Transferring firearms after my dirt nap [Archive]

JimB..

07-08-2018, 11:06 PM

These situations require an understanding of the situation as well as the law. You could spend a small fortune making sure that she is legally able to do so, but if she is your only wife (no ex), the children aren’t likely to fight over things, there are no significant creditors, and the estate is worth less than the exemption then nobody is going to care and she’ll just act as if she has owned them all along. Get a template for a will from the internet, make sure it is for your state, and you’re probably good.

If you have $500k in firearms, a new wife that’s 30 years younger than the old model, and children that are unhappy about how you dumped mom, well then you need a lawyer...a good lawyer.

smokeywolf

07-08-2018, 11:16 PM

So, you write down who gets what, with descriptions and serial numbers and I'm assuming this gets filed with the County Recorder's Office. I've never thought about this kind of gun registration before.

Bazoo

07-08-2018, 11:53 PM

The only thing that will have any bearing after you're pushing up daisies, is if you know Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior. Nothing else will matter after that.

bangerjim

07-09-2018, 08:30 AM

Best thing is a living trust. You can generate it while alive, amend it easily anytime because you are the trustee, and it lays out exactly what goes to whom. You still need a will. The trust is an extension with much greater security. Wills many times still end up in probate and most of your stuff will go to the government and lawyers. A will can easily be contested and broken. Not so much with a living trust.

You can get a will and trust from legalzoom.com for a reasonable price. My son just did one of theirs and I compared it to my $5K trust and it was relatively close.

bangerjim

rfd

07-10-2018, 06:50 PM

David2011

07-18-2018, 05:41 PM

We all need to prepare in advance. After the recent unexpected death of my aunt we saw how badly a family member can behave. The wife of one of her sons was executrix (same as throwing gasoline on a fire) and the two of them swarmed her house and took everything they wanted without regard to even sharing with his brother. At this point the badly behaved brother/cousin and his wife are completely estranged from our already very small family. I probably need to start thinning my inventory. I have a broad mix of firearm types, some not anything special and some that are desirable. I have few relatives to pass them on to so I hope I can use GhostHawk's suggestion and at least pass on a few desirable items. If I have the opportunity as I get older I'll sell the rest off and pad the retirement fund.

07-18-2018, 11:26 PM

My wife can sell and do what ever she wants to with my stuff I will not need it any longer and she is my wife because I trust her besides only my boys know how to get into the safes lol.

mold maker

07-20-2018, 07:18 AM

A will is just a piece of paper like a death certificate, but one is binding.

popper

07-21-2018, 08:50 PM

Typically a trust needs to be signed and sealed/stamped by a notary. They record the stamping and it is a court legal document.

Texas by God

07-22-2018, 09:15 AM

My father is 88. Several years ago he divided up the farm amongst his five children except for 2 acres and his house. He also split up his small gun collection, keeping a revolver, a .22 rifle, a Marlin lever action, and a single shot 20 gauge to keep house with. Mom passed 5 years ago. I love my smart father.

rfd

07-22-2018, 09:20 AM

Geezer in NH

07-26-2018, 05:40 PM

A will becomes a court order.

popper

07-26-2018, 07:11 PM

IF they 'find' it. They are not recorded.

Elkins45

07-27-2018, 02:33 PM

IF they 'find' it. They are not recorded.

No, but if you leave a copy with the person who benefits most then there’s a pretty good chance it will come to light.

dh2

07-27-2018, 05:31 PM

My Wife don't shoot much so when I was ask the same question, I told her consign them out with a dealer friend,

tradbear55

07-28-2018, 07:28 PM

When I die, I won't worry about anything anymore. My wife can do what she likes with my guns. I have no children to leave them to. Although in my state when you pass the guns belong to your estate. Whoever probates the estate becomes the owner of my property if my wife would pass before me.

lcclower

07-29-2018, 12:49 PM

My crashing, unabated gun and gear (and fishing tackle, and fly tying...you get the idea) habits have left me with a pile of stuff, my thought on the subject is to write down the provenance, the experiences associated with each piece and then pass them around now. That's a work in progress.

