Cast and shooting same day - cause leading?

[wwillson]

All,

I recently had an issue with leading so bad that I could barely see the rifling in the barrel of my 45ACP 1911. The bullets were Lee TL452-230-2R Microband cast from WW lead. I have cast many of these bullets with very good results and almost no leading. I found that if I loaded for about 16,000 psi or higher the leading almost vanished vs lighter loads. Last weekend I cast 300 bullets and loaded over 4.6g Titegroup. I went to the range and shot the whole 300 rounds. I noticed many flyers, but attributed them to 'a bad day'. I even did a barrel lead check and couldn't see much, but the range is very dark. When I got home I disassembled and WOW the leading was so bad I could scarcely see the rifling!!!

A couple of my shooting buddies who are 40 years to my senior and have been reloading for about 40 years said that casting and shooting the same day caused the leading. They said that the bullets will age-harden to a BHN of about 11 in two weeks to a month.

Are my buddies correct?

Thanks,

Wayne

(first post, been lurking for months!)

[dardascastbullets]

All,

I recently had an issue with leading so bad that I could barely see the rifling in the barrel of my 45ACP 1911. The bullets were Lee TL452-230-2R Microband cast from WW lead. I have cast many of these bullets with very good results and almost no leading. I found that if I loaded for about 16,000 psi or higher the leading almost vanished vs lighter loads. Last weekend I cast 300 bullets and loaded over 4.6g Titegroup. I went to the range and shot the whole 300 rounds. I noticed many flyers, but attributed them to 'a bad day'. I even did a barrel lead check and couldn't see much, but the range is very dark. When I got home I disassembled and WOW the leading was so bad I could scarcely see the rifling!!!

A couple of my shooting buddies who are 40 years to my senior and have been reloading for about 40 years said that casting and shooting the same day caused the leading. They said that the bullets will age-harden to a BHN of about 11 in two weeks to a month.

Are my buddies correct?

Thanks,

Wayne

(first post, been lurking for months!)

You did not state your actual load that you are experiencing the leading problems with nor did you state the actual load that you eliminated the leading problems with. That information would be helpful to diagnose your problem.

Obviously, your 'alloy' is inadequate for your application. Your 'alloy' is a potpourri of elements that you have no known concentrations. Have you been shooting this 'alloy' for the entire duration of this situation?

It is important to understand that an alloy needs to be of sufficient content to function properly. Wheel weights are notorious for lacking antimony which is where I suspect your major problem lies. Antimony provides the strength required for 'heavier' loads. Tin may be lacking also which will help in filling out the cavities producing a much higher quality bullet.

[runfiverun]

yes they are about the age hardening.
i have cast and shot on the same day before though, but not often.
if you want to see if there is really a difference. weigh just your bbl, then go shoot your normal load.
then weigh it[your bbl] again, you will see if it leads the same or not.
if they older ones shoot better, your bbl will weigh less then or the same as before.

[45nut]

Welcome aboard Cast Boolits Wayne.

[flinchnjerk]

Uhhh.....what lube were you using on those Tumble Lube boolits that allowed you to shoot them a couple of hours after casting them?

[Echo]

+1 with Flinchnjerk...

[Boerrancher]

As we talked about in the Chat Room last night Wayne, you had a lube failure due to the fact that your LLA was not given time to set up and harden. I have a feeling that most of it was burnt up when you pulled the trigger.

As a side note, this goes to show you the level of exp on this board, that 50% of those posting with regards to your question had a grasp on the problem before they knew all of the information. Which is really impressive.

Best Wishes from the Boer Ranch, and welcome aboard,

Joe

[wwillson]

Uhhh.....what lube were you using on those Tumble Lube boolits that allowed you to shoot them a couple of hours after casting them?

I was using Lee liquid alox. I was in the chat room last night and everyone pretty much agreed that this was a lube failure and casting a shooting the same day contributed.

Wayne

[wwillson]

As we talked about in the Chat Room last night Wayne, you had a lube failure due to the fact that your LLA was not given time to set up and harden. I have a feeling that most of it was burnt up when you pulled the trigger.

As a side note, this goes to show you the level of exp on this board, that 50% of those posting with regards to your question had a grasp on the problem before they knew all of the information. Which is really impressive.

Best Wishes from the Boer Ranch, and welcome aboard,

Joe

I've been lurking here for months and have gathered a ton of information that helped me get started in reloading. I too have found that the level of experience here is just simply outstanding!

Wayne

[HABCAN]

Well, I guess you learned two things all of us 'experts' have 'always known' hunh? Like, ALWAYS let cast boolits age a minimum of thirty days? And, ALWAYS let LLA set up and harden a minimum of twenty-four hours? I wonder how WE learned that, LOL! Welcome Wayne!

[Pawpaw]

I don't always let them sit for 30 days, but I always let the lube dry. At least 24 hours, maybe 48 hours.

On the other hand, I have some cast bullets in the shop that's older than my youngest grandkid (about 8 months). I found a bunch of 405 grain .459 boolits that I cast, probably, 5 years ago.

But you're right. The level of expertise here is outstanding.

[dwtim]

I wonder what happens to propellant when it is contaminated with mineral spirits?

I do believe I'm going to experiment with that.

UPDATE: Well, in retrospect, that was pretty predictable. It makes the charge harder to ignite, but the added fuel makes it burn longer.

[runfiverun]

imr propellents are made with solvents, test away and post the results.
and wayne welcome to the site.