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lead chucker
04-29-2018, 10:30 PM
Where I live there are no willow trees. We have ***** willow I believe its called. Its a bush but some of the branches are an inch or better in diameter. Ive been using pine and it seems to work pretty good. I have read that willow is the best. I would think you would have to peel all the bark off and let it dry before making charcoal.

mooman76
04-29-2018, 10:44 PM
You have Diamond Willow there.

lead chucker
04-30-2018, 01:51 AM
Not where i live. We have the willow with the little fuzzy buds on them

Tatume
04-30-2018, 07:35 AM
Many woods will made acceptable charcoal. In South America they use palm trees, which technically aren't even wood.

Fly
04-30-2018, 11:23 AM
Peel the bark & try it. If you have any big leaf maple as they do in the great north west that
would be your best choice.

Fly

Outer Rondacker
04-30-2018, 11:26 AM
We have weeping willows here.

redhawk0
04-30-2018, 12:05 PM
I have Pu$$y Willow on my property too....but haven't tried it yet. I have access to Tree of Heaven and Black Willow so I've only been using those. I would think the heavy woody part of the Pu$$y Willow tree (bush) would work just fine.

redhawk

Eddie2002
04-30-2018, 01:38 PM
Looks like I have Carolina Willow growing around here. They are invasive and pretty much a weed tree or bush. Also have a stand of bamboo on the southern end of the property that needs to be cut back. Just one stalk of bamboo is over twenty feet long and as thick as my thumb, that's going to make a lot of charcoal. Going to give both the willow and bamboo a try if I ever get around to it.

Ballistics in Scotland
04-30-2018, 01:44 PM
Where I live there are no willow trees. We have ***** willow I believe its called. Its a bush but some of the branches are an inch or better in diameter. Ive been using pine and it seems to work pretty good. I have read that willow is the best. I would think you would have to peel all the bark off and let it dry before making charcoal.

Ah, the feline kind of willow. I think it is probably about as good as any other kind of willow, which used to be one of the main woods for the purpose. Pine is just so easy and so plentiful that there has to be a snag somewhere, and I think it is probably its resinous nature. With any kind of wood it is important to get rid of the bark which is liable to cause flying sparks. That could be very important on a range where powder will be exposed, but in metallic cartridges it would just dilute the productive part of the charcoal.

Fly
04-30-2018, 03:17 PM
Black willow has always been the stable of willows. But I think most will work. The post about Tree of Heaven is spot on. Many are very high on it too.
Don't just use any wood for you will waste a lot of chemicals & time. Believe me I know as many others, BP has been made since the 1400,s & you
& I or not going to reinvent the wheel. Use what is proven. Problem with pine is it burns nasty dirty. I used it in my fireworks
but not in my fire arms.

Fly

redhawk0
04-30-2018, 03:27 PM
Ballistics in Scotland....I believe you're correct. I think part of the problem with using pine is the pitch resin as you mentioned. Those resins produce a heavier greasy soot left behind so a lot more contamination needs to be cleaned up. Pine makes for good BP don't get me wrong...but it will require more cleanup, more often if used as you're carbon base. I just know I want to stay away from it.

redhawk

Harter66
04-30-2018, 03:31 PM
Grape wood and sweet gum are good too.

mazo kid
04-30-2018, 03:42 PM
I think nearly any clean burning soft wood would work. I have heard that Bass Wood is good too. Hard woods make good charcoal for grilling, but not so much for black powder. IMHO!

Fly
04-30-2018, 04:02 PM
Here we go again & again & again. Sorry but this always happens, when this thread is over you will be more confused then when it started.
(WINK) Fly

redhawk0
04-30-2018, 04:37 PM
Here we go again & again & again. Sorry but this always happens, when this thread is over you will be more confused then when it started.
(WINK) Fly

It could be worse...it could be 53 pages of thread to weed through like I did when I was getting started. I was so confused...but Fly...I still bow to you, the master of making BP. Your posts have always provided spot on recommendations and better results than most other contributors. There were a few others that provided good insight as well...but you stood out to me.

redhawk

Harter66
04-30-2018, 07:05 PM
Hurcules , in Hurcules Ca , used many , many acres of alder and the Confederacy even more cottonwood .
Did a little research myself .

Ballistics in Scotland
04-30-2018, 07:10 PM
I think nearly any clean burning soft wood would work. I have heard that Bass Wood is good too. Hard woods make good charcoal for grilling, but not so much for black powder. IMHO!