GoodOlBoy

07-29-2018, 05:52 PM

Tell her whatever she does don't sell them for what you TOLD her you paid for them :p

God Bless, and One Love

GoodOlBoy

Southern Son

07-31-2018, 05:07 AM

Wifey asked me if she will be able to sell my firearms if I was to kick off.

I need a will

Mine asked me if she could sell my guns after she smothered me in my sleep...…..

I think I need a guard.

alamogunr

07-31-2018, 11:25 AM

After the last couple of posts, I'll try to get this back on track. Both my wife and I have wills, power of attorney for health care and power of attorney for financial matters. I'm too lazy to go get them and look up the actual description. Every one recommends a trust. I've decided not to have one drawn up.

As for guns, I'm starting to pull out various guns that haven't seen the light of day recently. I started giving them to my sons according to their interests. Last ones were a Sig P6 and a S&W .22 Kit Gun. The latter with a brick of ammo to get started with. The other son already has a Marlin .30-30 and I've already told him that a Ruger .22/45 is his. These were just the easy ones to decide to give away. The younger son is a Political Science/History professor so I'm sure he will end up with the mil-surps. The older son is the parent of our grandsons. They probably prefer the more modern guns. Either way, they can decide to sell them immediately or keep them after I'm gone or sell them then. It will be their decision.

Unlike so many, my sons are well enough off and get along well enough that they will not squabble over "stuff".

marek313

07-31-2018, 11:46 AM

seriously - i know this will sound frivolous and unthinkable, and totally not doable, but the best thing to do is leave jersey as soon as possible so you can live far freer and/or dirt nap in a state that truly has it's citizens at heart and not money or power or corruption or left wing socialist "progressive" agendas. the new and insane nj gun laws murphy just enacted are the tip of the iceberg for what's to come. this ship is going down. the wife and are making real plans for leaving asap ...

So many people are leaving NJ and I dont blame them at all. This state is getting crazy. High taxes and insurance and gun laws that suck. I already lost some friends that moved out to other states. My brother just bought a house in PA so maybe i should look there. I'm with you on getting out of NJ but as I'm sure you know, its not that simple.

Maybe one day though...... Its nice to dream. Have a small range in the back like Hicok45 ..... Man that would be nice :drinks:

RED BEAR

07-31-2018, 11:03 PM

Why ask just do it!

RogerDat

07-31-2018, 11:44 PM

One of the step-sons of my wife's aunt told her she was signing hospital papers to get pain medication when she was in the hospital with a broken hip. It was a power of attorney and he cleaned her out, and since she didn't allow him to have keys to her house he signed over title to her car to the house keeper and cleaned out the valuables in the house. Lawyer said simply put it would cost a fortune and take a lot of time to get the stuff back and would probably be a bit of a gamble to go to court. Might cost more than could be recovered.

In our case we plan on leaving some items to our kids but with possession staying with the surviving spouse. In the event one of us survives the other the surviving spouse will have possession of some items but ownership transfers to the specific kid for specific items. So when the surviving spouse decides to get rid of it or dies things end up with the child that owns them. So things go where we want them to go without either one of us having to strip items from the house after losing a partner.

Medical power of attorney and a few other things need to be addressed. One thing I suggest is looking to how your spouse or kids can divest themselves of components and supplies at a fair price. Not sure if any of the kids will set up for casting but I doubt it, and one or two might reload if the bench was still here.

Wayne Smith

08-01-2018, 07:41 AM

I believe it still is the only exception to the federal transfer act - inheritance. No federal transfer needed years ago, I don't know if that has been changed.

mcdaniel.mac

08-01-2018, 07:48 AM

I believe it still is the only exception to the federal transfer act - inheritance. No federal transfer needed years ago, I don't know if that has been changed.If you're dealing with NFA firearms, you have to do a Form 5 (nontaxed transfer) and it's usually expedited. For non-NFA firearms you're generally okay, but the guidance is to go and retrieve them in person and then mail them to yourself or transprt them yourself. Merely having a surviving spouse or coinheritor mail them to you would be a violation of the GCA still.

