FFL required??

[Pressman]

In going through my friends estate I found 47 Saturday night Specials. Bulldog, Forehand and Wadsworth ETC.
Some actually are functional, many are not. When the time comes to sell them does anyone know if an FFL transfer will be required?

With this many FFL's may get to be too big a headache and I'll just keep them, like I plan to do with his prized bottle of wine.

Please, no offers to buy now.

Thanks,

Ken

[texasnative46]

Pressman,

In todays' NUTTY (and increasingly FAR LEFT, i.e., FASCIST) environment in some places, I hate to say it but you need to consult a lawyer in YOUR jurisdiction.

yours, tex

[jdfoxinc]

See if they are on the C&R list.

[lefty o]

face to face in MN, at this time, no they dont need a transfer.

[KenT7021]

Depends location and age of the guns.Some are probably antiques.

[higgins]

Go to the FAQ section of the ATF website; it's very helpful. There are special provisions for estates and relatives. The antique angle is worth looking into also, if you can verify year of manufacture which may be difficult if they were made without serial numbers like .22s used to be.

[NoZombies]

If the gun is over 50 years old, a C&R is acceptable (whether on the C&R list or not) If it was made prior to 1899 no FFL of any type is required.

If the gun has no import markings or serial numbers (this is different than removed serial #'s which is a different subject entirely) it was made or imported prior to GCA'68. and would at least qualify as a C&R by this point.

[Outer Rondacker]

what he said.

[JimB..]

Before wasting time on the transfer issue I’d research the value of each. Assuming very low I’d put them in a box to sell at the next gun buyback.

[M-Tecs]

https://www.atf.gov/file/100871/download

What activities require a dealer’s license? Federal law does not establish a “bright-line” rule for when a federal firearms license is required. As a result, there is no specific threshold number or frequency of sales, quantity of firearms, or amount of profit or time invested that triggers the licensure requirement. Instead, determining whether you are “engaged in the business” of dealing in firearms requires looking at the specific facts and circumstances of your activities. As a general rule, you will need a license if you repetitively buy and sell firearms with the principal motive of making a profit. In contrast, if you only make occasional sales of firearms from your personal collection, you do not need to be licensed. In either case, all of your firearms transactions are relevant, regardless of their location; it does not matter if sales are conducted out of your home, at gun shows, flea markets, through the internet, or by other means.

[labradigger1]

Save them for a gun buy back. If they are old junky break top models you can usually get $50 each for them. No need to worry about a ffl either. I have done it.
47 guns would be a quick $2350.00

[mac60]

In going through my friends estate I found 47 Saturday night Specials. Bulldog, Forehand and Wadsworth ETC.
Some actually are functional, many are not. When the time comes to sell them does anyone know if an FFL transfer will be required?

With this many FFL's may get to be too big a headache and I'll just keep them, like I plan to do with his prized bottle of wine.

Please, no offers to buy now.

Thanks,

Ken

I'd do a little research before I tossed the term "Saturday night specials around". If they belonged to my buddy and I thought anything at all of him, I sure as hell wouldn't just sell 'em for whatever I could get.

[Petrol & Powder]

I'm not sure I understand the question.

Let's start by removing the emotional anti-gun label "Saturday Night Special" from the question.

Then let's just say the executor of the estate will need to dispose of some of the property contained within that estate. He can transfer that property in accordance with the will OR if the will directs that the property be sold and the proceeds are to be distributed; the executor shall take that path.

The question then becomes, "Can the executor simply transfer that property to the desired individuals"?
The property is owned by the estate, the executor is merely an agent. The executor is not in the business of selling firearms, he/she is merely distributing property in accordance with the will and the law. I think as long as the guns are transferred legally (not transferred to prohibited persons), in accordance with state law;... it matters little if the guns are gifted or sold.

If face to face transfers are permissible in that state, the executor can perform his/her duty in accordance with the will and probate law.
He/she will either give the guns to the required beneficiaries or he/she will sell the guns and transfer the proceeds to the estate.

[Petrol & Powder]

Allow me to add that all laws controlling the transfer of firearms apply.

Handguns cannot be transferred to residents of other states without going through a FFL.
The executor may transfer the guns in accordance with the state laws and the federal 1968 Gun Control Act.
The executor may transfer the guns to qualified, in-state residents.

[Blanket]

I would not sell a gun at a buyback on principle alone

[starmac]

I would think this all depends on the state, no ffl needed here, but in some states they are required, heck some states may not even allow them to be sold.

[M-Tecs]

MN allows face to face for residents on handguns. No FFL required unless you purchase them for resale. Than you are in business and need an FFL.

[MaryB]

Yes MN allows face to face WITH a permit to purchase!

[M-Tecs]

Yes MN allows face to face WITH a permit to purchase!

no permit required.
http://www.house.leg.state.mn.us/hrd/pubs/firearmsgd.pdf

Transfers Between Unlicensed Individuals: No Background Checks In contrast to the provisions governing sales by licensed dealers, there is no provision in federal or Minnesota law that requires background checks, record-keeping, or location restrictions for firearms transfers between private individuals who are not FFLs, other than certain federal law restrictions pertaining to acquiring or disposing of firearms across state lines.62

Exempted Transfers Federal law authorizes an unlicensed individual (a non-FFL) who is not a prohibited person to sell a firearm (handgun, rifle, or shotgun) to an unlicensed resident of his or her own state, as well as to loan or rent a firearm to a nonresident of the state for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, provided that:

(1) the transferor does not know or have reasonable cause to believe that the transferee is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under federal or state law; (2) the sale, delivery, and receipt fully comply with the laws of both states; and (3) the transferor and transferee meet in person to make the transfer.