Certainly the woods recommended for the purpose are generally soft and light, while hardwoods aren't. I think the reason for the contrast between gunpowder and grilling is that the charcoals of hard and heavy woods are also hard and heavy, and while they contain plenty of energy, don't so easily break up fine enough to be in the most intimate contact with the other ingredients.

Fly
04-30-2018, 09:03 PM
Harter66 Alder is great wood. But yes cottonwood? I have the great book never want for powder. It is about the South during the Civil War &
the plant they built in Ga. Your spot on, they did use cotton wood. The north Black Willow & thats how they won? Just kidding. But that inspired me.
So I got some cotton wood & made some BP with it. After I took it from my ball mill I made a string of it on a ole board & lit it. POOF man that's
very fast.

So I corned it & made some 3fffggg powder. Took it to my range. First shot BOOM great I put more powder in then my patch & then started the
ball down. Dam I could hardly get the ball to start, but did. I had to clean it every shot. I took that batch of powder & used it for lift powder in
my fireworks. No kidding it was as dirty burning white pine. But it is fast. As I said maybe that is why the north won. (WINK).

Fly

lead chucker
05-01-2018, 12:27 AM
I will try pu$$y willow. Does it Have to be dry and aged before charing it? We have more alder around here than you can shake a stick at. Ha Ha get it. If alder is better than pine i could try it. The pine works good but it is dirty. If any one has tried alder i would like to hear how it works. I live in a remote part of Alaska so it can be hard to get what you need some times. Thanks for all the info guys.

Boz330
05-01-2018, 09:31 AM
I will try pu$$y willow. Does it Have to be dry and aged before charing it? We have more alder around here than you can shake a stick at. Ha Ha get it. If alder is better than pine i could try it. The pine works good but it is dirty. If any one has tried alder i would like to hear how it works. I live in a remote part of Alaska so it can be hard to get what you need some times. Thanks for all the info guys.

I made powder with CC made from willow that wasn't dried and it worked fine. If you have the time to dry it, good, but go ahead and make some just to get started and see what happens. None of the CC that I have made has been dried before processing. Of course ignorance might be bliss in this case.

Bob

pdgh59
05-01-2018, 05:56 PM
I have often thought of using old cricket bats that were made of willow. Probably not many cricket bats in the US.

Boz330
05-02-2018, 09:08 AM
I have often thought of using old cricket bats that were made of willow. Probably not many cricket bats in the US.

Probably not!

Bob

greywuuf
05-12-2018, 07:41 PM
Adler is used for smoking fish (and I think it tastes nasty ) and it seems to be extremely "greasy" and aromatic . I hope that it might just be in the bark ? As has been mentioned before there is LOTs of it up here in the north of Alaska.

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

dogrunner
05-17-2018, 01:42 PM
I will try pu$$y willow. Does it Have to be dry and aged before charing it? We have more alder around here than you can shake a stick at. Ha Ha get it. If alder is better than pine i could try it. The pine works good but it is dirty. If any one has tried alder i would like to hear how it works. I live in a remote part of Alaska so it can be hard to get what you need some times. Thanks for all the info guys.


Ye Gods............do we have to be so politically correct (properly sensitive, that is) that we spell "pu money money willow" that way?................Good Lord!!!


But, come to think of it, Jewfish ain't Jewfish anymore............Goliath grouper nowadays!

redhawk0
05-17-2018, 01:48 PM
Ye Gods............do we have to be so politically correct (properly sensitive, that is) that we spell "pu money money willow" that way?................Good Lord!!!!

If you wanna keep the forum police off your back you do.....sad isn't it.

redhawk

Wayne Smith
05-17-2018, 02:56 PM
Can't post about a ba$tard file, either.

flint45
05-17-2018, 03:13 PM
I like scrap popular I get from a wood shop. Political correctness is ruining this country and this forum.

Harter66
05-17-2018, 03:45 PM
I'm willing to bet you can't go off half cocked with pushywillow charcoal BP . Cockeyed sights make you miss a titmouse . Boobytraps are probably on the auto chop too . Remember a few yr ago after an upgrade when you couldn't call a 7.7 Arisaka by it's more common name 7.7 Jap ? I'm surprised we can still describe powder as black .

