Casting questions

[Outback32]

Hey guys I'm new to casting. I ordered 2 Lee 6 cavity molds. 357 and 44mag the 44mag works great the 357 I noticed small black specs in the cavity and I can't get them out at all. Also was wondering if anyone makes custom Lee sizing dies. I need a .432 does anyone make them thanks

[Rcmaveric]

Lee will make you custom sizing dies, but it has a long wait time. If the offer one that's larger but really close, it its pretty easy to open it up a little .001-.002. Worst case scenario check out NOEs push through sizers; the die body is slightly more expensive than a Lee, but NOE has the bushings that you can swap out that makes it cheaper in the muli-caliber long run.

For those black specs, i would cast with it. If the bullets drop good and pass the visual then i would not sweat the black specs.

[Outer Rondacker]

Welcome to the forum. Cast on do not let some little black spot stand in your way. Unless it affects the bullets coming out that is.

[Grmps]

Outback32 - welcome to CB If you decided to start casting to save money, forget it. You won't, you'll just shoot more.

+1 on NOE
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=104

Check with NOE, after the initial Push Through Size Die Body purchase ($39.95) the sizing die body bushings are $9.75 and the push rod $7.50 (that can be used with all bushings in the caliber. They have a much greater selection of sizes and theyu also have nose sizing dies
44Cal .432 Body Bushing (B432) $9.75

Casting boolits (lead bullets) properly is a science, once you know the basics, not a hard science.
There is a lot of good information on CB. The Google search (top right of every forum page) is a gateway to all the knowledge on this forum. IF you can’t find your answer there ask the question (Please be as detailed as possible, pictures help http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?344661-Capturing-amp-Posting-screen-shots I would be very surprised if there wasn’t someone on this forum that could answer ANY question you might have)
http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm
1. Boolits need to be cast .0005 to .003 over the slugged diameter of your barrel for accuracy and to avoid leading. If the fit is wrong nothing else will work right.
a. slugging a barrel (it is safer to use a brass rod or a steel rod with a couple of coats of tape to avoid damaging your barrel http://7.62x54r.net/MosinID/MosinSlug.htm
b. chamber casting https://www.brownells.com/guntech/cerrosafe/detail.htm?lid=10614
or pound casting http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?356251-Pound-Cast-instructions-(for-rifle-chamber)
2. the right alloy needs to be used for the velocity and purpose of the boolit (don’t fall into the trap of going with to hard an alloy
Economical way to easily test lead hardness
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?355056-Easier-pencil-lead-hardness-testing
https://i.imgur.com/TGUQsIe.jpg
Some alloys harden over time
http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_3_alloySelectionMetallurgy.ht m
different alloy’s different end sizes
https://i.imgur.com/emuBC2T.png?1
Lead alloy calculator
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=45784&d=1341560870
3. velocity the bullet needs to be pushed hard/fast enough to get the proper spin, have the proper velocity to accurately reach the target but not so hard as to be dangerous or strip the lead off in the grooves instead of spinning the boolit..
Powders range from fast to slow, you need to choose the right powder for your application.
Loading manuals list the best powders for certain calibers and boolit weights.
NEVER use any posted noncommercial load data without first checking to see if falls in the safe parameter for your firearm!! There are several firearms out there that can handle much higher pressures than others!!
Link to free online load data
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?337910-CB-load-data-online-sources

Chamber Casting:
Cerrosafe; Larry G
Pound cast down barrel ; good steel
Pound cast from back: Outpost75

[Outback32]

Well 3 of the 6 cavities drop fine on the 357. 3 of them have a death grip on the bullets. I lurked here and did the bullet with toothpaste. I haven't got to try it since then. I went the powder coat route. I just did hf red and I get minor leading in the first 2 inches of my barrel. My bullets are .433 to .434 my cylinder throats slugged. 432. Only thing I noticed is if I force a bullet through the cylinder some of the pc comes off.

[Outer Rondacker]

Sounds like your pc is not bonding well. Take a bullet you coated. Just the projectile and smash it with a three pound hammer just to see if the pc flakes off. You can toss the bullet back in the pot afterwards.

polishing should let the bullets drop better. I have one that gets hung up every now and then.

[Outback32]

That's the weird part I smashed 3 flat with a hammer. They didn't flake at all but by the time I force them through the cylinder it pulls some of the pc off. I'm going to try to recoat them. Since my cylinder sluggs at .432 should I size to .432. I have to hammer the the bullets through now. They measure .433 and .434 trying to decide on sizing to .431 or .432. Thanks for the help

[Wayne Smith]

Size to .432 if that is the size of your throats. I don't powdercoat so can't comment on that.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Well 3 of the 6 cavities drop fine on the 357. 3 of them have a death grip on the bullets. I lurked here and did the bullet with toothpaste. I haven't got to try it since then. I went the powder coat route. I just did hf red and I get minor leading in the first 2 inches of my barrel. My bullets are .433 to .434 my cylinder throats slugged. 432. Only thing I noticed is if I force a bullet through the cylinder some of the pc comes off.

Outback32,
welcome to the forum.
regarding new Lee molds (or actually any new mold), sometimes you just need to cast with a mold several times to work out the kinks...spinning a boolit in a mold cavity (AKA: Leementing) will likely help. I've had troublesome molds, and had to Spin a boolit several times (in each cavity) to get it where I was happy with it.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?189534-Lee-30-cal-2-cav-molds-not-necessarily-as-advertised&highlight=

[Outback32]

So far I've cast about 500 boolits with the 357. Do you guys think the leading in the 44 Is from the pc coming off. Thanks again

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I hope someone else can give you an answer regarding your PC and lead fouling.