Firearms held in a trust may not have this issue since all trustees are co-owners. IANAL, and a consult with a trust lawyer would verify that

DocSavage

08-01-2018, 08:31 AM

I've given a list of what I have to 2 friends and with the exception of 1 firearm that's to be sold they get to split the collection including all my reloading equipment,components and casting equipment. They won't have to worry about brass for a couple of lifetimes. As for the rifle a Sharps long range express with an RHO period piece Malcolm style adjustable rings and mounts I figure it should fetch a fair sum.

RogerDat

08-01-2018, 11:08 AM

The firearms have people they should go to. However my wife can decide when she wants to part with them. And the kids can decide if they would rather have them secured at our house than at theirs.

Components in terms of ready to reload along with mold in that caliber and dies to reload go with firearms. The stash of bulk lead will mostly be sold, just keeping the already mixed alloy for the kids to use if they want. My wife will probably be able to pay for lawn care for as long as she lives at the house if the rest of the stash was sold. That is where having friends you can trust that know casting and reloading comes in. One problem is wife keeps saying "why don't you sell that lead now so we don't have to do yard work" she is sweet, a good cook, but man she has some crazy notions sometimes.

In Mich. you need to take your inherited handguns down to the sheriff's office for a "safety check" which is really registration by another name. Not sure of the specifics of legal requirements but I know a friend who inherited his fathers firearms did that, and pretty sure it is mandatory for the handguns.

higgins

08-01-2018, 01:18 PM

There are exceptions to the usual transfers for inheritance transfers.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom-may-unlicensed-person-transfer-firearms-under-gca

10x

08-02-2018, 08:49 AM

You should have a will designating heirs and an executor named in the will who will dispose of your property as per the terms of the will.
If it all goes to your spouse - name her executor and heir.
If you name a third party as executor, the executor has a legal obligation to dispose of property as per the terms of the will.

Not having a will can be very complicated and sometimes expensive if legal issues arise.

rl69

08-02-2018, 09:07 PM

Not knowing nj law I can't say for sure. I would assume that first the wepons would have to be transferred into her name. The she would have to go threw a dealer?

Texas is much easer,my wife would be free to sell our wepons to anyone she pleases, without any red tape. The only exception would be that she would have to go threw a ffl dealer to sell a pistol out of state

facetious

08-03-2018, 03:02 AM

I had a friend years ago that had alot of top end guns and some full auto stuff. He told me he had it set up that if any thing happened to him that he had all the papers and stuff all set so that a dealer he knew could handle the transfers and sales.

mold maker

08-03-2018, 10:46 AM

A will becomes a court order.

Unless it's contested. Then the state settles it, and they couldn't care less except they get their share.

Moonie

08-03-2018, 06:26 PM

Hopefully she sells them for more than you told her you paid for them lol... :kidding:

rl69

08-03-2018, 06:52 PM

let her die first proublem solved

Geezer in NH

08-03-2018, 07:26 PM

My son gets all Guns, and gun gear, hunting gear per my WILL. Wife gets life estate of our home on my 1/2, Son gets to live there per my WILL. Son receives my 1/2 when the wife dies.

Lawyer and Tax guy has copies of both. Will is self proving and final per NH law.

lightman

08-04-2018, 08:41 AM

I've had a will for a long time and on the advice of my financial adviser have recently set up a trust. This includes power of attorney for medical and financial. I have a list of my guns with serial numbers, descriptions and accessories. The ones that I inherited or were gifted to me have that noted as well.
I have an additional note with the will offering advice on what to do with my lead and brass stash. Don't laugh, dealing with both will be something of a job!

bob208

08-06-2018, 10:44 AM

check if there is a auctioneer that specializes in guns. we have one nere me I already talked to him so that is one thing taken care of. he advertises on line and takes phone bids plus has his own ffl. so he does transferees right there the day of the sale.

for anyone interested it is Redding's auction service. in Gettysburg pa.

oldlongbeard

08-06-2018, 02:35 PM

The $$ you spend now on the revocable trust will pale in comparison to what Probate will eat up. My sister works in probate. She tells everyone she knows that the revocable trust is an I.Q. Test, unless you want the gubmit to take WAY more when you’re gone....and chance that some relative may try to do things differently than your wishes. DO IT NOW.