Eddie2002
05-18-2018, 03:42 PM
I got in trouble once at a job when I talked about a good pair of dikes (wire cutters). Just made some Carolina willow cc for my next batch. Seems that the willow cc is lighter than the red cedar cc I used for my first batch. Think I'll have some red skinned potatoes with dinner ;)

TheOutlawKid
05-30-2018, 03:12 PM
If you have red alder it works great. I actually made my best batch from it and it was clean and fast. Had sent some to fly for him to char and make a batch for himself, and he said he got close to Swiss velocities and that it too burnt clean. Red alder is found in the north west, I think it's found in Alaska too, maybe the southern region?

bigted
06-01-2018, 06:33 AM
We have groves of red alder here in north west Oregon , this red alder grows in tree form and a single tree of size will be 30+ inches across at the stump and close to 100 feet tall.

The alder that grows in alaska is bush form and the alder thickets up there remind me of the viney maple thickets here in north western Oregon. Cant hardly crawl through them. They grow about maybe 2 inch at the ground and hard to tell how long but im bettin it would make good CC tho.

Peel some ant retort it into charcoal and make a batch. Im bettin it do very well. Seems every area has some acceptable wood to make CC out of.

TheOutlawKid
06-01-2018, 01:14 PM
Yeah the red alder I got was from oregon a friend sent me, then I purchased some from amazon that's used for smoking fish, it worked just as great and it was bark free and cut into rectangular peices and cubes, almost board like. Very nice cuts. The next time I got some I had purchased 20 pounds of red alder charcoal and 20 pounds of willow charcoal from a gentleman who sells charcoal for a living. He did a great job, wasn't too expensive either. I had sent some of the wood and charcoal around to other people and they loved the red alder. It burns very clean and fast, others thought so too and one person chrono'd his batch and said it was making Swiss like numbers. Never used the other alder...but if it's fast growing and actually and alder then it just might be worth trying out.

lead chucker
06-03-2018, 02:19 AM
Thanks guys. I think I will try a batch of alder. Not sure what they call the alder we have here but its every where here. When im out at my cabin I burn a lot of spruce and hemlock in my wood stove. I save the big pieces of alder some of them four inches or better in diameter for stoking up the stove before bed. It burns hotter and lasts longer than hemlock or spruce.

lead chucker
06-03-2018, 02:29 AM
when the alder is seasoned it is actually really light weight. It grows fast and if you don't keep it cut back it will take over. It being a hard wood that grows fast it might work. I will try it and post my results. I cut some P willow earlier today and got it debarked split and drying in the furnace room. I figure I will let it dry for a while before I make some out of it.

TheOutlawKid
06-03-2018, 10:45 AM
You don't really have to let the wood dry out or season. I have never seen a difference in burn characteristics. They dry out in the retort before turning into charcoal, so I don't think it really matters. The end result is the same weather the wood has been seasoned or freshly cut. I know Hercules sporting black powder was made from red alder as well, but they also used willow and I think poplar. I know they used 3 types of trees and red alder and willow were for sure two of the three. With the characteristics you say your local alder has...I think it will work great. But I wouldn't waste any time seasoning it. Just shave the bark and toss it in your retort.

mold maker
06-03-2018, 12:59 PM
The advantage of using green wood is the bark peels off much easier. Seasoned wood takes only a few minutes less to char.

Fly
06-04-2018, 10:47 AM
Alder is very good wood. The Swiss use Euro alder.

Fly

bigted
06-04-2018, 10:08 PM
read somewhere that someone used or uses green wood that is harvested in spring just after the sap begins to flow up the tree again. this is said to have the maximum sugar content which is GREAT in CC for black powder. who ever does or did this did not allow the tree wood to dry but rather debarked it and retorted it immediately to retain the most natural sugar in the CC.

Fly
06-05-2018, 09:20 AM
The Swiss let there alder dry for two years debarked. They make the best powder in the world.
You read so much on the net. So go figure why the Swiss do what they do. Threads like this
remine me of peeing on your powder to make it faster. Mmmmmmmmmm if that is so why not add more
KNO-3????