But I will say ...while lots of people claim lots of success with PC, I am not a fan! I've been given many samples of PC boolits in three different calibers. I've loaded two of those calibers(both pistol) and had failure with both. Someday I will probably try the third set of samples, which are 30 cal for Rifle, and see how they work...but it's far far down on my "to do" list.

[Walter Laich]

respectfully to JonB, I am a powder coating fan

when I drive a bullet through the bore--don't use a wooden dowel for this, I sometimes see 'wear marks' in the lands markings of the bullet

can you post pictures of your bullets? that would help us

be sure you are actually baking them at 400° for 20 minutes as toaster ovens are infamous for their controls not being accurate

here is a cheap but accurate thermometer from wally world: https://www.walmart.com/ip/CDN-High-Heat-Oven-Thermometer-100-to-750F-Ovenproof-Durable-2-5-1-CM-Dial/22939643

they have several to choose from

Try Smok's powder, he is in the vendor section. Great products and best way to start: quality from the get-go

PCing is a bit of an art so keep trying--you can always give you bullets a second coat though I have never found that to be necessary

[Outback32]

Thank you I will look at his powder. I was going to order from Eastwood but il check smoks out. This site is great lots of good help. I will try to post pics

[EMR]

Thank you I will look at his powder. I was going to order from Eastwood but il check smoks out. This site is great lots of good help. I will try to post pics

I like smoke because you can get a three sample pack for around $20. And each sample bag will last a couple thousand rounds.


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[Outback32]

Can anyone tell me how too post pics

[Outback32]

I found it but it won't upload any pics off my phone

[Outback32]

I think I got it

[Yodogsandman]

Welcome to the site, Outback32!

The powder coating is making your bullet oversized so, why? Why not just tumble lube it as it's designed? Why cause the problem by adding a layer of PC that's .001"-.002" and then try to solve it?

[wmitty]

Welcome aboard! I have to agree with Yodogs. The pc is causing the oversize boolit. Tumble lube those and they will work great. Ben's LL is super!

[Outback32]

I may end up going that route. Time will tell I just like the looks of the pc bullets

[murf205]

You will find that Smokes powder makes the whole process easier and appealing to the eye as well. I have found that the Lee push through die metal is pretty soft, if you have a proven method of lapping by hand, to open them up. (Buckshot just got sick after hearing that) If you are having to pound a .432 through the cylinder throats, stop now! You shouldn't have to force a boolit through the throats, just a push by hand. That is probably where your powder coat is coming off. When you get your boolits to fit the throat and they are at least .001 over the barrel diameter, you will be on the right track. Powder coating or lubing are both fine, but fit is king. If you will order some pin gages from Meyer Gage, you will know exactly what you have. They sell pins individually for a couple of $ and they are invaluable to us wheel gun junkies. For the 44, I ordered .427 through .434. If you become fully addicted to this hobby the NOE push through sizer is the way to go. Welcome to the site, there are a lot of great people here with good advice and more than willing to help.

[murf205]

217140217138
i may end up going that route. Time will tell i just like the looks of the pc bullets
Me too! This is Smokes powder[ATTACH=CONFIG]217139

[Outback32]

I slugged the barrel .431.5. I have a powder coated bullet that measured. The same I can't push it through I have to tap it through.

[Dunkem]

I may be in the same boat as far as sizing goes. I measured my cylinder throats using a small telescoping gauge and a micrometer. All came out around .4325, I'm casting using a 429421 that is dropping at .429-.430. Then after PC'ing they are more like .434ish. I took a Lee .430 push through sizing die and with a 1/4 stainless steel rod split lengthwise on one end and chucked in an air grinder and a few wraps of 220 grit emery cloth so centrifugal force would apply outward force I made a few passes then pressed a slug through it and measured it. I repeated the process till they were coming out at .4315. Then I switched to 360 grit and repeated the process until I was getting slugs at .432. I then oiled the 360 grit and made a few passes to polish the inside of the die. The boolits sized through it will hold themselves in the cylinder throats but finger pressure is enough to get them to slide through. The entire process took me about a half hour, but I already had the tools on hand. I imagine something similar could be accomplished with a wooden dowel and a cordless drill, may take a little longer though. Kind of a long boring write up I know, but hopefully it helps you or somebody else out there that wants custom accuracy using things they may have already acquired.

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[Outback32]

I'm wondering why my cylinder slugged at .432 yet a .432 bullet won't push through it has to be tapped through. Does this mean I need to size to .431 or .432.

[Dunkem]

With both being exactly the same size with zero clearance it is basically a press fit. In my situation where most of my cylinders are at least half a thousandth over what I'm sizing my bullets and that is still enough to hold the bullet in place. But if your bullets and cylinders are both consistently .432 I would call that good. There are many different schools of thought on this subject ranging from .001 over throat diameter to a couple under and even .001-2 over groove diameter regardless of cylinder size. I guess at the end of the day, it's what shoots best for you.

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[Outback32]

I'm just trying to get a good fit. So I can eliminate leading

[Dunkem]

I guess if you want to go my route and lap out a die you could get the .430 Lee sizer and shoot some in that diameter and check for accuracy and leading. If you're not satisfied, open it up to .431 and shoot some more. If you're still getting leading you can open the die up to .432. Obviously that's the safe route because you can't tighten the sizing die back up if you go to far. Powder coating, if done correctly, should remedy allot of leading issues itself.

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[murf205]

I'm wondering why my cylinder slugged at .432 yet a .432 bullet won't push through it has to be tapped through. Does this mean I need to size to .431 or .432.

How did you slug your cylinder? Remember that if you use a good bit of force to push/pound the slug through the cylinder, you have resized the "slug" material. I don't mean to sound redundant, but the pin gages are the best indicators, just make sure the cylinder throats are clean.

[Outback32]

I used a lead egg sinker

[murf205]

I sent you a PM