Land Owner

08-07-2018, 04:15 PM

Another poster, in another thread, on another board, asked what he could do with his armory, in his prime, with heirs, but no heirs of the shooting persuasion. Maybe not your case, but simply "leaving them to the wife" just speaks of inconsideration. She is going to have her hands FULL with emotions, loss, loneliness, depression, insurance, paperwork, wills, attorneys, trusts, family, stocks, bonds, probate, bank accounts, credit cards, disposal of your personal effects, clothes to donate, a garage to unpack, a closet to clean out, the storage shed full of "stuff", power, water, sewer, electric bills to pay, and all the while continuing to run and keep a household for herself.

And many of you want to leave her to dispose of your guns and gear? With strangers? Strangers with guns? Does she shoot? Does she reload? Does she cast? Does she have a CLUE what you have amassed? Will she know where to go to find the right price to ask??? Will she be swept away by the Flea Market mentality of the Buying Public offing peanuts on the dollar for high value guns? Do you want HER to make these decisions at that time in her life in dealing with your absence?

I suggest that you SELL THEM NOW. Maybe a few at a time, the same way you acquired them. Sell them to the gun lovers on THIS FORUM, or another forum of your choosing. Sell them for what you PAID FOR THEM. Get your money back - or nearly so - less the fun you had in loving them though your own hands while you used these tools. Do not leave your guns to be sold to just "anybody" after your death. SELL THEM TO US. WE LOVE GUNS (and I am NOT BUYING. I am selling mine for the same reasons I am offering to you)!

Folks here can be assured to take GOOD CARE of your stuff as their newly acquired purchases. Take the money and buy the two of you a FIRST CLASS VACATION (something to talk about for the rest of your lives together), and the wife some brand new JEWELRY, and SPEND EXTRAVAGANTLY on the two of you while you are ALIVE!!! Turn your guns and gear into MONEY and SPEND, SPEND, SPEND, cause you cannot take it with you...or leave the Mrs. with a nest egg for after you are gone. She can live it up with that "guy next door" that you always wondered about.

higgins

08-07-2018, 08:31 PM

I recently attended the estate auction of a shooter who had accumulated about as much stuff as I have. The guns sold for reasonable prices for the buyers (I don't know what the widow paid the auctioneer). The reloading tools, presses, some powder, a bunch of brass, bullet moulds, sizing dies, etc. sold for yard sale prices. I had to restrain myself to not bid on some tools that would have ended up being duplicates to what I already have.

One reason I was able to resist was because I've made a decision to not buy anything until I run out of it, and to not buy any more tools unless there's a good reason. Better to sell your stuff to friends at good prices for them (or give it go them if they're close friends) than to wait for strangers to buy it in box lots at your estate sale. If the auctioneer puts the box lots together you can rest assured the sizing dies to the lubrisizer will go in a box with the shotshell wads, and the MEC charge bars will go in a box with misc. pistol brass and rifle bullets.

alamogunr

08-07-2018, 09:41 PM

Land Owner

08-08-2018, 11:03 AM

I have one (1) triple level tackle box that is filled with lube sizing dies, top punches, shotgun chokes, gun cleaning gear, and a plethora of small miscellaneous rifle, pistol, and reloading items. The cost of everything in that box is on a spreadsheet, which Talley is MORE than $1,000.00, Retail. I could envision in my untimely estate someone picking that whole tackle box up for $50.00 (or less). I have told the Spousal Unit that the tackle box is WORTH a whole HEAP (more than $1K) and to first look at the spreadsheets for value before she does ANYTHING in the event of my untimely death. I need to staple a printout of those spreadsheets (and those of my Inventory) to my Last Will (just in case).

I am executor of my Hunting Partner's estate, which is both a Trust (house and properties) and a lot of unspecified accounts requiring probate. The estate is already over $4K through the Court to the Probate Attorney, and the end is not yet in sight.