Since these types of firearms transfers are not regulated by either federal or Minnesota law, they entail no legal requirements for background checks.

Federal law also provides that an unlicensed individual may sell or transfer a firearm to an FFL in any state, but is prohibited from transferring interstate to a licensed collector any firearm other than a curio or relic.63

18 U.S.C. §§ 922(a)(3) and (5); 922(b)(3); 27 CFR §§ 478.29; 478.30

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

In going through my friends estate I found 47 Saturday night Specials. Bulldog, Forehand and Wadsworth ETC.
Some actually are functional, many are not. When the time comes to sell them does anyone know if an FFL transfer will be required?

With this many FFL's may get to be too big a headache and I'll just keep them, like I plan to do with his prized bottle of wine.

Please, no offers to buy now.

Thanks,

Ken

The devil is in the details, I'm glad someone else mentioned the deal, if you are the executor of the estate, because I don't know that stuff. If you are not the executor, but these guns are now yours, I would keep them and after you have them for a period of time and decide you no longer want them, then selling them in a FTF transaction to a resident of MN is still legal without the need of a FFL...at least that's how I understand it.

[Thin Man]

Side note to all of the above - one man's junk is another man's treasure. I frequently see old, worn out, should be thrown away firearms (mostly handguns) brought to the shop. Their owners ask about getting them put back into shooting condition only because the firearm was originally owned by their great-great-great-grandfather's fourth wife's cousin, twice removed. These owners are as anxious to get their prize back into working order as every other customer seeking repair service. Don't dismiss these older handguns as worthless, several of them could bring in respectable money to be used as parts donors.

[RED BEAR]

I must agree with blanket on this would never sell a gun at a gun but back. Have thought about setting up and paying five dollars more than they do but figured I end up in jail even if it's Legal. Some of my and the wife's favorite guns are cheap ones. Wife loves rg 32sw that I paid $25 for my new favorite little plinking gun is erma ep25 that I had to go all out and spent a whopping 50 dollars for these are just plain fun to go plinking with.

[wills]

I would not sell a gun at a buyback on principle alone

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^This

[Bazoo]

If you decided you dont want to keep them, you might find a small time gunstore that would give you a reasonable price in either cash or trade for a "lot" of them. Then, if any of them happen to be used in a crime later on it cannot come back to you. I personally will sell F-F here in KY, but I wouldnt want to sell a box full of saturday night specials 1 at a time to whomever.

[Pressman]

A lot of great information here, thanks for the reply and help.

[MaryB]

Holler at me if you are going to sell...

[Tom W.]

Allow me to add that all laws controlling the transfer of firearms apply.

Handguns cannot be transferred to residents of other states without going through a FFL

OH OH. I'm gonna die and go to the hot place for selling a pistol FTF to a guy in Georgia. Y' all pray for me.

On a more serious note, the gunshop in Georgia has to send the pistol to an FFL here in Alabama for me to pick up. The same goes for internet sales.......

[Pressman]

Mary, gotcha covered. I am finally moving into the rebuilt house next Tuesday. It took what seemed like forever but it looks good.
Ken

[Wayne Smith]

OH OH. I'm gonna die and go to the hot place for selling a pistol FTF to a guy in Georgia. Y' all pray for me.

On a more serious note, the gunshop in Georgia has to send the pistol to an FFL here in Alabama for me to pick up. The same goes for internet sales.......

Except for antiques and C&R to a licensee. Sounds like all of these may qualify for one or the other. If you have a functioning 32 S&W PM me - only 50+ years old for C&R.

[Pressman]

Wayne, did you ever get the Tru Line Jr's from last summer?

[Wayne Smith]

Wayne, did you ever get the Tru Line Jr's from last summer?

Yes, but the UPS left the box out in the rain, it was broken and most of the small parts were gone. I did get one put together and am using it. The broken one is essentially useless. The bottom is the same as both the new and the old, and that is what is broken. If I can find a bottom piece (the cast piece) I could put it together, but then would need a turret because that was gone.

[Pressman]

That's really bad, there was enough parts to build a complete press. I really thought it was packed tight.
I am sorry.
Ken

[white eagle]

face to face in MN, at this time, no they dont need a transfer.

same here Wis.

[evoevil]

Depends on where you live, call a local lawyer

[wills]

My little rg 23 is one of my most useful guns.

[Thin Man]

I have a long-time appreciation for 32 caliber revolvers. From all my years of dealing with firearms I had never heard that RG offered a 32 caliber revolver, much less seen one. That must be a really neat package. I have several 32s by different brands and will usually look at another to add to the herd. A local shop has 2 S&W I-frame 32 revolvers. One looks close to unfired while the other appears ready to be a parts donor. The shop owner and I have been haggling over the price of these for about 5-6 years now - he will not sell them to anyone else until we come to a decision on these (they are stored in his office). Neither of us is in a hurry to end this discussion. We catch lunch together once every week or two. Lunch usually begins with discussion on whose turn it is to pick up the check, who paid our last time out, etc. Next we haggle over Mexican, Asian, or whatever flavor each of us is in the mood to find. Lunch discussions focus mostly on family activities, when and where either of us plan our next vacation run, and least of all business or trading.