixes everything well enough. I flux heavily with candle wax & sawdust. I stir with a old cast iron 1lb ladle, drawing the ladle inverted from bottom thru the lead and out above it. This helps to pull the impurities up to the top of the mix.

Haven't found any ZINC or other **** other then plain old dirt in any alloy I've bought from anybody on this Website.
I rest my ladles and skimmer against the side of the big pot for a minute or two before putting into the alloy pot.

I usually mix about 50-60lbs of alloy at a time. What the Dutch oven holds easily. I use the Manufacturers ingot molds to make/store alloy. I've collected about 20 or so over the last 45+yrs. I put a different alloy in each different manufacturers mold & use a LODGE Scone pan for range scrap as I find it melted/fluxed in ingot form for sale. It often comes in LYMAN ingot form or cornbread ingots, and I store my #2 alloy in Lyman ingots. I put pure lead in 1lb LEE ingots, tin in 1/2lb LEE ingots. OHAUS molds are used for pure LINOTYPE. And so on.
I use a ROWELL 4lb Ladle to pour lead alloy into the ingot molds.

I also strongly believe that everyone who ever casts any kind of lead projectile should have A LYMAN LEAD LADLE. It's the best design for casting into 1, 2, or 3 cavity molds and for fluxing a Bullet Casting POT. Either bottom pour or dipper casting. The LEE ladle works on a single cavity mold under 300grs, or as a skimmer for removing impurities in a 10lb or smaller pot.

Just my 2 cents worth of run on...

[weeple2000]

Appreciate the insight. I am able to grab range lead from my indoor range. There is a small independent tire shop nearby. I want to call them to inquire about wheel weights. I am not sure if my state still has lead in their wheel weights. I had to start somewhere. So I figured the beginning is the best spot.