Geezer in NH

08-09-2018, 06:01 PM

Being the one my Father picked to be the executor of his estate I can tell you the court is the final and only way it happens.

It all belongs to the estate. Nothing gets done without the permission of the court. His was a simple estate that took 1 1/2 years after he died. I wish he made the lawyer his executor rather than me.

It divided the family that I could not believe. NO matter what I did was wrong by them. Now family I was very close to are gone. So much for family it seems MONEY is the divider nowadays.

Sister died hating me as her baby was denied to live in gramps house with his wife and 30+ cats and ferrets. He is somewhere in drug induced dementia but who cares Now the spawn of the sister thinks nothing of us.

Let the lawyers handle it I do not care what it costs the estate it is not worth it.

Thin Man

02-08-2022, 06:41 AM

Three years ago I lost along time friend who was a firearm and ammo collector. He treasured 1911s and Lugers above everything else but had a wide variety of very good quality firearms, along with 7 NFA items. He had drawn up his will through a local attorney but was still making changes to it when he passed. End result- he passed without a binding will signed and active. He was divorced and had no children, so in this state (TN) his estate went to his only living relative which was his sister. This is what he wanted anyway so that part of the settlement was easily established. She had no idea what any of the firearms and ammo were, or worth. I created an inventory schedule for her with approximate market values. All sales were completed through a local FFL shop with actual sales advertised and marketed by an auction company that is familiar with firearm sales. Everything went smoothly, except for the NFA properties. The sister thought they were worth much more than the offers coming in and it took a while to move them to an SOT dealer who took the entire lot. The inventory and sale were burdens but he and I trusted each other enough to offer each other this work for the one who passed first. The sister inquired why I did not accept any payment from her for my work, and why I did not bid on the items at the auction. My quick answer was that he and I agreed to assist the other's remaining family and it was my intent to do as I have a "make a promise, then keep a promise" approach to these friendships. Guess this is a story about personal honor. It has no price tag attached to it.

Froogal

02-08-2022, 10:54 AM

We've got sons, sons in law, grandsons, grandsons in law, and even a great grandson. When it is time to disperse of my guns, we'll just let them have their choice.

RickinTN

02-08-2022, 07:35 PM

A will only becomes a court order if it requires probate. A will can be written to avoid probate. An attorney in your locale is worth every penny spent.
Good Luck to you,
Rick

PS. I agree to give them to family and such before your passing if that is where you want them to go. You may be able to enjoy them with the recipients.
Rick

NY_Treeguy

02-09-2022, 10:18 AM

Just went through this when Dad died 2 years ago. He was a NJ resident. As NJ does not have handgun permits, just purchase permits and FAID cards, guns can be legally passed on to any family member with a FAID card. If your wife has one she can legally posses with no paperwork. At that point she is the owner and can sell as is legal in NJ.

RickinTN

02-09-2022, 11:32 AM

I keep reading here how much probate costs. I have been the executor of two estates. Relatively modest ones at that but I don't remember any government entity getting anything except the Chancery Court Clerk getting a small fee for registering the wills. Both cases were in Tennessee. I don't know how the laws differ in other states.

In both cases I took a 5% fee because of the time I had to take off from work and all the driving involved since the deceased were not local. The lawyer also was paid but I don't recall how much, only that I didn't consider it exorbitant.

Hello There John,
It seems we are neighbors so Howdy neighbor! I too have probated a will in Marshall County, Tennessee and the cost of the court was minimal. It actually was a simple process. However, in Davidson county, Tennessee (Nashville), and maybe others, the rules of the court now require hiring an attorney to probate a will. The cost, as you can see I'm sure then goes through the roof. Most wills will waive an accounting but any attorney is going to do a full accounting, even if there is only one heir, in order to run up the hours. It then becomes an expensive situation.
Rick

alamogunr

02-09-2022, 12:43 PM

Hello There John,
It seems we are neighbors so Howdy neighbor! I too have probated a will in Marshall County, Tennessee and the cost of the court was minimal. It actually was a simple process. However, in Davidson county, Tennessee (Nashville), and maybe others, the rules of the court now require hiring an attorney to probate a will. The cost, as you can see I'm sure then goes through the roof. Most wills will waive an accounting but any attorney is going to do a full accounting, even if there is only one heir, in order to run up the hours. It then becomes an expensive situation.
Rick

Rick, I'm way over here in Crockett county in West Tenn. We have two sons in Middle TN, one in Sumner county, the other in Williamson county. I'm hoping to pare down as much as possible by giving them most of the guns, reloading equip and casting stuff in advance. Not too sure whether the casting stuff will be welcomed as they are not as inclined in that direction as I am.