Fly

Eddie2002
06-05-2018, 04:36 PM
I think the most of the commercial BP companies dry the wood first just because of the extra energy required to cook off the moisture in green wood.

lead chucker
06-09-2018, 04:44 AM
This is all good info guys thanks. I got some P willow in the ball mill right now. I'm going to get some alder and try it now since you dont have to season it. I didnt know about the sugar in the spring thing. I figured that if the wood isn't seasoned that that would contribute to it burning dirtier. Ive been using pine boards. When i play with the cc it really soots up my hands. This P willow i have the cc is alot cleaner not as much residue on my hands. I dont know if that means any thing but the pine is dirty. Im having alot of fun with making BP. and it works. I noticed with using pine i always get a short delay with my flint lock. I dust got a inline vortec pistol has the 209 ignition. I will see if the pine works with that. I have a couple pound of it to burn up. I just brought a Knight 54 rifle back to life that hasnt seen the light of day for 20+ years. I need to get a good boolit for it maybe a Lee REAL 380 All i have for it right now is round balls and it has a 1-28 twist. I dont want to shoot sabots.

OverMax
06-10-2018, 11:16 PM
A bit confused?
commented (alder) is that the same as Box Alder?
Paper birch works well.

Although y'll my charcoal preference is Black Willow which happens to be imported from Oklahoma.

swamp
06-10-2018, 11:59 PM
So far I have used Willow and Tree of Heaven. Haven't tried the Tree of Heaven powder in a gun yet, but it flashes fast.

Friend gave me a good sized box of Tree of Heaven and I have a lot of it made into float. If someone would like to try it let me know. Next time he gets into Denver he tells me he has Alder for me.

Not sure which I enjoy more. The making or the shooting.

swamp

Boz330
06-11-2018, 09:13 AM
So far I have used Willow and Tree of Heaven. Haven't tried the Tree of Heaven powder in a gun yet, but it flashes fast.

Friend gave me a good sized box of Tree of Heaven and I have a lot of it made into float. If someone would like to try it let me know. Next time he gets into Denver he tells me he has Alder for me.

Not sure which I enjoy more. The making or the shooting.

swamp

I've had good luck with the Tree of Heaven, even took a White Tail with it and some squirrels in the trade gun.

Bob

TheOutlawKid
06-11-2018, 03:27 PM
Mr.swamp, I'd be interested in trying tree of heaven, I can even trade you some red alder if you'd like. I have it in wood or charcoal form. Overmax, the alder I use is red alder, it's a huge fast growing tree found in the north west. They use it a lot for smoking salmon, and Hercules brand sporting black powder used to use it. It makes a great black powder. Fast and clean.

swamp
06-11-2018, 05:43 PM
Mr.swamp, I'd be interested in trying tree of heaven, I can even trade you some red alder if you'd like. I have it in wood or charcoal form. Overmax, the alder I use is red alder, it's a huge fast growing tree found in the north west. They use it a lot for smoking salmon, and Hercules brand sporting black powder used to use it. It makes a great black powder. Fast and clean.


PM me and we can work out the details.
swamp

RogerDat
06-11-2018, 05:54 PM
Just for the record the words get blocked not for political correctness but by a bad word filter aimed at profanity. Most forums will have them, and most people use a sort of canned configuration and then possibly edit or make changes to it. So butt might not fly due to a custom edit on one forum where it isn't germane to the forum topic but it is ok here where stocks and such will be common item of discussion.

I expect all vbulletin powered sites have that filter as an option. If nothing else it helps prevent porn spam bots from posting what you can see on their web sites.

dondiego
06-12-2018, 06:31 PM
A bit confused?
commented (alder) is that the same as Box Alder?
Paper birch works well.

Although y'll my charcoal preference is Black Willow which happens to be imported from Oklahoma.

I have never heard of "Box Alder", but "Box ELDER" is a fast growing tree that is not very good for wood stoves but might make good charcoal. Common in Michigan.

OverMax
06-13-2018, 12:03 AM
"Box Alder", but "Box ELDER"I think? both are one in the same perhaps?

Like Mi. here too (MN) there are two types of alder. Box alder/elder is a medium size in height 40' shade tree grown in peoples back yards. A very soft wood. As prior commented "Useless for wood stoves."
The other alder is found in the forests growing in or quite near wet swamps. A clumped growing tree. Many use this stunted dark gray barked swamp alder for home meat smoking cabinets so I've read. {I never have.} Actually too small in trunk size for wood stove use >3~4 or 5" at best. Although quite unlike its 40' cousin >the shade tree. A old swamp alder is a 20' high leafy hard wood similar to white paper birch in texture and impervious to high wind.