I'm pretty sure that being an executor around here will be fairly simple and inexpensive. I may have to appoint someone local to avoid them having to travel here often. I'm hoping that if I can appoint both they can share duties without both having to be present each time an executor is required. It has been awhile since we set up wills, powers of attorney and living wills, so may have to consult with another attorney about some of these questions. Also want to enquire about trusts. Don't think we need one but would like to be sure.

Up to now haven't thought too much about our "estate". Actually, thought we had too little to call it an estate. Amazing how things add up as you get older, owe very little except month to month credit card bills and are not sure that you will ever need to buy a new car or truck. Net worth would probably surprise most people if they went through the process to add it all up.

alamogunr

02-09-2022, 12:59 PM

Hello There John,
It seems we are neighbors so Howdy neighbor! I too have probated a will in Marshall County, Tennessee and the cost of the court was minimal. It actually was a simple process. However, in Davidson county, Tennessee (Nashville), and maybe others, the rules of the court now require hiring an attorney to probate a will. The cost, as you can see I'm sure then goes through the roof. Most wills will waive an accounting but any attorney is going to do a full accounting, even if there is only one heir, in order to run up the hours. It then becomes an expensive situation.
Rick

Rick, I'm way over here in Crockett county in West Tenn. We have two sons in Middle TN, one in Sumner county, the other in Williamson county. I'm hoping to pare down as much as possible by giving them most of the guns, reloading equip and casting stuff in advance. Not too sure whether the casting stuff will be welcomed as they are not as inclined in that direction as I am.

I'm pretty sure that being an executor around here will be fairly simple and inexpensive. I may have to appoint someone local to avoid them having to travel here often. I'm hoping that if I can appoint both they can share duties without both having to be present each time an executor is required. Right now my wife will be executor if I pre-decease and I will be if she does.
It has been awhile since we set up wills, powers of attorney and living wills, so may have to consult with another attorney about some of these questions. Also want to enquire about trusts. Don't think we need one but would like to be sure.

Up to now haven't thought too much about our "estate". Actually, thought we had too little to call it an estate. Amazing how things add up as you get older, owe very little except month to month credit card bills and are not sure that you will ever need to buy a new car or truck. Net worth would probably surprise most people if they went through the process to add it all up.

15meter

02-10-2022, 08:25 PM

The more you lay out in advance the better it is for all involved. My dad died in 2012 with a solid well written trust in place that basically put everything at the disposal of my mother if she need the financial funds. My mother survived until July of 2020 and there were still assets in my dad's trust and she had assets of her own held in an identical trust.

I was the executor of both and I thank my lucky stars that everything was written out as specifically as it was. I have 3 sisters, one that accused me of using a "disreputable" (my broker) broker.

One that ignored my instructions on how and when to dispose of personal effects and generally made it harder than it should have been.

The third one is so mad at me, my name is not allowed to be spoken in her house. She and her husband are absolutely convinced that I ripped them off, even though every move I made was with consent of the lawyer I hired to oversee the estate.

Didn't matter that the lawyer was her nephew that she likes, and in addition, we were working with a CPA to make sure the taxes were handled properly.

Even with the both trusts in place there is a tremendous amount of animosity aimed at me.

Without the trusts in place I suspect the sisters would have wasted half the estate on lawsuits against me.

I'm not convinced that I am out of the woods yet. I still have concerns about being sued personally just for spite.

I still have to file taxes for 2021 because there was real estate sold in 2021. After that I have to distribute what is left over after paying the taxes/legal/accounting fees.

If I make it through 2022 with out a trip or two before a judge, I'll be happy.